Smart to Buy Apple PC's Now?

[mnarciso]

As everyone knows by now Apple will be switching their processors to Intel and I'm very very tempted to buy a 15" Powerbook. However, I had someone tell me it will be obsolete in the next couple years. I find it really hard to believe that Apple would dump all support on OS X and just sever the ties with everything pre-Intel.

Basically, my computing needs for this laptop are casual and for school. I'll be doing some programming/compiling and a lot of web development but other than that I don't play games and I'd like to use it for casual computing.

I'm about to chunk out 2k for this thing and I just want to make sure I'm making a good investment.

I will point out that I am also leaning towards Apple simply because its designed really well.

For those who are not MacHeads or Anti-Apple whatever... if you are going to comment please offer constructive criticism as to why and any other alternatives and recommendations? Thanks ahead of time for any advice given!

 

[remagavon]

Wait for the Intel switch. Dual core processors will likely be in the powerbooks, and will also likely give better battery performance than current powerbooks which are somewhat lackluster compared to x86 laptops.

Check notebookforums.com for more information regarding that.

The system will not be obsolete in a year or two, but your performance on newer apps will likely be fairly slow due to the G4 being a very dated processor. If they released G5 powerbooks then that would probably last you for a few years, but that's down the road if they do that at all.

 

[Sunbird]

Originally posted by: mnarciso
and I'm very very tempted to buy a 15" Powerbook. However, I had someone tell me it will be obsolete in the next couple years.

Well, most current notebooks will be obsolete in a couple of years (compared to what will be out then) , some more obsolete than others, and it also depends on what your mean by "couple".....

Anyway, I'd also suggest either waiting for the Intel move, or maybe look for a really well constructed/rounded off Windows running notebook thats getting very good reviews...

 

[mnarciso]

Thanks for the replies/advice, will the Intel move have an impact on their OS X? I'm just afraid of support being stopped for it such as programs no longer written for OS X on the IBM platform processors. I don't really mind not having all that insane dual core processor speed because I would never buy a laptop for performance. I have my desktop for performance and its much cheaper to get performance out of desktop.

With that said, do you still think a Powerbook is a bad purchase at the moment? Like I said the only thing I worry about is just support for the notebook.

 

[n0cmonkey]

They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

 

[n0cmonkey]

It's a bad time to buy. Read

 

[mnarciso]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's a bad time to buy. Read

Interesting, ok I'll hold off then thanks for that page. I do however need a notebook soon and I suppose someone was recommending just getting an iBook if I really want to stick with OS X and style for 949 that notebook comes with a lot... its just *sigh* not a Powerbook but I suppose I can sell it once I'm done with it and then go for updated Powerbook?

 

[batmanuel]

Yep, spending $2K on a G4 powerbook right now is going to be a big waste of money. A next gen dual-core Yonah-based Pentium M Powerbook running at 2GHz and above combined with decent graphics like a mobile X800 will likely be able to keep up with the entry-level dual 2GHz PowerMac G5 once x86 optimized binaries are available for the major apps like Final Cut, Motion and Photoshop. Complier software in particular should be multithreaed and thus should see a huge boost going from a G4 to a dual core Pentium M. For programming and web development, the Yonah Pentium Ms should be especially nice, since they have a new Intel tech on them called Vanderpool that should open the door for Apple to have some seriously powerful virtualization technology. At the very least it will allow MS to write a more powerful Virtaul PC app that you can use for testing your software and web pages in a Windows environment. I might even allow Apple to do some even cooler stuff that could help them immensely as far as gaining market share, but that it pure speculation at this point.

 

[n0cmonkey]

Originally posted by: mnarciso

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's a bad time to buy. Read

Interesting, ok I'll hold off then thanks for that page. I do however need a notebook soon and I suppose someone was recommending just getting an iBook if I really want to stick with OS X and style for 949 that notebook comes with a lot... its just *sigh* not a Powerbook but I suppose I can sell it once I'm done with it and then go for updated Powerbook?

If you don't need Firewire800, gigabit ethernet, or a PCMCIA slot, get an iBook. Those are about the only things a powerbook has over an iBook.

BTW, the 15" Powerbook isn't as portable as it seems, IMO. I've got one and it's bigger than I kind of expected. My 12" iBook was much easier.

 

[mnarciso]

But but... the keyboard it feels like rubber and the screen its so tiny... and is it just me or is the screen not as bright? Oh well, I suppose its temporary until my dream machine comes out, a lot of people say for the price its quite a steal especially with bluetooth built in at under 1k price tag thats rare to find?

 

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey

Originally posted by: mnarciso

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
It's a bad time to buy. Read

Interesting, ok I'll hold off then thanks for that page. I do however need a notebook soon and I suppose someone was recommending just getting an iBook if I really want to stick with OS X and style for 949 that notebook comes with a lot... its just *sigh* not a Powerbook but I suppose I can sell it once I'm done with it and then go for updated Powerbook?

If you don't need Firewire800, gigabit ethernet, or a PCMCIA slot, get an iBook. Those are about the only things a powerbook has over an iBook.

BTW, the 15" Powerbook isn't as portable as it seems, IMO. I've got one and it's bigger than I kind of expected. My 12" iBook was much easier.

Or a line in. That's really important for some people.

 

[Coherence]

Now that Apple is switching to Intel CPUs, my dream of a single dual-boot system capable of running Windows for games and OS X for "the important stuff" just may come true!

I agree, this may not be a good time to buy. Wait for the new Intel Macs to come out, and see what they are really capable of.

 

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: Coherence
Now that Apple is switching to Intel CPUs, my dream of a single dual-boot system capable of running Windows for games and OS X for "the important stuff" just may come true!

I agree, this may not be a good time to buy. Wait for the new Intel Macs to come out, and see what they are really capable of.

This is exactly what I've been trying to get at in all of my recent Mac posts. Once you've used both platforms you can really appreciate the opportunities this architecture switch will provide us with.

 

[Oyeve]

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

I doubt it. Apple is infamous for instantly dropping support on whatever product it feels like.

 

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: Oyeve

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

I doubt it. Apple is infamous for instantly dropping support on whatever product it feels like.

Their compilers will create dual platform binaries. Software 4-5 years from now will probably work (at least the entry level stuff), it'll just be archaically slow.

10.5 will be released for both platforms, I can virtually guarentee it. 10.6 or whatever comes next probably will too, so that's 3 years at least right there. They get money from software sales so it would be stupid to alienate their cusotmers.

 

[mnarciso]

Originally posted by: remagavon

Originally posted by: Oyeve

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

I doubt it. Apple is infamous for instantly dropping support on whatever product it feels like.

Their compilers will create dual platform binaries. Software 4-5 years from now will probably work (at least the entry level stuff), it'll just be archaically slow.

10.5 will be released for both platforms, I can virtually guarentee it. 10.6 or whatever comes next probably will too, so that's 3 years at least right there. They get money from software sales so it would be stupid to alienate their cusotmers.

I'd have to agree with you on this one. Speed isn't everything to everyone especially in a notebook. My friend still uses a PII 400 Mhz running Windows XP just fine with 512 RAM and those came preinstalled with WinME.

Apple would be REALLY REALLY stupid to just cut support for all their previous products. To this day they still support their original iPod and even the old iBooks and Powerbooks which run OS X just fine.

However, it is true its a bad idea to lay down 2k on a 15" PBook especially when I could essentially squeeze out the same usage out of a 1k 12" iBook. I've made my decision! 12" iBook... I'll just have to watch the Technology Wave ahead of time and sell right before anything new hits the market. Plus when you eBay Apple products, Apple products tend to hold their value longer than most notebooks just due to the fact that they are absolutely beautiful products and well built. G4 Cube anyone? that thing sells for a lot still simply because of its design.

 

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: mnarciso

Originally posted by: remagavon

Originally posted by: Oyeve

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

I doubt it. Apple is infamous for instantly dropping support on whatever product it feels like.

Their compilers will create dual platform binaries. Software 4-5 years from now will probably work (at least the entry level stuff), it'll just be archaically slow.

10.5 will be released for both platforms, I can virtually guarentee it. 10.6 or whatever comes next probably will too, so that's 3 years at least right there. They get money from software sales so it would be stupid to alienate their cusotmers.

I'd have to agree with you on this one. Speed isn't everything to everyone especially in a notebook. My friend still uses a PII 400 Mhz running Windows XP just fine with 512 RAM and those came preinstalled with WinME.

Apple would be REALLY REALLY stupid to just cut support for all their previous products. To this day they still support their original iPod and even the old iBooks and Powerbooks which run OS X just fine.

However, it is true its a bad idea to lay down 2k on a 15" PBook especially when I could essentially squeeze out the same usage out of a 1k 12" iBook. I've made my decision! 12" iBook... I'll just have to watch the Technology Wave ahead of time and sell right before anything new hits the market. Plus when you eBay Apple products, Apple products tend to hold their value longer than most notebooks just due to the fact that they are absolutely beautiful products and well built. G4 Cube anyone? that thing sells for a lot still simply because of its design.

Yep, that's not a bad decision. I'd buy a 12" iBook myself if it had 64mb of vram. Not being able to run higher than 1280x1024 sucks (I have a mac mini and I feel the pain)

 

[mnarciso]

Wait can the 12" iBook front the external resolution to a 20" Apple Cinema Display? I was planning on getting one of those suckers.

 

[remagavon]

Originally posted by: mnarciso
Wait can the 12" iBook front the external resolution to a 20" Apple Cinema Display? I was planning on getting one of those suckers.

According to Anand (in the mac mini review) 32mb of vram is not enough to store the font cache when using resolutions higher than 1280x1024. I have a mini and typing is literally slow when I use 1600x1200 and dreamweaver. Not sure if the higher performance ibook would solve some of that, you might want to ask Eug who IIRC just bought a new generation ibook.

 

[chcarnage]

It will take some time, probably until 2007, for the x86 powerbooks to hit the shelves. The pro-line of Apple products is likely to see x86 CPUs later than the consumer Macs (iMac, eMac, iBook). It's also not clear how good the specs from the first x86 will be, although Apple for sure knows how many critical looks the will recieve.

Some say: Never buy a Revision A product from Apple. But then again, there's the Ukrainian proverb: It's never the right time to buy a computer. I for one would rather look at the already linked buyer's guide than weight the CPU transition too much. It's perfectly possible that the next two Powerbook upgrades still will be PowerPC models.

Originally posted by: Oyeve

Originally posted by: n0cmonkey
They'll probably support both PPC and x86 for at least 3 years after they finish switching.

I doubt it. Apple is infamous for instantly dropping support on whatever product it feels like.

Well the transition from the 680x0 processors to the Power PC went smoothly and Apple did a good job maintaining compatibility.

The switch from OS 9 to OS X occured in less time, Apple knew that many of the Macs in use were able to update to OS X and didn't stick with OS 9 for a long time.

The transition to x86 is a processor transition and this can't be updated like an OS... So my guess (and Steve Jobs' promise) is that for quite some time, development will be made for both platforms.

In short, Apple is not uber PS/2 port style backward compatible, but they hardly abandon things fast if it doesn't make sense.

Originally posted by: mnarciso
But but... the keyboard it feels like rubber and the screen its so tiny... and is it just me or is the screen not as bright? Oh well, I suppose its temporary until my dream machine comes out, a lot of people say for the price its quite a steal especially with bluetooth built in at under 1k price tag thats rare to find?

There's really a difference in brightness (and maximum view angle) between the iBooks and the Powerbooks. I have an iBook and it's okay for indoor work, but I seldom use it outdoors.

 

[chcarnage]

Originally posted by: mnarciso
Wait can the 12" iBook front the external resolution to a 20" Apple Cinema Display? I was planning on getting one of those suckers.

Out of the box, the iBooks only can mirror their 1024*768 output, which is a rather artificial limitation.

The AppleScript iBookScreen Enhancer from the PC journal c't alters the firmware. The magazine claims that the new 14" iBook@1,42 Ghz succeeded to display up to the following resolutions:

1600x1200@85 Hz
2048x1536@60 Hz

Therefor the 1680x1050 resolution of the 20" Cinema Display shouldn't be a problem.

(Attention: Don't use iBookScreen Enhancer on G3 iBooks! And the magazine isn't responsible for any damage caused by the script, p.e. GPU overheating blah blah...)

 

[mnarciso]

Alright, sounds perfect thanks for the info!