SLI vs Crossfire article by Ratchet over at Rage3D.

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: josh6079
So basically depend on a cheapy to do something that a $500+ SLI setup can't do? :roll:

Crossfire does? It's a limitation of any dual gpu setup. A simple solution is adding a PCI video card. If you need help with that just ask.

I've already taken the step I needed to in order to have what I want for the better performance, dual monitor support, and IQ, but thanks for the suggestion.

Instead of adding a simple PCI video card you opted for less performance and overall quality? To each his own I guess.

 

[josh6079]

Crossfire does? It's a limitation of any dual gpu setup

That's my point. I'm not going to pay for a CF/SLI setup and yet still be interested in having another video card in my case. Your solution works yes, but to buy three cards in order to do what I can do with one is unnecessary.

Instead of adding a simple PCI video card you opted for less performance and overall quality? To each his own I guess.

Who said I got less performance or quality? To my knowledge, I've gotten more.

You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups. I've already stated that they are fine for some gamers and if you want the absolute best frames, go for them. Your defending a defect with them by suggesting another video card to add into the system instead of fixing CF/SLI to support two monitors. You are suggesting using THREE video cards to do something that ONE can easily do.

I stand behind not buying something I don't like, the companies do not make me conform to them, they conform to my needs or they don't get my money. In this case, I'll withhold from another multiGPU setup until single cards no longer have more appeal to them than dual cards. Once CF/SLI becomes mature enough to do something that one card can at around the same price point, maybe then I'll consider it. Until then, leave your third party hardware recommendations for someone who hasn't already figured out that single cards give the best bang for buck ratios for thier generations.

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: josh6079
That's my point. I'm not going to pay for a CF/SLI setup and yet still be interested in having another video card in my case. Your solution works yes, but to buy three cards in order to do what I can do with one is unnecessary.


Instead of adding a simple PCI video card you opted for less performance and overall quality? To each his own I guess
Who said I got less performance or quality? To my knowledge, I've gotten more.

So you are saying you get more out of one video card than with two? :roll: SLI works Crossfire does not, get over it. It's not for you....who cares, you are not the focus of the article.

You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups. I've already stated that they are fine for some gamers and if you want the absolute best frames, go for them. Your defending a defect with them by suggesting another video card to add into the system instead of fixing CF/SLI to support two monitors. You are suggesting using THREE video cards to do something that ONE can easily do.

You seem to think that your ONE video card performs as well as two. That's a nice world to live in. I see no problem in adding a $5 extra so that I can enjoy the power of dual GPUs and dual screens. Heck I run a second computer on my second screen setup for even more fun.

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

but NV's AA is at least as good as ATI's.

This is false; ATi's Crossfire AA modes use sparse grid while nVidia's SLI AA modes still conform to a regular pattern.

In addition to having better IQ ATi's modes are much faster since each card is still only taking the performance hit of doing MSAA and there is no overhead of combining the two GPU rendered portions because there is dedicated hardware to do it.

Regrettably, I don't have a Crossfire rig on hand to compare the two. However, I fail to see how one implemetation is "better" when it makes things disappear.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
You seem to think that your ONE video card performs as well as two. That's a nice world to live in. I see no problem in adding a $5 extra so that I can enjoy the power of dual GPUs and dual screens. Heck I run a second computer on my second screen setup for even more fun.

I think he is talking about a 7800GT SLI setup vs. X1900XT(X) which in fact does perform about equal doesn't it?? Look here for a 7800GT SLI setup review and here for a X1900XT(X) setup. Several games compared on both systems shows the single X1900XT(X) coming out ahead of the dual 7800GT setup(when AA and AF are turned up). The gap would be even larger if the settings were HQ but they're not, on both setups. OPENGL games however are better on the 7800GT SLI setup.

 

[fierydemise]

Wreckage/Crusader why don't you read what people are saying, the review was done with the older cat 6.6s and CF got an important driver improvement that fixes most of the issues talked about in the review, so the stability issues mentioned previous to this new driver release are moot.

 

[LittleNemoNES]

SLI works Crossfire does not, get over it.

WRONG. I have crossfire and get a lot out of it...with the exception of FEAR which I don't like so much.

I am using Catalyst 6.6 chuck version. I didn't have to rename anything.

I play the following games @ 1680x1050 (all high quality -- I don't cheat myself!):
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oblivion -- 45+ fps 4xAA+HDR, 16xHQAF

Battlefield 2 -- 50+ fps 10xSSAA 16xHQAF

COD2 -- 50+fps 4xSSAA 16xHQAF

FEAR -- 50 fps average, 30 fps minumum, 2xSSAA, 16xHQAF (weakest performing game)

GRAW -- 60fps average 16xHQAF, 45fps minimum

STEAM -- 60fps minimum! 14xSSAA, 16xHQAF (includes Day of Defeat Source+HDR)

Far Cry -- 50 fps minimum 10xSSAA, 16xHQAF

Doom 3 -- 60 fps minimum! Ultra settings + forced 16xHQAF 4xAA (could be better -- haven't tried)

Quake 4 -- 45 fps minimum Ultra settings + forced 16xHQAF 4xAA
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Because SLI's high fps can be like 200 as opposed to 100...really, who cares. The minimums are about the same on both with one edging out the other depending on the game. Oblivion has better low fps on Xfire, Fear has better low fps on SLI. So it goes.

The desire to beat your perceived opponent on these forum shouldn't trump your sanity.

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: fierydemise
Wreckage/Crusader why don't you read what people are saying, the review was done with the older cat 6.6s and CF got an important driver improvement that fixes most of the issues talked about in the review, so the stability issues mentioned previous to this new driver release are moot.

Likewise, you could read what other people are saying: That the 6.7's introduce other (performance) issues not present in the 6.6's. So, the point is not moot.

 

[fierydemise]

Originally posted by: nitromullet

Originally posted by: fierydemise
Wreckage/Crusader why don't you read what people are saying, the review was done with the older cat 6.6s and CF got an important driver improvement that fixes most of the issues talked about in the review, so the stability issues mentioned previous to this new driver release are moot.

Likewise, you could read what other people are saying: That the 6.7's introduce other (performance) issues not present in the 6.6's. So, the point is not moot.

I did see that but if the difference is getting a game to work or fewer FPS I pick the game working everytime, the point is the stability issues have been fixed obviously there are some other problems that ATI needs to work out but calling CF unstable or saying it doesn't work is unture.

 

[nitromullet]

Originally posted by: fierydemise

Originally posted by: nitromullet

Originally posted by: fierydemise
Wreckage/Crusader why don't you read what people are saying, the review was done with the older cat 6.6s and CF got an important driver improvement that fixes most of the issues talked about in the review, so the stability issues mentioned previous to this new driver release are moot.

Likewise, you could read what other people are saying: That the 6.7's introduce other (performance) issues not present in the 6.6's. So, the point is not moot.

I did see that but if the difference is getting a game to work or fewer FPS I pick the game working everytime, the point is the stability issues have been fixed obviously there are some other problems that ATI needs to work out but calling CF unstable or saying it doesn't work is unture.

Most people don't buy two cards so they can compromise on performance. I don't disagree with the idea that reliability trumps performance, I disagree with the idea that the points made in the article are moot. Obvioulsy, Crossfire still has some growing to do, which is pretty much all that Rage3D is saying. If the 6.7's resolve some of those issues (even with a performance hit) it is still good news because it shows continued development, but that doesn't mean that there aren't still issues.

 

[josh6079]

Originally posted by: Wreckage
So you are saying you get more out of one video card than with two?

Yes.

:roll: SLI works Crossfire does not, get over it.

Both work, it's just that the article wasn't using the new drivers that enables them without renaming .exes and failed to rename them with the drivers they were using. It'd be like saying Quad-SLI doesn't work in an article where they were using the drivers right before the quad ones even though the quad ones are out.

It's not for you....who cares

Obviously you do as I have openly stated it isn't for me many times. It's just my opinion Wreckage. You can still use SLI if you want.

you are not the focus of the article.

Never said I was?????

You seem to think that your ONE video card performs as well as two.

No, I know that my one video card performs as well as two.

That's a nice world to live in.

It is. It's called Earth. It is a very nice world to live in.....

I see no problem in adding a $5 extra so that I can enjoy the power of dual GPUs and dual screens. Heck I run a second computer on my second screen setup for even more fun.

..............mmkay.............we've established that. I'm just saying that I do not prefer CF/SLI because of its impracticalities that still exist and due to it's less price/performance ratio. Why you've been on this tangent to declare my personal preference wrong or stupid is beyond me.

EDIT:

Originally posted by: thilan29
I think he is talking about a 7800GT SLI setup vs. X1900XT(X) which in fact does perform about equal doesn't it?? Look here for a 7800GT SLI setup review and here for a X1900XT(X) setup. Several games compared on both systems shows the single X1900XT(X) coming out ahead of the dual 7800GT setup(when AA and AF are turned up). The gap would be even larger if the settings were HQ but they're not, on both setups. OPENGL games however are better on the 7800GT SLI setup.

:thumbsup: You were spot on with understanding what I was saying there.

 

[CaiNaM]

Originally posted by: josh6079
You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups.

actually, that's not entirely accurate. he's an nv fanboy, and he's being defensive about nvidia's gpu setup

still, sli > crossfire; anyone with any objectivity knows that. still, between nv's hackjob on texture filtering and what is in my opinion a cumbersome dual gpu solution from ati, i'm sticking with a single card until either nv offers comparable or better IQ over ati, or ati offers a dual gpu setup as slick as SLI - dual monitor issues notwithstanding

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: thilan29
I think he is talking about a 7800GT SLI setup vs. X1900XT(X) which in fact does perform about equal doesn't it?? Look here for a 7800GT SLI setup review and here for a X1900XT(X) setup. Several games compared on both systems shows the single X1900XT(X) coming out ahead of the dual 7800GT setup(when AA and AF are turned up). The gap would be even larger if the settings were HQ but they're not, on both setups. OPENGL games however are better on the 7800GT SLI setup.

:thumbsup: You were spot on with understanding what I was saying there.

Over a year old article, using last gen video cards :roll: The 1900 series was not even out when that article was written.

Compare it to anything from this year like 7900GT\GTX SLI or 7950GX2.

Keep reaching.

 

[LittleNemoNES]

How petty.

 

[thilanliyan]

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: thilan29
I think he is talking about a 7800GT SLI setup vs. X1900XT(X) which in fact does perform about equal doesn't it?? Look here for a 7800GT SLI setup review and here for a X1900XT(X) setup. Several games compared on both systems shows the single X1900XT(X) coming out ahead of the dual 7800GT setup(when AA and AF are turned up). The gap would be even larger if the settings were HQ but they're not, on both setups. OPENGL games however are better on the 7800GT SLI setup.

:thumbsup: You were spot on with understanding what I was saying there.

Over a year old article, using last gen video cards :roll: The 1900 series was not even out when that article was written.

Compare it to anything from this year like 7900GT\GTX SLI or 7950GX2.

Keep reaching.

Ummm...Josh had 7800GT SLI(I think) and he now has an X1900XT(X)...so his comparison of his OWN EXPERIENCE was valid. And I just tried to provide some links from a site that you wouldn't call biased (I hope Xbitlabs isn't on your ever-growing list of ATI biased sites) to back up what he was saying.

Josh didn't say 7900GTX SLI or 7950GX2 was slower than a X1900XT(X)...he meant HIS OWN SLI setup(7800GT SLI) was slower than HIS OWN current single X1900XT(X). You see?? Sorry I thought you already knew that he had a 7800GT SLI setup before because he has mentioned it.

 

[hemmy]

did you idiots not notice the titles : Uncommon benchmarks...honestly quit complaining about the games. neoseeker has tests on the common, newer games

 

[beggerking]

Originally posted by: thilan29

Originally posted by: Wreckage

Originally posted by: josh6079

Originally posted by: thilan29
I think he is talking about a 7800GT SLI setup vs. X1900XT(X) which in fact does perform about equal doesn't it?? Look here for a 7800GT SLI setup review and here for a X1900XT(X) setup. Several games compared on both systems shows the single X1900XT(X) coming out ahead of the dual 7800GT setup(when AA and AF are turned up). The gap would be even larger if the settings were HQ but they're not, on both setups. OPENGL games however are better on the 7800GT SLI setup.

:thumbsup: You were spot on with understanding what I was saying there.

Over a year old article, using last gen video cards :roll: The 1900 series was not even out when that article was written.

Compare it to anything from this year like 7900GT\GTX SLI or 7950GX2.

Keep reaching.

Ummm...Josh had 7800GT SLI(I think) and he now has an X1900XT(X)...so his comparison of his OWN EXPERIENCE was valid. And I just tried to provide some links from a site that you wouldn't call biased (I hope Xbitlabs isn't on your ever-growing list of ATI biased sites) to back up what he was saying.

Josh didn't say 7900GTX SLI or 7950GX2 was slower than a X1900XT(X)...he meant HIS OWN SLI setup(7800GT SLI) was slower than HIS OWN current single X1900XT(X). You see?? Sorry I thought you already knew that he had a 7800GT SLI setup before because he has mentioned it.

right... he might as well compare a 6600 SLI setup to his new 1900XTX and say his single ATI card runs faster than 2 NVidia cards.

 

[josh6079]

right... he might as well compare a 6600 SLI setup to his new 1900XTX and say his single ATI card runs faster than 2 NVidia cards.

That's obviously correct. I was saying that an SLI setup is, most of the time, out performed by a next generation single card. (i.e. 7800GT SLI vs. X1900XT(X)).

You can conjure up all of the instances where a single ATI card can beat two Nvidia cards--I'm not here to play guess and test. Fact is, one ATI X1900XTX cannot generally outperform two 7900's. I understand this and never claimed so. I simply said that I've gotten more with my one X1900XTX than I did with my two 7800GT's in SLI both volt-modded to 535/1300. (Elfear is another who was in pretty much the same boat except his 7800's reahced 550/1300).

 

[akugami]

And thus is Rage3D?s turn at the plate. My job today is to present you, fine reader, with benchmark results from another list of games that you don?t normally find in a normal graphics card review. I will start out by prefacing the whole shebang with a simple warning: my library is not unlimited, and not all games can be benchmarked within the bounds of time and reason. This warning will serve you well if you come to find yourself questioning my particular game choices for this part of the series. I did, however, try and keep to the whole ?sim? theme, since that is my personal favorite genre

That's from the article so please stop complaining about the games selection. It was purposedly done on lesser known titles rather than games like HL2, Doom3, Farcry, etc that everyone else already shows benchmarkes of.

Originally posted by: Crusader
Anyone with a working brain already knew that SLI > Xfire.
Now, even Rage3D itself backs it up. They couldnt LIE for any particular huge Crossfire supporter here. Truth is just the truth, and we didnt need this article to prove that SLI > Xfire when everyone, even ATI fans already knew ATIs poor driver support and half baked multiGPU implementation shot their Xfire setup in the foot to begin with! :disgust:

Xfire has nothing to do with multi GPU solutions.

No one, absolutely no one argues that SLI has less issues or is more mature than Crossfire. So thank you Captain Obvious. You also ignore the issue that there are still problems with SLI that need to be hammered out. Just because it's more mature and is less problematic doesn't mean it's problem free.

Now, Rage3D may not be able to lie and bend the truth (or at least in this article according to you) but that's certainly something that has never hindered you. You've already been proven wrong more than once. As far as bad drivers, there have been issues you've claimed only affected ATI that multiple people have proven with examples that also affects nVidia. Seriously, foot, meet mouth.

Originally posted by: josh6079
I stand behind not buying something I don't like, the companies do not make me conform to them, they conform to my needs or they don't get my money. In this case, I'll withhold from another multiGPU setup until single cards no longer have more appeal to them than dual cards. Once CF/SLI becomes mature enough to do something that one card can at around the same price point, maybe then I'll consider it. Until then, leave your third party hardware recommendations for someone who hasn't already figured out that single cards give the best bang for buck ratios for thier generations.

A good stance to take and it is one I take. It is just a combination of coincidence, performance and product availability that I've used ATI cards since the Radeon 9x00 days. People think that just because I defend ATI over falsehoods perpetuated by nVidia fanboys that I'm an ATI fanboy. I've also defended nVidia and helped people with nVidia cards when they were having problems. As with any new video card purchase, I will evaluate what is best for me and not what some fanboy says is the bestest thingamajiggy since sliced bread.

 

[josh6079]

Xfire has nothing to do with multi GPU solutions.

:laugh: Xfire is sometimes slang for Crossfire.

 

[Elfear]

Originally posted by: josh6079

That's obviouly correct. I was saying that an SLI setup is, most of the time, out performed by a next generation single card. (i.e. 7800GT SLI vs. X1900XT(X)).

You can conjure up all of the instances where a single ATI card can beat two Nvidia cards--I'm not here to play guess and test. Fact is, one ATI X1900XTX cannot generally outperform two 7900's. I understand this and never claimed so. I simply said that I've gotten more with my one X1900XTX than I did with my two 7800GT's in SLI both volt-modded to 535/1300. (Elfear is another who was in pretty much the same boat except his 7800's reahced 550/1300).

QFT

I'm with Josh on this one. I was getting sick and tired of SLI issues and, for me, it wasn't worth the hassle. Performance is fairly equal between the two 7800GTs and my X1900XT. I'm sure for raw framerates a pair of volt-modded 7900GTs or 7900GTXs would be faster, but the cons outweigh the pros for me.

 

[imported_Crusader]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Originally posted by: josh6079
You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups.

sli > crossfire; anyone with any objectivity knows that. still, between nv's hackjob on texture filtering and what is in my opinion a cumbersome dual gpu solution from ati,

Yup. What I tried telling little Josh but he got his panties in a bunch over this fact.

Missfire using a dongle (yet they are going to copy Nvidias bridge method now.. real innovation..) and overall have worse support makes it what it is, Josh. The inferior multiGPU implementation. Sorry!

 

[LittleNemoNES]

Originally posted by: Crusader

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Originally posted by: josh6079
You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups.

sli > crossfire; anyone with any objectivity knows that. still, between nv's hackjob on texture filtering and what is in my opinion a cumbersome dual gpu solution from ati,

Missfire

am using Catalyst 6.6 chuck version. I didn't have to rename anything.

I play the following games @ 1680x1050 (all high quality -- I don't cheat myself!):
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oblivion -- 45+ fps 4xAA+HDR, 16xHQAF

Battlefield 2 -- 50+ fps 10xSSAA 16xHQAF

COD2 -- 50+fps 4xSSAA 16xHQAF

FEAR -- 50 fps average, 30 fps minumum, 2xSSAA, 16xHQAF (weakest performing game)

GRAW -- 60fps average 16xHQAF, 45fps minimum

STEAM -- 60fps minimum! 14xSSAA, 16xHQAF (includes Day of Defeat Source+HDR)

Far Cry -- 50 fps minimum 10xSSAA, 16xHQAF

Doom 3 -- 60 fps minimum! Ultra settings + forced 16xHQAF 4xAA (could be better -- haven't tried)

Quake 4 -- 45 fps minimum Ultra settings + forced 16xHQAF 4xAA
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[josh6079]

Originally posted by: Crusader

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Originally posted by: josh6079
You seem to be very defensive for multiGPU setups.

sli > crossfire; anyone with any objectivity knows that. still, between nv's hackjob on texture filtering and what is in my opinion a cumbersome dual gpu solution from ati,

Yup. What I tried telling little Josh but he got his panties in a bunch over this fact.

Missfire using a dongle (yet they are going to copy Nvidias bridge method now.. real innovation..) and overall have worse support makes it what it is, Josh. The inferior multiGPU implementation. Sorry!

What are you on? I never said that CF was better than SLI. I believe SLI is more mature and easier to deal with. I'm saying that for what I want from my gaming rig makes SLI and CF both inferior to what I get with one good card.

Get off your green horse because no one here is saying that CF is better than SLI. The only thing that I can tell between them, since I myself haven't had CF, is that they both compete for the highest frames depending on the game. Other than that, I too would rather have an implementation that was more supported, didn't need a "master card" (you'd think a KKK member invented that), and didn't require a dongle (not that I look at the back of my case all of the time anyways, but still..) Yes, SLI is IMO a more advanced and recommendable solution than CF, but the gap is closing.

Relax Crusader, even us supposed ATI "fanATIc's" know when Nvidia has done something better than any other company. Try being an adult for once.

 

[Wreckage]

Originally posted by: josh6079


That's obviouly correct. I was saying that an SLI setup is, most of the time, out performed by a next generation single card. (i.e. 7800GT SLI vs. X1900XT(X)).

Another pointless statement.

Every high end card is also beat by the next high end card. :roll: So you may as well wait forever.

As pointed out by the article if you want high end now, SLI is the only way to go. No single card can touch it. I'm not even sure why you came into this thread to complain about it.