Should OEMs remove the floppy from their standard list of parts on new machines now?

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Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
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He** yes!
Apple did it, and I salute them for it, good move.

We need to ditch some of the old crap, the more legacy junk that tags along, the slower the adoption of newer technologies will be.
Floppys have long since outlived their usefullness.
They're unreliable, capacity is pathetic, and they hold almost no benefits compared to CD-RW's, unless you constantly move around 1 MB files and don't have access to email.
 

T2T III

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
12,899
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I'm using a laptop safely without a floppy drive. If I need information off of a floppy, I can place the disc in my base station and upload it from there. However, as mentioned, the other 99% of the population is quite limited with access and knowledge - so, they need floppy drives.

You know you're in trouble if you need to buy some floppy discs at the store ... and a 10 pack of floppies cost more than a 50-disc spindle of CDR discs. :(
 

majewski9

Platinum Member
Jun 26, 2001
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Actually I dont think most people use floppies. I use them for the occasional bios flash or when I have to specifially turn something in on one. The floppy is already disppearing and it is inevitable. Flash, ZIP, EMAIL, and Compactflash have made the floppy obselete. I just wish someone would tell the big OEMS this!
 

MadRat

Lifer
Oct 14, 1999
11,999
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Wow, 3:1 so far in favor of the floppy?!!

Even my dad, bless his heart, has learned to burn CDRs over floppies.

When he saw the cost difference it was a simple choice!

Perhaps people really need a way to flash the BIOS from a CDRW?
 

Insane3D

Elite Member
May 24, 2000
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Perhaps people really need a way to flash the BIOS from a CDRW?

Why, it is easily done now. Simply make a bootable CD with a CDRW, put the flash program and the bios file on it, boot from the CD, run the flash and voilla.

Even that is getting obsolete with the newer boards all coming with Windows based flashers. I used to use a bootable CDRW to flash my bioses with Awdflash, but ever since I got my newer Epox KT333 and Nforce 2 boards, I use the handy little Winflash program that comes with them to flash in the windows enviroment. It's quick, easy, and you don't lose your current bios settings.

:)
 

bgeh

Platinum Member
Nov 16, 2001
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the floppy won't die for a long time
in malaysia, the amount of users using floppys to carry files outnumber the amount of users that use cd-rws to carry files by 10 to 1
maybe cd-rw need more time

Long live the floppy:)
 

topaz22

Senior member
Dec 9, 1999
208
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i still have a 5.25 floppy drive in one of my machines! floppy drives do come in handy from time to time (flashing bios, recovery of win98 drives), but other than that, seems like its seldomly used. they don't cost much, so its woth paying the minimal cost to have it there for times of need..

 

tornadobox

Platinum Member
Jun 3, 2001
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I voted no, I use my floppy drive to auto-backup my Microsoft Money file every day (would be terrible if I lost that info!). I just disabled it as a boot item in the BIOS :)
 

T2T III

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
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Originally posted by: tornadobox
I voted no, I use my floppy drive to auto-backup my Microsoft Money file every day (would be terrible if I lost that info!). I just disabled it as a boot item in the BIOS :)
Yeah, but you could also back your MS Money file up to a USB pen or other USB storage device. These portable devices only run about $20 and go up from there. The 32 MB version would be more than enough for you. I think this method of storage would be much more reliable. I've had way too many floppies bit the dust on me with good data on them.
 

Mem

Lifer
Apr 23, 2000
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I say keep the floppy,I still use mine even though I`ve a CDRW drive.
 

Kingofcomputer

Diamond Member
Apr 6, 2000
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Most of us are computer elitists. So we dont use floppies. But we only represent less than 1% of the world's computer users. So in the rest of the 99%, 90% of them are n00bs, and they use floppies. So no, they shouldnt remove floppy drivs. Because then chaos will fall upon all n00bs.
What's the logic here?
computer elitists = don't use floppy?
proof please?
 

thorin

Diamond Member
Oct 9, 1999
7,573
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Originally posted by: SOSTrooper
Most of us are computer elitists. So we dont use floppies. But we only represent less than 1% of the world's computer users. So in the rest of the 99%, 90% of them are n00bs, and they use floppies. So no, they shouldnt remove floppy drivs. Because then chaos will fall upon all n00bs.
Most of us are computer elitists. So we still use floppies. But we only represent less than 1% of the world's computer users. So in the rest of the 99%, 90% of them are n00bs, and they use floppies. So no, they shouldnt remove floppy drives. Because ~91% of users (n00bs and elitists) still use them.
Originally posted by: compudog
I consider myself to be a computer elitist (I have built hundreds of PCs for myself and for others) and I still use a floppy. The USB thumb/pen devices are great, and I will use them whenever possible, but I still run into some PCs where there are no USB ports and I have to get files into them some way. I think, for at least another year or so, floppies will still be used. I'll not be sad to see them go, but I think we still need them around.
Well said. Floppies still have many uses until the legacy free computer happens, and until burning a CDRW is just as cheap/quick OR USB Pen Drives are widely available and affordable.

Thorin

 

Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
11,641
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Burning a CD-RW is far quicker as long as you go over the limit of what fits on one floppy, which is most of the time these days.
The only time I copy small stuff that would fit on a floppy is when I wanna hand people documents and such, and in those cases an email is faster, more reliable, and faster.

As for cheap, floppys cost more CD's these days.
 

buleyb

Golden Member
Aug 12, 2002
1,301
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I want it to go, but I want a better replacement than CDs. How long until they make those usb flash drives bootable? That would be a solution to all my uses for floppies.
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,066
4,712
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1) Speed: Floppy drives are far faster than any CDRW. 5 seconds and most files (remember we are talking about small things used on a floppy) are saved/loaded - it takes 5 seconds just for the CD drive to get up to speed in order to start reading/writing a CD.

2) Cost: Get one floppy disk in the mail free from AOL and you are set for life - how much have you spend on CDRs just for a one time file use? Plus the cost of the drive itself is so much cheaper. I have no need to burn CDs, so when I got a new computer 3 months ago, it came with a floppy and a normal CD drive. Even if taking out the floppy saved me $5, it would cost me $20 to switch to a CDRW drive.

3) Older machines. Sadly older computers cannot boot from a CD drive. I realize that many of you cannot understand how many people still use old computers. Maybe in time you will be able to comprehend this. I still have one machine at home that I use that cannot boot from a CD, and several at work. Just for fun try formatting a hard drive on one of these computers without a floppy drive. Or what happens if you accidently get corrupted CD drivers on your hard drive - older computers need these drivers to use the CD drive, and if your drivers are sitting on a CD, good luck using them.

4) There is no drawback from having a floppy. It isn't like it slows down your computer or anything.

5) Universal. If I put a file on a floppy, I'm guaranteed that any computer I have access to can read it. The same isn't true with some school computers and CDRs. They often have older CD drives that cannot read burned CDs.

6) Working on the same file on multiple computers: Even with a good CD burner at home, I couldn't do much with it since the computers at school/work don't have CD burners. So I could transport the file one direction but not the other.



Other than saving $5 you haven't given a single reason not to include them.
 

Sunner

Elite Member
Oct 9, 1999
11,641
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Originally posted by: dullard
1) Speed: Floppy drives are far faster than any CDRW. 5 seconds and most files (remember we are talking about small things used on a floppy) are saved/loaded - it takes 5 seconds just for the CD drive to get up to speed in order to start reading/writing a CD.

2) Cost: Get one floppy disk in the mail free from AOL and you are set for life - how much have you spend on CDRs just for a one time file use? Plus the cost of the drive itself is so much cheaper. I have no need to burn CDs, so when I got a new computer 3 months ago, it came with a floppy and a normal CD drive. Even if taking out the floppy saved me $5, it would cost me $20 to switch to a CDRW drive.

3) Older machines. Sadly older computers cannot boot from a CD drive. I realize that many of you cannot understand how many people still use old computers. Maybe in time you will be able to comprehend this. I still have one machine at home that I use that cannot boot from a CD, and several at work. Just for fun try formatting a hard drive on one of these computers without a floppy drive. Or what happens if you accidently get corrupted CD drivers on your hard drive - older computers need these drivers to use the CD drive, and if your drivers are sitting on a CD, good luck using them.

4) There is no drawback from having a floppy. It isn't like it slows down your computer or anything.

5) Universal. If I put a file on a floppy, I'm guaranteed that any computer I have access to can read it. The same isn't true with some school computers and CDRs. They often have older CD drives that cannot read burned CDs.

6) Working on the same file on multiple computers: Even with a good CD burner at home, I couldn't do much with it since the computers at school/work don't have CD burners. So I could transport the file one direction but not the other.



Other than saving $5 you haven't given a single reason not to include them.

1: As I've said, for files that small, you can just use email, or whatever, even my grandma knows how to do that.

2: Skip the floppy and the CD-ROM and you've nearly covered the cost of a CD-RW instead, if you can't spare $10-20 you shouldn't be buying computer parts anyway.

3: This discussion is about not putting floppys in newer boxes, not ripping them out of 486's.
Oh and even my old POS P-MMX 166 can boot from CD.

4: Yes there is, as long as they're assumed to be present, lazy companies won't bother moving on, Windows setup is the perfect example, you can't even load extra drivers from a CD for crying out, you think that would be the case if we'd only gotten with the times and killed the floppy way back in the mid 90's when it deserved to die?

5: Seriously, this isn't an issue with any computer that's even remotely useful today.
Ok, a few really really...really old computers might have a problem, but let's face it, sooner or later you're gonna have to ditch the junk to make progress, just throw that 486 out the window and be done with it, we don't keep 20 km/h speed limits on the roads so the one T-Ford owner can feel safe.

6: Ok, this is actually a decent point, but again, just mail it.
Or upload it to some free storage site.
There must be a million ways to avoid this.

Again, my one biggest complaint about floppys is, as long as they're there, everyone will keep making drivers, BIOS flash programs, etc etc, that are made for them, and for most intents and purposes, floppys suck big time.
 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,066
4,712
126
The problem with email is time and connections. In my office at work we have 10 computers and can afford 4 connections. What do I do if I want to send a file to the computers without internet connections? If it is a 1 MB file, why should I wait 5 minutes for my modem to download/upload the file? The cost of giving them all internet connections would be nearly a thousand dollars per year. The cost of adding CDRWs to all the computers would be hundreds of dollars. I'd sure rather just use a $5 floppy drive and a free AOL floppy disk, and pocket the rest of the money myself.

If you get a BIOS/driver on a floppy and you don't like floppy's you can burn them yourself to a CD. That way everyone can be happy - you can use CDs and the rest of us can use floppies.

In about 2-3 years all those old computers that cannot boot from CDs or cannot read burned CDs will be practically gone. But it still will take 5-10 years for CDRWs to be practically universal on computers. If you want to speed that up, complain about the price of the CD burner, don't complain about floppy drives.
 

buleyb

Golden Member
Aug 12, 2002
1,301
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Well the real problem with CDRWs is that old bootable drive thing. CDRWs are nice for sharing files inside an OS, but they don't cut it for booting a DOS system and flashing a BIOS, especially if you need some place to save things.


and Dullard, you're missing the point. If you need a floppy because you have old systems, you could have it as an option. The rest of us would like to move on though...

 

dullard

Elite Member
May 21, 2001
26,066
4,712
126
and Dullard, you're missing the point. If you need a floppy because you have old systems, you could have it as an option. The rest of us would like to move on though...
Many companies do have it as an option already - so what is the point of the thread then?

 

buleyb

Golden Member
Aug 12, 2002
1,301
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Originally posted by: dullard
and Dullard, you're missing the point. If you need a floppy because you have old systems, you could have it as an option. The rest of us would like to move on though...
Many companies do have it as an option already - so what is the point of the thread then?

Well I know gateway does, and I have known of smaller vendors that do. But I think its a odd signal that Dell doesn't give it as a removable option on its Home or business desktops.
 

stranger707

Member
Apr 6, 2000
140
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Floppies are a universal storage medium that everyone understands how to use and still have valuable uses. How many times have you installed programs (such as McAfee VirusScan, or Partition Magic) and the program offers to make recovery disks. They don't offer to make a recovery CD.

The floppy may be 20 year old technology, but it still works. And it works every time. I don't know how many computers I have seen that supposedly will Boot from a CD and skip right over the damn thing looking for the hard drive. And dullard is right, you don't even have to buy the things. AOL and a host of other companies send them out for free.