Should the mentally ill or mentally disabled be barred from voting?

[Fanatical Meat]

So a physically disabled person shouldn't be allowed to vote, while a mentally disabled person should... seems rather backwards to me.

You seemed to have missed the "whatever it takes to vote" part. I'm done responding to you this is a silly thing to drone on and on about.

 

[shira]

I would think that 10,000s of people could sway an election.

Why should people that have been found to be legally unable to take care of themselves be able to have say over other people's lives?

Because these people can still hold an opinion of what they want their government to do or not to do. And since government policies can definitely affect their own lives, why on earth should YOU be able to vote for policies that may affect them while they're not allowed to vote for policies that may affect you?

Can you honestly be this small-minded?

 

[JEDIYoda]

Can you honestly be this small-minded?

yes, he can.........

 

[Darwin333]

So lets be clear. We are talking about people who are not able to take care of themselves.

If you cannot manage your own life why should you have power over other people's lives?

Always remember that eventually someone who you completely disagree with will have the ability to rewrite or amend the rules. Do you really want someone on the opposite side of the political spectrum redefining what is or is not considered a disability that bars you from voting?

I highly doubt that there are enough mentally disabled people that actually vote to sway many elections, especially on the Federal level. Regardless, I'm not a fan of the .gov encroaching on our rights at all so I say yes they absolutely should be allowed to vote.

 

[Imaginer]

No, this would be outright discriminatory.

And this is also a reason why we have a REPRESENATIVE Democracy and an electoral college for Presidency.

We vote for our own state representatives and on a city level, office positions that ensure the city, services, and facilities operate to the community's desires. These representatives in turn, decide for us as a representative body for the encompassing upper level of government - because they are a consolidated knowledge base of centralized facilitation on a state level of services, systems, business, and logistics.

A purely, each voting person, deciding democracy would not be ideal to begin with anyways, as it is on the ONUS of each person to decide on every little functioning thing ON TOP OF the normal day jobs each person has.

 

[Darwin333]

I would think that 10,000s of people could sway an election.

Why should people that have been found to be legally unable to take care of themselves be able to have say over other people's lives?

And you are perfectly ok with Obama or a Dem super majority Congress having the ability to determine and/or amend that legal definition?

Hell I consider a person who doesn't have a job unable to take care of themselves so does that mean perfectly sane and sound minded house wives shouldn't be able to vote by your definition?

As much as your side fights for the 2nd amendment yall sure don't seem to care much about our other rights...

 

[Fanatical Meat]

No, this would be outright discriminatory.

And this is also a reason why we have a REPRESENATIVE Democracy and an electoral college for Presidency.

We vote for our own state representatives and on a city level, office positions that ensure the city, services, and facilities operate to the community's desires. These representatives in turn, decide for us as a representative body for the encompassing upper level of government - because they are a consolidated knowledge base of centralized facilitation on a state level of services, systems, business, and logistics.

A purely, each voting person, deciding democracy would not be ideal to begin with anyways, as it is on the ONUS of each person to decide on every little functioning thing ON TOP OF the normal day jobs each person has.

Knowledge bomb deployed

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

So...why aren't children allowed to vote?

 

[Imaginer]

So...why aren't children allowed to vote?

For the same reason why we do not allow them to participate in the defense of our country - not being classified as adults in our society (coming of age).

 

[JEDIYoda]

So...why aren't children allowed to vote?

always a goofball in the crowd

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

For the same reason why we do not allow them to participate in the defense of our country - not being classified as adults in our society (coming of age).

What's the difference between adults and children?

What's the difference between mentally deficient adults and children?

 

[Imaginer]

What's the difference between adults and children?

What's the difference between mentally deficient adults and children?

The difference is, "mentally deficient" is a fringe case and is factored out in a typical distribution representative pull of a voting populace. Children is just that, they need to be educated, brought up, and be knowledgeable to use the tools, systems, and facilitate communications at hand.

Also, "mentally deficient" in definition can be very much a broad, gray spectrum with no easy hard lines that filter who can absolutely take part in being vocal or not. Hence it would be very very discriminatory. "Stupid" can be also such, because what "stupid" is is a response taken out of context of the subject at hand.

By that definition above, we are all "deficient", thus we ALL CAN'T vote.

You would not want kids to start driving cars and bikes outright, due to 1. cars are not designed to accommodate the growing, ever changing body, and 2. experience and learned behaviors of society to adequately behave with calm and reason, in other words - not juvenile.

Also, these are factored out overall under a REPRESENTATIVE populace under our current REPRESENTATIVE democracy.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

Because these people can still hold an opinion of what they want their government to do or not to do. And since government policies can definitely affect their own lives, why on earth should YOU be able to vote for policies that may affect them while they're not allowed to vote for policies that may affect you?

Can you honestly be this small-minded?

If holding an opinion were the only consideration then children should be allowed to vote along side mentally ill or mentally deficient people who cannot take care of themselves or in many cases have the mental capacity of a small child or less.

 

[DucatiMonster696]

For the same reason why we do not allow them to participate in the defense of our country - not being classified as adults in our society (coming of age).

Which for say teens is a arbitrary number set by society in many cases.

 

[pcgeek11]

I can see where this could have some very grey areas. Also where it would be taken advantage of.

Then again I don't see how we would allow persons that have to have constant adult supervision the ability to vote. When they have the mental capacity of say a 4 year old, they wouldn't even understand what they were doing.

Then the bigger issue of how to draw the line.

 

[Mr. Pedantic]

The difference is, "mentally deficient" is a fringe case and is factored out in a typical distribution representative pull of a voting populace. Children is just that, they need to be educated, brought up, and be knowledgeable to use the tools, systems, and facilitate communications at hand.

Mental deficiency is actually relatively common. Most are minor, but the prevalence of severe mental deficiency is around 0.5-1%. It's especially important in countries such as the United States where nationally, the percentage difference between the major parties is very rarely above low single digits.

Also, you're thinking of "children" as pre-adolescent. And you're also assuming that mentally deficient adults don't need to be educated, or taught to communicate.

Also, "mentally deficient" in definition can be very much a broad, gray spectrum with no easy hard lines that filter who can absolutely take part in being vocal or not. Hence it would be very very discriminatory. "Stupid" can be also such, because what "stupid" is is a response taken out of context of the subject at hand.

As are children.

By that definition above, we are all "deficient", thus we ALL CAN'T vote.

False equivalency.

You would not want kids to start driving cars and bikes outright, due to 1. cars are not designed to accommodate the growing, ever changing body, and 2. experience and learned behaviors of society to adequately behave with calm and reason, in other words - not juvenile.

Also, these are factored out overall under a REPRESENTATIVE populace under our current REPRESENTATIVE democracy.

It's interesting, because people often start driving cars and riding bikes as children. As for your actual reasons:

1. Seats are adjustable for a reason.
2. Is that why the minimum driving age is variable in the US? It's almost like the age is...arbitrary...! Also, is that the reason why the minimum age to drink is 21, but the age to join the army is 18? Why the minimum age to watch porn is 18, but the age to have sex is only 16 (again, variable across the US), and the age to smoke pot is...never?

 

[sportage]

it would seem the mentally challenged/disabled are the ones that Do vote.

I mean, we see this lady running for the senate that claims her castrating of farm animals is her plus. She will get many votes Im sure.
Or that candidate that believes a woman's mental-will can be considered effective birth control. He will get many votes Im sure.
Or those politicians that believe climate change is just an illusion, while Texas burns, tornadoes level Missouri, and homes float away in the midwest.
They will get many votes Im sure.
So tell me, who are the true mentally disabled?

I suppose if a law was passed to block the mentally disabled from voting, any law like that should be linked to also blocking the same from then running for office.
Especially running on the record of castration.

As predicted in the biblical book of Revelations, the end of the world must be truly near....

 

[nehalem256]

Because these people can still hold an opinion of what they want their government to do or not to do. And since government policies can definitely affect their own lives, why on earth should YOU be able to vote for policies that may affect them while they're not allowed to vote for policies that may affect you?

Can you honestly be this small-minded?

Because I haven't been appointed a legal guardian by the court system; in essence having been found to be mentally a child.

Always remember that eventually someone who you completely disagree with will have the ability to rewrite or amend the rules. Do you really want someone on the opposite side of the political spectrum redefining what is or is not considered a disability that bars you from voting?

I highly doubt that there are enough mentally disabled people that actually vote to sway many elections, especially on the Federal level. Regardless, I'm not a fan of the .gov encroaching on our rights at all so I say yes they absolutely should be allowed to vote.

If someone is appointed a legal guardian this seems like a pretty extreme mental disability. The need for said legal guardian also seems like a nice safeguard from abuse.

As per the OP, ~40,000 such people exist in California alone. Pretty sure there have been statewide elections decided by less than 40,000 people.

You seemed to have missed the "whatever it takes to vote" part. I'm done responding to you this is a silly thing to drone on and on about.

And all the things you mentioned clearly required the ability to use your hands. So as I said a physically disabled adult should be prohibited from voting, but a 3 year should be allowed to vote by your criteria

 

[Exterous]

No, this is ripe for abuse.

Completely agree. Certainly I can see the appeal but any benefit derived is massively offset by the chances of abuse and removing the right to vote should be a very tough thing to do for obvious reasons