Should this man be charged?

moshquerade

No Lifer
Nov 1, 2001
61,504
12
56
Should this man be charged? He is being charged with felony injury to a child and second degree murder.



A father charged with the hypothermic death of his daughter cried and banged his head against a table Monday in a Shoshone courtroom after a judge read out each charge against him.

Robert E. Aragon, 55, is accused of felony injury to a child and second-degree murder, after two of his children tried to walk nearly 10 miles on their own through feet of snow and freezing temperatures on Christmas to see their mom.

Aragon's family says he's a loving father who shouldn't be in jail for the tragedy.

Authorities from Lincoln and Blaine counties, however, say Aragon's daughter is dead because of his actions.

On Monday, the grieving father also lamented his legal woes.

As 5th District Court Magistrate Mark A. Ingram told Aragon he faces 10 years to life in prison for second-degree murder, he wept, rocked back and forth and quietly muttered, "Oh my god." Then he hit his forehead on the table in front of him.

Deputies from Lincoln County say Aragon let his kids walk after he got his car stuck in a snow drift on West Magic Road at about 9 a.m. - about 10 miles east of the Blaine County line.

Eleven-year-old Sage Aragon died of suspected hypothermia after search and rescue dogs found her by a barbed wire fence the next day, covered in snow, at about 2 a.m.

The search didn't start until police were called by a friend of the children's mother, JoLeta Jenks, at about 7 p.m. and dogs were deployed around 10:20 p.m.

Sage Aragon's brother, Bear Aragon, 12, was found alive at about 9:50 p.m. in a Bureau of Land Management bathroom, near the intersection of West Magic Road and the Magic Dam Road in Camas County. That was 4.5 miles from where the children began walking, and he had hypothermia, was wearing only long underwear, and was treated and released from a local hospital. Due to hypothermia related delusions, he discarded his jacket, pants and shoes, according to the Blaine County Sheriff's Office.

Aragon's family says he shouldn't be in jail, especially under such a high, $500,000 bond.

"My dad, he's a good father," said Aragon's adult daughter, Lorraine Aragon.

Aragon's cousin Kenneth Quintana, who was a passenger in the vehicle, said Aragon did not kill his child.

"I feel that Bob (Aragon) was wrongfully accused of murder," Quintana said. "There's no way that he could have known what was going to happen."

Aragon, who had custody of the children and lives in Jerome, told authorities he thought their mother, who was staying next to the West Magic Lodge, was going to meet the kids on the road, court papers show.

Quintana also said he thought Jenks was going to retrieve the children and thought Aragon and Jenks had coordinated that plan over the phone.

"We thought their mother was going to meet up with the children," Quintana said. "Where was she? How were we supposed to know she wasn't coming?"

But Jenks told the Times-News she disagrees, adding Monday she didn't have a car. "They didn't even call me, telling me they were walking," she has said.

Lincoln County authorities also say the road was undriveable due to snow drifts, according to court papers.

Quinatana sobbed Monday over a phone line, while repeatedly defending Aragon.

"He didn't send those kids out there to die," said Quintana. "He just wanted their mother to spend Christmas with them."

Quintana says he and Aragon searched and yelled out for the children for at least four hours, with towels wrapped around their heads, but they stopped as hypothermia set in. He said he had no cell phone reception in the search area.

'They found her (Sage Aragon) a mile and a half from where I turned around," Quintana said. "If we had kept going, we could have gotten her in time. I just couldn't go anymore, I was so tired. The whole time, we were yelling for the children, our eyes and throat were wind burnt."

Ultimately, the children separated, and Sage Aragon began walking back to the highway, according to the Blaine County Sheriff's Office.

"I just wish she would have stayed with her brother," said Quintana.

Aragon asked the court to lower his bond on Monday. "I think that's way too high," he said in the Shoshone courtroom.

And Quintana agreed his family can't afford that high of a bond.

Judge Ingram on Monday set a bond review hearing for Wednesday, appointed a public defender for Aragon, and scheduled a pretrial for Jan. 7.

A timeline to tragedy

Dec. 25

9 a.m. - Vehicle became stuck in a snowdrift along West Magic Road, less than a mile from the Idaho Highway 75 turnoff, according to the Blaine County Sheriff's Office.

10:30 to 11 a.m. - Children start walking, according to their uncle and passenger, Kenneth Quintana.

12 to 1 p.m. - The vehicle is unstuck, according to Quintana.

1 to 2 p.m. - Children's mom, JoLeta Jenks, calls Aragon saying kids haven't arrived, according to Quintana. Aragon and Quintana drive back to where the children began walking and go on foot to look for them, according to the Blaine County Sheriff's Office.

7 p.m. - A friend of Jenks calls police saying the kids are missing. A Blaine County deputy and a snow plow head out to look for the kids, but they too become stuck after hitting a snow drift and slide off the road, according to the BCSO.

8:30 p.m. - Blaine County Search and Rescue set up on West Magic Road, one mile from the Highway 75, with one vehicle and two snowmobile teams, according to the BCSO.

Also, Quintana says he and Aragon stop their search for the children and meet up with police.

9:50 p.m. - The male child, Bear Aragon, is found in a Bureau of Land Management bathroom, near the intersection of West Magic Road and the Magic Dam Road in Camas County, 4.5 miles from where he began walking. He had hypothermia and was wearing only long underwear, having discarded his jacket, pants and shoes.

10:20 p.m. - Search dogs are deployed to look for the female child, Sage Aragon. The plan was to search from where Bear Aragon was found, back east towards Highway 75, after the boy told authorities he and his sister split up and she walked back to her dad's car.

Dec. 26

2 a.m. - Sage is found unconscious and hypothermic next to a barbed wire fence on the south side of West Magic Road, mostly covered in snow and barely visible. She was wearing a down coat, black shirt, pajama pants and snow boots, according to the BCSO.

4:15 a.m. - Sage is pronounced dead at St. Luke's Wood River Medical Center, according to the BCSO.
http://www.magicvalley.com/art...s/top_story/151787.txt
 

Specop 007

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2005
9,454
0
0
In this day and age it does not suprise me in the least we have parents so sheltered and stupid as to think sending kids off in the cold is perfectly acceptable and carries no risks.

As above, murder not found.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,231
118
116
What kind of idiot lets their pre-teen kids trudge through snow and the freezing cold for 10 miles? :disgust:

Not murder, but ugh, such stupidity.

KT
 

SKORPI0

Lifer
Jan 18, 2000
18,490
2,422
136
Neglect, stupidity and endangerment. Not murder, there was no intent to do so.

Reminds me of the family that got stuck in snow and the father decided to walk back to town get help.
 

Capt Caveman

Lifer
Jan 30, 2005
34,543
651
126
Originally posted by: Soundmanred

Negligent homicide and child neglect.

And sterilization.

Poor kids.
rose.gif
RIP
 

darkxshade

Lifer
Mar 31, 2001
13,749
6
81
obligatory When I was their age I had to walk 10 miles to school in 3 feet of snow going uphill... both ways.
 
Feb 10, 2000
30,029
67
91
The charges sound appropriate to me. God knows how a 55-year-old man could be so stupid as to think this was a reasonable plan.
 

BurnItDwn

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
26,353
1,862
126
If the kids were properly dressed, 0 degrees and several feet of snow would be of no significant danger. Now, expecting a couple of kids to cover 10 miles in foot+ deep snow without proper snowshoes or skis is a bit of a stretch ....

I think the dad should end himself. Guy can't have much left to live for. This is just a horribly sad situation, and just living with the facts is probably more punishment than most people can take.
 

Wheezer

Diamond Member
Nov 2, 1999
6,731
1
81
sorry, but I think extreme stupidity deserves extreme punishment.

I agree with the charge.

No reasonable person no responsible person would allow their children to walk that distance in those circumstances.

We are not talking trudging through the snow in the back yards of come quaint little neighborhood.....this is the wilderness there any number of dangers the children could have faced beside the cold and snow.

How many of you in such a situation would allow your children out of your sight?

His children's safety and well being should have been priority #1 it was not.

Hell, I would not let my dog wonder around in those circumstances.
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,406
19,789
146
Originally posted by: Wheezer
sorry, but I think extreme stupidity deserves extreme punishment.

I agree with the charge.

No treasonable person no responsible person would allow their children to walk that distance in those circumstances.

We are not talking trudging through the snow in the back yards of come quaint little neighborhood.....this is the wilderness there any number of dangers the children could have faced beside the cold and snow.

How many of you in such a situation would allow your children out of your sight?

His children's safety and well being should have been priority #1 it was not.

Hell, I would not let my dog wonder around in those circumstances.

Treasonable? LOL
 

Amused

Elite Member
Apr 14, 2001
57,406
19,789
146
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Amused
Negligent homicide and child neglect.

Seriously.

This.

Murder not found.

Negligent homicide is the same as second degree murder in most states I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong.
 

Tremulant

Diamond Member
Jul 2, 2004
4,890
1
0
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: Wheezer
sorry, but I think extreme stupidity deserves extreme punishment.

I agree with the charge.

No treasonable person no responsible person would allow their children to walk that distance in those circumstances.

We are not talking trudging through the snow in the back yards of come quaint little neighborhood.....this is the wilderness there any number of dangers the children could have faced beside the cold and snow.

How many of you in such a situation would allow your children out of your sight?

His children's safety and well being should have been priority #1 it was not.

Hell, I would not let my dog wonder around in those circumstances.

Treasonable? LOL

Yes, treasonable.

Main Entry:
trea·son·able Listen to the pronunciation of treasonable
Pronunciation:
\'trez-n?-b?l, 'tre-z?-n?-b?l\
Function:
adjective
Date:
14th century

: relating to, consisting of, or involving treason <treasonable words>

:laugh:
 
Dec 26, 2007
11,782
2
76
Originally posted by: KeithTalent
What kind of idiot lets their pre-teen kids trudge through snow and the freezing cold for 10 miles? :disgust:

Not murder, but ugh, such stupidity.

KT

Originally posted by: darkxshade
obligatory When I was their age I had to walk 10 miles to school in 3 feet of snow going uphill... both ways.

Dark beat me to it.
 

jonks

Lifer
Feb 7, 2005
13,918
20
81
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Amused
Negligent homicide and child neglect.

Seriously.

This.

Murder not found.

Negligent homicide is the same as second degree murder in most states I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong.

It's a lesser charge than 2nd degree murder, which requires either intent or recklessness equivalent to intent (firing a gun blindly out your window). Negligent homicide is closer to manslaughter in sentencing terms.

I think the prosecution is putting a lot of weight on the 5 hours that the kids were missing before the police were called.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,351
14
61
I really feel for the dad. I can imagine the kids were whining/crying/screaming after being stuck like that. After a while, I think any parent would be tempted to let the kids walk rather than listen to them.

Tempted is the key word though. I have been tempted to duct tape my son to the wall and superglue his lips shut. I have never done it or even seriously considered it.

I do feel bad for the dad. I also feel bad for people that leave their kids in the car during the summer and fry them. I don't think jail or prison is the right punishment for them though. Loss of all parental rights and agreeing never to reproduce would be something to consider...
 

Specop 007

Diamond Member
Jan 31, 2005
9,454
0
0
Originally posted by: Wheezer
sorry, but I think extreme stupidity deserves extreme punishment.

I agree with the charge.

No reasonable person no responsible person would allow their children to walk that distance in those circumstances.

We are not talking trudging through the snow in the back yards of come quaint little neighborhood.....this is the wilderness there any number of dangers the children could have faced beside the cold and snow.

How many of you in such a situation would allow your children out of your sight?

His children's safety and well being should have been priority #1 it was not.

Hell, I would not let my dog wonder around in those circumstances.

Emotions make a poor measure for punishment. Sure it was damn dumb to let the kid go and yes people are sad to hear of children freezing to death because of dumb ole dad but that should be used as the measure for his punishment.

And as I said in my first post, it doesnt suprise me in the least. We have a civilization so sheltered and pampered many aspects of the cold harsh reality we live in are lost upon them. No pun intended.
 

clamum

Lifer
Feb 13, 2003
26,256
406
126
It's a shame the girl died and the Dad I'm sure would rather trade his life to get her's back, but goddamn, that was an incredibly stupid decision. I don't think he meant for it in anyway, but he should get negligent homicide or something like that, not murder.
 

KeithTalent

Elite Member | Administrator | No Lifer
Administrator
Nov 30, 2005
50,231
118
116
Originally posted by: DisgruntledVirus
Originally posted by: KeithTalent
What kind of idiot lets their pre-teen kids trudge through snow and the freezing cold for 10 miles? :disgust:

Not murder, but ugh, such stupidity.

KT

Originally posted by: darkxshade
obligatory When I was their age I had to walk 10 miles to school in 3 feet of snow going uphill... both ways.

Dark beat me to it.

Funny thing is this is partly true for me. When I was growing up in Winnipeg (from 6 years old to 14), I walked to school every morning in the Winter and it got below -30C with 2 or 3 feet of snow. I walked with friends and it was nowhere near 10 miles away, but we did it every day and we liked it damn it!

KT
 

waggy

No Lifer
Dec 14, 2000
68,143
10
81
i have to agree that murder is not the correct charge. though letting the two kids walk off in that weather alone and not properly dressed is insane.

also they knew the kids were missing at noon and didnt call teh cops until 7pm! WTF


 

DrPizza

Administrator Elite Member Goat Whisperer
Mar 5, 2001
49,601
167
111
www.slatebrookfarm.com
By the time I was 6 or 7 years old, I was allowed to grab my sled and go out sledding. I'd be gone from whatever time I got permission until it was dark outside. HOWEVER, my mom was really picky about the weather conditions outside. I can remember not being allowed to go sledding if it was "too cold outside." I don't know what temperature my mother used as criteria, but I do know that I was allowed outside in below freezing temperatures. And I can remember the achy painful feeling as my toes warmed up on some occasions.

HOWEVER,
Quintana says he and Aragon searched and yelled out for the children for at least four hours, with towels wrapped around their heads, but they stopped as hypothermia set in. He said he had no cell phone reception in the search area.
'They found her (Sage Aragon) a mile and a half from where I turned around," Quintana said. "If we had kept going, we could have gotten her in time. I just couldn't go anymore, I was so tired. The whole time, we were yelling for the children, our eyes and throat were wind burnt."

There's no way in the world my parents would have allowed me to go outside unsupervised in conditions like that.
 

rudeguy

Lifer
Dec 27, 2001
47,351
14
61
To answer the original question:
Yes he should be charged.

Should he be convicted? I don't know.
 

DesiPower

Lifer
Nov 22, 2008
15,299
740
126
Release on grounds of temporary insanity, similar to what pedophiles and rapists get