So a nation like France is heralded for having one of the best health care systems in the world..

TruePaige

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Oct 22, 2006
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I have a few questions on a topic based around that. Answer them as you wish.

1) Who do you think has the best health care system in the world?

2) What makes their system the best?

3) Why don't we hire them to plan/implement a system for our nation?

4) Do you believe it would be wrong to contract out such a large job to another country?

Just a discussion to get some ideas on your thoughts.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
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the health insurance industry would never allow themselves to be obsolete. So I think the best care systems will be impossible.
 

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
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Originally posted by: JSt0rm01
the health insurance industry would never allow themselves to be obsolete. So I think the best care systems will be impossible.

True. It is a situation that is unlikely to exist, but a nation that has dealt with the transition / politics / support systems involve could provide everything necessary to set up a universal health care system.

Other countries let us build their weapons of war for them, why shouldn't we let them build our health care system?

Global trade reaches an apex through specialization. We are paying quite the opportunity cost here.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
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Personally I'm not too keen on the idea because I don't know the French word for priapism.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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Hard to farm out services, but if UHC is going to be I'd rather see it done by those with a track record instead of a bunch of politicians who have decided that legislating in advance of knowledge.

Hell I'll let the French pay me if they have a clue.
 

JSt0rm

Lifer
Sep 5, 2000
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Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Hard to farm out services, but if UHC is going to be I'd rather see it done by those with a track record instead of a bunch of politicians who have decided that legislating in advance of knowledge.

Hell I'll let the French pay me if they have a clue.

So you are for single payer? I thought you were against reform. I'm glad I was wrong.
 

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
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Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Hard to farm out services, but if UHC is going to be I'd rather see it done by those with a track record instead of a bunch of politicians who have decided that legislating in advance of knowledge.

Hell I'll let the French pay me if they have a clue.

Well not the actual health care services, but here are things I think could be farmed out and actually done better without lobbyist / interest group pressure.

1) Billing Systems
2) Prescription Rate Negotiation
3) Patent Reform (if deemed necessary)
4) Identification Systems
5) Referral Guidelines
6) Tort Reform (if deemed necessary)
 

PJABBER

Diamond Member
Feb 8, 2001
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Originally posted by: JaYp146
In before someone bashes the French military.

Great one liners about the French military.

Go wild.

Disclaimer: Some years ago I was in Calvi and got into a drinking contest with a couple company commanders and senior NCOs of the 2e Régiment Étranger de Parachutistes. They did not win, but I definitely felt defeated the next morning. Only the officers were French, so I feel vindicated. This post is my revenge. Non, je ne regrette rien.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
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Originally posted by: JSt0rm01
Originally posted by: Hayabusa Rider
Hard to farm out services, but if UHC is going to be I'd rather see it done by those with a track record instead of a bunch of politicians who have decided that legislating in advance of knowledge.

Hell I'll let the French pay me if they have a clue.

So you are for single payer? I thought you were against reform. I'm glad I was wrong.

I'm against forcing something through without due consideration. What we have proposed is legislation in advance of an open and thoughtful process to determine what may be done and how. Because of this, I strongly oppose the government inserting itself when it has no idea what's going on.

I'm not married to any system. Health care has problems, and I'm all for examining the possibilities, however to make an analogy, how stupid would it be to mount an armed campaign without knowing what the situation is? Would you want to risk your life to leaders who won't even consider the possible outcomes of their orders? No, you would not. Likewise peoples lives will be affected by this for good or ill.

Would you send your men into battle with nothing than a plan that says "fight the enemy, and here is a thousand pages of documentation, but we don't have any information on what it really means?"

Hell no you would not.

Since lives are going to be forever affected by this I want it right. If people thing it's hard to get this in at all, you're going to be astounded how hard it's going to be to change.

As I've been saying, I won't sign off on a pig in a poke. Show me something well examined and thought out by experts who actually care for people, then it's another thing entirely.

That's not the same as wanting no reform at all.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
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Originally posted by: Patranus
Yet do world leaders travel to the USA or France for their health care?
If you have the money we have the best Medical Care that money can buy. The problem is the vast majority of Americans don't have that kind of money or an HMO that will be willing to part with that kind of money.

 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,697
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Originally posted by: Patranus
Yet do world leaders travel to the USA or France for their health care?

It is the exception that World Leaders travel to the US for HealthCare. Your Hyperbole is strong.
 

TheSkinsFan

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May 15, 2009
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How about if we let a bunch of smart Americans study the systems that work, learn from and analyze the mistakes in said systems, and then apply some limited changes to our own existing system to make it better?

Yeah, I like my idea instead.
 

TruePaige

Diamond Member
Oct 22, 2006
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Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
How about if we let a bunch of smart Americans study the systems that work, learn from and analyze the mistakes in said systems, and then apply some limited changes to our own existing system to make it better?

Yeah, I like my idea instead.

Yeah, we know you hate any idea that involves UHC and actual change.

You could just post a "..." and I could fill in the words for you.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
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Originally posted by: TruePaige
I have a few questions on a topic based around that. Answer them as you wish.

1) Who do you think has the best health care system in the world?

I don't know. I've seen info on mny but don't know whch is best.

2) What makes their system the best?

Some are too expensive, others underfunded. I'd like one that's universal, single-payer, while ensuring the continued R&D in the industry and high quality.

However, we may need to have some limits as extremely expensive minimally beneficial services are invented.

3) Why don't we hire them to plan/implement a system for our nation?

4) Do you believe it would be wrong to contract out such a large job to another country?

I could see using them in a consulting role, but there's no reason our government can't do this.

The obstacles are the politics of protecting special interests, not knowing how.

 

Phokus

Lifer
Nov 20, 1999
22,994
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Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
How about if we let a bunch of smart Americans study the systems that work, learn from and analyze the mistakes in said systems, and then apply some limited changes to our own existing system to make it better?

Yeah, I like my idea instead.

Yeah, after researching, they'll just suggest adopting the french system, but then politicians would never do that because conservatives are imbecile Francophobes. ZOMG, FRANCE? NO WE COULD NEVER ADOPT ANYTHING FROM THEM!!!
 

Balt

Lifer
Mar 12, 2000
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Originally posted by: Patranus
Yet do world leaders travel to the USA or France for their health care?

Yes let's take less than .00001% of the Earth's population and use them as the example for the effectiveness of our health care system.
 

brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
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Originally posted by: Phokus
Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
How about if we let a bunch of smart Americans study the systems that work, learn from and analyze the mistakes in said systems, and then apply some limited changes to our own existing system to make it better?

Yeah, I like my idea instead.

Yeah, after researching, they'll just suggest adopting the french system, but then politicians would never do that because conservatives are imbecile Francophobes. ZOMG, FRANCE? NO WE COULD NEVER ADOPT ANYTHING FROM THEM!!!

Please. It would take nothing to have our health care admin system to be the best in the world. There is not much ROI for health care providers to put all the electronic systems in place so they are not going to do it.

 

Patranus

Diamond Member
Apr 15, 2007
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Originally posted by: Balt
Originally posted by: Patranus
Yet do world leaders travel to the USA or France for their health care?

Yes let's take less than .00001% of the Earth's population and use them as the example for the effectiveness of our health care system.

Well you are taking 5% of the US population as an example of how the US system doesn't work and taking what works for 95% of the USA and throwing that out the window.
 

TheSkinsFan

Golden Member
May 15, 2009
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Originally posted by: TruePaige
Originally posted by: TheSkinsFan
How about if we let a bunch of smart Americans study the systems that work, learn from and analyze the mistakes in said systems, and then apply some limited changes to our own existing system to make it better?

Yeah, I like my idea instead.

Yeah, we know you hate any idea that involves UHC and actual change.

You could just post a "..." and I could fill in the words for you.

Well, it's no secret that I'm completely opposed to any sort of mandatory "universal" solution, but that doesn't mean that any solution should be outsourced; which, since it flew right over your head, was my main point.

'Made in America' still means something to me, ESPECIALLY when it comes to our Federal legislation.

It sure would be nice to see all the chuckleheads in DC put two braincells together long enough to come up with some well thought-out, limited, reasonable, specific, and cost-effective healthcare reform.

Dontchathink?