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Small and Quiet build for a developer

S

soulbadguy

Member
I am looking to buy/build a new workstation for my home/hobby projects :

In a nutshell i am looking for the smallest/Quietest build with a i7-4770 and a decent nvidia 760 GTX GPU.


1. I will be mainly playing with haswell new TM extensions and AVX2 instruction , some CUDA/C++AMP/Opencl and some VHDL/FPGA synthesis (with Altera Quartus 2). Most of the time on my desktop i have Visual studio, Vmware/virtual box running Ubuntu and gazillion of google chrome tab.

2. (as much as needed) (motherboard + memory + case + PSU )

3. Canada

4. I would prefer to order form the big ones , neweggs.ca,ncix.ca,tigerdirect.ca or canadacomputer.ca

5. Not really a preference, but since i intend to play with opencl/cuda, Nvidia, and a core i7-4770 (no K,for the TM extensions)

6. Yes samsung SSD 840 pro

7. default speed

8. 2 screens at 1920*1200

9. asap...

X. i already have a a windows 8 licence i am planing to use

Looking at my usage pattern i dont think i need that much computing power, so my original plan was to get a prebuild brand pc, but most core i7-4770 system i saw tend to be big and probably noisy... :

Can someone advices me on a PSU + mobo + case combo that would be quiet, small ?

Thanks
 
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At Newegg.ca:
i7-4770
GTX 760
Antec BP350 (and, when it dies after a couple years of gaming...?)
8GB RAM (you could definitely use 16GB)
MSI B85M-G43
Athena CA-GSB01DA (might not even fit the video card)

$779 subtotal, then $30+ shipping, then $105 taxes (it would be about an $800 subtotal with a good PSU). You don't see many i7 builds for $800, and that's why.

You can increase your budget.
You can get a slower CPU ($230 v. $325).
You can get a slower GPU (they go down to $100, before becoming pointless).
You can mix and match the above.
But, you can't have it all for $800 CAD (the only people that do that in the U.S. are those living near a Microcener, for that matter).
 
$800 is a bit too tight. I would go with an Asus Gene board with a Corsair PSU. Pick any CPU, SSD, GPU combo you can afford.
 

Thanks guys for your inputs , i just uped my budget. Actually the budget is not really important, what i really want is a small and quiet build (or prebuild) and i espacially need help on finding a good mobo+case+ psu combo.

Btw,in term of noise level, does the size/format of the case has a big impact ?
 
soulbadguy said:
Btw,in term of noise level, does the size/format of the case has a big impact ?
Click to expand...
Not really. A smaller case, having less panel area, and less volume, is easier to handle as far as air flow, but it's also easier because you can't put as much crap in the way. Case design and size has much more to do with meeting different markets than anything technical, though. IoW, people making HTPCs, quiet PCs to work near, a home NAS that won't have a dedicated network closet, etc., tend to prefer small size and low noise, while people wanting lots of speed, and expansion options, tend not to care much about either--that's what those big headset cushions are for.
 
what do you guys think about "SeaSonic G Series SSR-550RM 550W" as a PSU ? the review looks good and it seems quite silent.

Also how is the noise level on the stock 4770 fan ? should i get a replacement fan for the cpu ?
 
Why certainly. Maybe I should look into becoming a bonafide Silverstone shill? 😀 It's not super small, but with a powerful video card, you have to fight a bit to get something too much smaller quiet. It's also really easy to work in. The PS07B is its cheaper brother, takes 120mm fans, but isn't quite as good thermally, nor acoustically, and has a plastic bezel.

Then maybe...

Gigabyte GA-H87M-D3H or ASRock H87M Pro4 for motherboards.
-MicroATX
-4 RAM slots
-1 PCI and 1 1x PCI-e (with video card)
-Official Xeon E3 support

Is the GB actually worth more? I haven't the faintest.

2 of these 8GB RAM sticks (just cheaper; nothing wrong w/ mfenn's), for 16GB, with room to move up to 32GB.

An Asus GTX 760 DirectCU for a card already tested to idle under 30dBA@1m.

Then, a Xigmatek Gaia CPU cooler, to not spend much. It's like Cooler Master's Hyper212+ Evo, but doesn't cool quite as well, for the trade off of a fan that's not annoying. A Thermalright True Spirit or Macho would cool better, and the Macho could go w/o a fan, but they cost more, and I can't find them in Canada (I've never even been that far North! 😉). If you're a stickler about noise, the Intel stock cooler gets awfully annoying under load. It has the same whine/buzz today as it had when they first moved to those round open-frame HSFs, when it has to spin fast. As they've improved the heatsinks, they've made them cheaper by using less aluminum, instead of making them quieter.

Of course, add any optical drives, or HDDs, if you need them.

Now, a final way to save a little cash, hinted at above, is to change CPUs from an i7 to a Xeon E3 V3 (no-V = Sandy Bridge, V2 = Ivy bridge, V3 = Haswell). The Xeon E3-1240V3, FI, has no IGP, and a Turbo frequency 100MHz (not even 3%) slower than the i7-4770, yet is almost $50 cheaper. The ones ending in 5 have IGP. They give you TSX, HT, 8MB L3, and can't be overclocked. They also support ECC, but that requires a more expensive mobo (due to the chipset), so doesn't apply. The 1245V3 isn't much cheaper, but the 1240V3, 1230V3, and 1235V3 might be worth looking at, for the same reasons most people consider CPUs like the i5-4570.

Oh, and mfenn's PSU should be a good choice. It's a rebadged Seasonic S12II, right down the fan. Can't go wrong with the actual branded OEM unit, either, though, it just doesn't appear to have a rebate going for it, right now.
 
@Cerb:
Thanks for pointing the xeon line to me, i didnt even considerd them because i assumed that server grade CPU would be way pricier than anything on the consumer line.However i am seeing that the xeon v3 line is missing some instruction (FMA3 from AMD and FC16) and i have to do some research on those. But i am bit confused , do those xeon have integrated graphics or not ?

Looking at all the comment, it seems that the GPU is too big for a mATX build.I game rarely and usually pretty old game (SC2,diablo 3,etc...) and i dont really care about having the best graphics. I choosed the GTX 760 because it's the newest card in the 250 range (extacly what i paid 5 years ago for my previous build ) : what the minimum card for playing recent game at medium setting on 1920*1200 ?
 
For games like that, a GTX 660, or Radeon HD 7870 would be plenty fast enough (both above minimum, really). However, they won't be smaller. That case will fit the GTX 760 just fine, and the GTX 760 has good bang/buck right now.

http://www.chiphell.com/article-1418-10.html (referred from http://www.overclock.net/t/1068487/silverstone-tj08-e-owners-club/70#post_14320755)
^That's an example of what to expect (the exhaust 120mm fan is not included with the case, though). A big video card will fit just fine, and will be supported (that plastic bit on top of the drive cage is to keep the video card from sagging).

That heatsink's hugeness is one of the reasons they make a 120mm small version of the HR-02 (rev. A). That cooler can run w/o a fan in that case, no sweat, with a midrange video card (done it before, and probably will do it for my own when I decide to start using modern tech for my own desktop 😉). But, U.S. availability is limited; Canadian: 😕.

P.P.S. Possible CPU cooler: Silverstone HE02
Fan: Bitfenix Spectre Pro
Fitment note: multiple 3.5" HDDs might not fit well with it, 'cause it's huge. With Scythe and Thermalright being hard to come by, this is just bugging me. There must be a well-fitting big cooler that can do the job, but not cost as much as a CLC (IE, Noctua).

I haven't used either. Reviews of the HE02 indicate it not performing quite as well as TR's, so while I could recommend a TR Macho and TJ08-e w/o an extra fan all day long, I wouldn't do it for this one, though you might be able to pull it off (it basically just requires stress-testing and logging temps when ambient temps are warm, and deciding if they're too high for comfort, or not). That fan (for case exhaust, or blowing into the heatsink, but plugged in to the CPU fan header either way) seems to test well for noise and performance, and goes down to nice low minimum RPMs. That combo should comfortably leave the <30dBA video card as your loudest component, giving you true whisper, or maybe even sub-whisper, quiet, when not loading up the GPU. A little more spendy, but the level of quiet this can kind of cooling can bring can spoil you.

Another possible cooler: Prolimatech Megahalems rev. C
It would still need a fan added, though. It could be a a bit quieter than the Gaia under load, but with the tight fin spacing, it's more an overclocker heatsink, so I'm not sure if it really be worth it.

P.P.P.S. Looking for a review or build with the HE02 in it, to see fitment...do note that while the expansion slots are fixed, the motherboard tray of the TJ08-e comes out, which makes the initial heatsink installation fairly easy (also, an annoyance: if you're reviewing, you could at least skim the manual, which includes a diagram showing exactly that, instead of expounding on upon the difficulty of heatsink installation while leaving the tray in the case!).

In any case, while not as quiet as far into the quiet spectrum, the Xigmatek Gaia would still do, for ~$30+s&h, and is probably what you should go for. In the end, it will still result in a quieter than most OEM office boxes. I'm just on a mission to find something good and passive, now, because it should exist and be available, and not finding one bugs me 🙂.

P.S. As far as the CPU goes, all Intel CPUs lack AMD-specific instructions. Intel's FMA3 is supported, as part of supporting AVX2.

The Xeon E3-xxx0Vx CPUs lack IGP, while the E3-xxx5Vx CPUs have IGP. Why can't Intel make it simple? I don't know, either.
 
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OK, so enough rambling and being annoyed about heatsink availability 🙂

  • Case: Silverstone TJ08B-e: compact, easy to manage cables (just route as many as possible on the other side of the mobo tray), filtered, and fairly quiet out of the box--definitely in the, "whisper quiet," range. The fan can also be further undervolted (w/ motherboard fan control)[/url], to run down in the 400-500 RPM range, where it becomes pretty much inaudible. The PS07 wouldn't be a bad choice if you want replacement fan options, but the plastic front can make a hum/rustle kind of noise if the fans have to speed up much, due to the side intake and filter design.
    [*]Power supply: XFX 550W: a rebadged Seasonic S12II, and just as quiet, to boot. 80+ Gold and 80+ Platinum are all the rage, so it's low-end, nowadays 🙄.
    [*]Motherboard: I've been frustrated a few times with recent low-end MSIs, lately, so am steering clear of them, for now. I wonder if they've been trying to cut corners on their software develeopment and QA costs.
    Gigabyte GA-H87M-D3H: PCI-e and PCI, MOSFET cooling, 4 RAM slots--should be a nice little board.
    Or
    ASRock H87M Pro4: cheaper after MIR, and has no VRM cooling. If you're up for keeping track of MIRs, it's a good deal.
    Or
    Asus H87M-E does not officially support the Xeon E3 CPUs, but offers 2 additional PCI-e expansion slots (slots 1 and 2 will be taken up by the video card). If you go with the i7, spring for this, IMO. PCI isn't dead, but everything new is PCI-e.
    [*]RAM: the same Crucial 8GB sticks: 1333 MHz v. 1600MHz makes pretty much no difference, and all the cheap 1600MHz sticks are CAS 10 and 11, which will make up the speed benefit if you run a program that blows out your cache.
    [*]CPU: Core i7-4770: mainly for pricing purposes.
    [*]Video card: Asus GTX 760: if you want to go with something a bit cheaper, stick to Asus and MSI cards with coolers like the above, to be sure of low idle noise (including the character of the noise--30dB of broadband noise and 30dB of 1kHz whine are not the same to your brain).
    [*]Storage: already bought SSD. If adding HDDs, any non-AV with 1TB platters is as good as any other, generally.
    [*]Opitcal drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST
    [*]CPU HSF: Xigamtek Gaia: good, not expensive, and far better under load than the stock HSF.


The Asus GTX 760 is OOS at the moment, so I used the MSI for pricing.
I used the Gigabyte mobo for pricing, as well. The ASRock would be about $30-35 cheaper, net, if you do the MIR.

Shipping to random postal code K8N 5W6:
$1045.91 subtotal
$1235.03 w/ shipping and taxes
Then, there's a $15 PSU MIR

By choosing one of the Xeon E3 CPUs, you can go a bit slower, without losing CPU feature support, and save up to $95, if you don't get the Asus motherboard. If you want the option of IGP, the 1245V3 is hardly worth it over the i7, though it is slightly cheaper, nonetheless. If raw CPU performance of only about 91% (3.1Ghz) of the i7 is good, though, the 1220V3 gives you TSX at nearly an i5 price point, and E3-1225V3 does so, at 94% the speed (3.2GHz), with an IGP option (for later re-purposing?), while still being $80 less than the i7 (great performance for the money, but still, 6% slower than the i7).

But, Intel has become really annoying with their CPUs. I just noticed the E3-122xV3 does not have Hyper-threading. Can we get an emoticon for wanting to jump around the room and smash things?
 
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So, in light of that, here's another attempt at the 'cheaper' build. I edited the first out of the last post. I'll definitely be remembering that, about the E3-122x!

Same stuff as above, but:
Case: PS07B: 2x120mm, plastic bezel, side USBs, and otherwise almost the same case. Comes in white, if you want that. 120mm fans are also more common, if you want to try others, later.
Motherboard: ASRock H87M Pro4: $5 cheaper, slightly cheaper shipping, and $25 MIR. Also, while I usually ignore mobo utilities, their GUI fan speed control tool is easy to use.
CPU: Xeon E3-1230V3: 3.3/3.7GHz (v. 3.4/3.9), HT, TSX, etc., but no IGP.

Subtotal: $970.91
Shipped to the aforementioned postal code: $1149.65
$15 and $25 MIRs

If you do the MIRs, that's a net savings of about $110. If not concerned about having the absolute fastest rig out there, that's not bad, for having a HT-enabled Haswell and a midrange gaming video card, and it will be about the size of a typical OEM minitower.
 
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Thanks again cerb, your info the xeon line was really eye opening. So i decided to go with the Xeon line coupled with C226 chipset motherboard.The C226 is more expensive , but it seems that it's the only one that garanty the vt-d extension from intel (the Q87 sucks),so what that's what my build looks like :

ASUS P9D WS : 256 wich is no where to be found 🙁
xeon E3-1240V3 289 $
Fratacl R2 99$
the mother is ATX so i need a full tower now 🙁
(nice discount there , hopefull i can price match with tigerdirect.ca)
For the ram i am planning to with the best discount of at the moment of the purchase (any thing wrong with that approach ? like brand to avoid etc... ?)
WS green drive 2TB $99
Power supply: XFX 550W
 
soulbadguy said:
ASUS P9D WS : 256 wich is no where to be found 🙁
xeon E3-1240V3 289 $
Fratacl R2 99$
the mother is ATX so i need a full tower now 🙁
Click to expand...
*sigh* It happens. There is a MicroATX from Supermicro, but it's exceptionally spartan, except for fan headers. I can bet if you got it that, at some point, you'd wish you hadn't, due to a lack of some kind of connector (like DVI), number of USB ports, or something like that. It's really made for half-width 1U and 2U servers. The Asus is $50-80 more, depending on vriant compared to, but it's packed with regular consumer features, on top of being a workstation board. It's more or less a $120-150 board with a lot more money going to Intel.

However, the Fractal Design R2 is huge. Well, actually, the R2 XL is huge, but the non-huge R2 is not in production. Make it the R4 (or a Corsair 550D), and you'll be set, with a not-so-compact, but still pretty quiet, computer.

As the RAM goes, yes. 1.5V or less, 1333MHz or faster, lowest CAS you're willing to pay for, from somebody like Crucial, Kingston, A-Data, Corsair, G.Skill, etc.. While it would mostly limit you Crucial or Kingston, using a C226 would also allow you to spring for ECC UDIMMs, making a full-on home workstation setup.

Finally, don't get a Caviar Green, for anything but backups or streaming. They're not just 5400 RPM, they are made to aggressively save power, and perform much worse than a Blue. If you want 2TB, your best bet today would be Hitachi or Seagate. My speculation is that WD is selling every 1TB platter they can put in a HDD, and the Reds are more popular, because they have some gaps in their model line-up, except for the Reds and Greens.
 
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Cerb said:
*sigh* It happens. There is a MicroATX from Supermicro, but it's exceptionally spartan, except for fan headers. I can bet if you got it that, at some point, you'd wish you hadn't, due to a lack of some kind of connector (like DVI), number of USB ports, or something like that. It's really made for half-width 1U and 2U servers. The Asus is $50-80 more, depending on vriant compared to, but it's packed with regular consumer features, on top of being a workstation board. It's more or less a $120-150 board with a lot more money going to Intel.

However, the Fractal Design R2 is huge. Well, actually, the R2 XL is huge, but the non-huge R2 is not in production. Make it the R4 (or a Corsair 550D), and you'll be set, with a not-so-compact, but still pretty quiet, computer.

As the RAM goes, yes. 1.5V or less, 1333MHz or faster, lowest CAS you're willing to pay for, from somebody like Crucial, Kingston, A-Data, Corsair, G.Skill, etc.. While it would mostly limit you Crucial or Kingston, using a C226 would also allow you to spring for ECC UDIMMs, making a full-on home workstation setup.

Finally, don't get a Caviar Green, for anything but backups or streaming. They're not just 5400 RPM, they are made to aggressively save power, and perform much worse than a Blue. If you want 2TB, your best bet today would be Hitachi or Seagate. My speculation is that WD is selling every 1TB platter they can put in a HDD, and the Reds are more popular, because they have some gaps in their model line-up, except for the Reds and Greens.
Click to expand...



Humm yes the R4 seems tall enought, for the WS green i am a but confused now. This guy uses them as secondary drive after an SSD , and that what i want to do
 
soulbadguy said:
Humm yes the R4 seems tall enought, for the WS green i am a but confused now. This guy uses them as secondary drive after an SSD , and that what i want to do
Click to expand...
You can, but they are slow, in a very noticeable way. It's not just the 5400 RPM, but they have additional power-saving on top of that. If you want to split the difference, the Reds are much more responsive, as 5400 RPM disks (but only try to error-correct for 7 seconds on a bad sector).
 
Ok guys,
First of thank again for the nice suggestions . This what the final build looks like :
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i7-4770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($318.32 @ TigerDirect Canada)
CPU Cooler: Xigmatek GAIA SD1283 56.3 CFM CPU Cooler ($43.48 @ Newegg Canada)
Motherboard: ASRock H87M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($81.99 @ Vuugo)
Memory: Patriot Viper 3 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($100.47 @ Amazon Canada)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Green 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($99.99 @ Memory Express)
Video Card: Asus GeForce GTX 760 2GB Video Card ($281.48 @ Newegg Canada)
Sound Card: Creative Labs ZXR 24-bit 192 Hz Sound Card ($211.50 @ Vuugo)
Wireless Network Adapter: Asus PCE-N15 802.11b/g/n PCI-Express x1 Wi-Fi Adapter ($25.40 @ DirectCanada)
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 (Titanium Grey) ATX Mid Tower Case ($99.99 @ Memory Express)
Other: SeaSonic G Series SSR-550RM ($79.00)
Total: $1341.62
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-07-10 23:10 EDT-0400)
will resuse a Samsung 840 pro
I have to normalize the first price to one retailers.
Couple of questions :
1 - Do i need after market fans for the case ? if yes, suggestions are very welcome. I was thinking of just build the computer , then order more fan the noise or cooling performance are not good.

2 - Thermal paste ?

3 - Motherboard reliability : There is a lot of talk about motherboard reliability (2K vs 5K cap,etc...), asus TUF, WS series etc... all the manifactuers have something at the higher price point, but those board also looks targeted to a gaming/overclocking audience. are those important for a non overclocking build ? in terms of reliability of much does a more expensive/reliable brand/series offer to a non overclocker
 
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soulbadguy said:
1 - Do i need after market fans for the case ? if yes, suggestions are very welcome. I was thinking of just build the computer , then order more fan the noise or cooling performance are not good.
Click to expand...
No. Just set them up as two intakes (in part to move the main fan noise towards the front baffling/absorbing material), and if you want, hook them into the fan switch. Though, if it likes the motherboard control method (some fans don't do well w/ power PWM), ASRock's tuning utility is actually rather nice (note: due to the GTX 760, you don't want to have an 'off' temp setting, if it allows one, since you don't get to use GPU temp to control the fans).

2 - Thermal paste ?
Click to expand...
It should have a micro-ketchup-packet of it included (see the last photo here). But, this $3 syringe would last a long time, and offer an insurance policy against a bad application. Without overclocking, the differences in TIMs are not really worth worrying about.

3 - Motherboard reliability : There is a lot of talk about motherboard reliability (2K vs 5K cap,etc...), asus TUF, WS series etc... all the manifactuers have something at the higher price point, but those board also looks targeted to a gaming/overclocking audience. are those important for a non overclocking build ? in terms of reliability of much does a more expensive/reliable brand/series offer to a non overclocker
Click to expand...
That's a good question, TBH.

I can say is I'm at 0 failures with low-end Gigabyte and ASRock boards, over the last 8+ years (bad caps got a few in the AXP/P4 days), and one Asus, but that was the PSU going *POW*, so not Asus' fault. For a typical ~5 year service life, parts tend to die from bad luck and/or excessive power surges, and with a good PSU and a surge strip, you're on the side of luck. Overclockers can ruin components in short order, but for stock operation, a little diligence will do, and then there's just that fraction-of-a-percent chance yours will be unlucky, before you upgrade.
 
Cerb said:
No. Just set them up as two intakes (in part to move the main fan noise towards the front baffling/absorbing material), and if you want, hook them into the fan switch. Though, if it likes the motherboard control method (some fans don't do well w/ power PWM), ASRock's tuning utility is actually rather nice (note: due to the GTX 760, you don't want to have an 'off' temp setting, if it allows one, since you don't get to use GPU temp to control the fans).

It should have a micro-ketchup-packet of it included (see the last photo here). But, this $3 syringe would last a long time, and offer an insurance policy against a bad application. Without overclocking, the differences in TIMs are not really worth worrying about.

That's a good question, TBH.

I can say is I'm at 0 failures with low-end Gigabyte and ASRock boards, over the last 8+ years (bad caps got a few in the AXP/P4 days), and one Asus, but that was the PSU going *POW*, so not Asus' fault. For a typical ~5 year service life, parts tend to die from bad luck and/or excessive power surges, and with a good PSU and a surge strip, you're on the side of luck. Overclockers can ruin components in short order, but for stock operation, a little diligence will do, and then there's just that fraction-of-a-percent chance yours will be unlucky, before you upgrade.
Click to expand...

Thanks pulling the trigger today or tomorow.
Do you have any sugggestion for a wifi usb or pci adapter ?
 
soulbadguy said:
Thanks pulling the trigger today or tomorow.
Do you have any sugggestion for a wifi usb or pci adapter ?
Click to expand...
If not gaming competitively, it usually doesn't make that much difference. The one you've picked out looks good, but some folks seem to have issues with the software, fixed by using the reference drivers, instead, which is something I like to do whenever I can, anyway.

P.S. Going with the R4 as a case, might I interest you in the bigger brother to the selected motherboard, before you order (also, if you order from Newegg, note that you get the rebate form link in the cart)?
 
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Cerb said:
If not gaming competitively, it usually doesn't make that much difference. The one you've picked out looks good, but some folks seem to have issues with the software, fixed by using the reference drivers, instead, which is something I like to do whenever I can, anyway.

P.S. Going with the R4 as a case, might I interest you in the bigger brother to the selected motherboard, before you order (also, if you order from Newegg, note that you get the rebate form link in the cart)?
Click to expand...
Yes definitly i will go for the bigger version. What link ? i ussually dont pursue mailing rebate 🙂
 
soulbadguy said:
3 - Motherboard reliability : There is a lot of talk about motherboard reliability (2K vs 5K cap,etc...), asus TUF, WS series etc... all the manifactuers have something at the higher price point, but those board also looks targeted to a gaming/overclocking audience. are those important for a non overclocking build ? in terms of reliability of much does a more expensive/reliable brand/series offer to a non overclocker
Click to expand...

"Reliability" features are pretty much marketing fluff. Actual data shows that they are pretty much equal (within a percent).
 
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