Should Obama lie more?

[fskimospy]

Why doesn't Obama lie more?

Basically the article states that McCain so far hasn't paid much of a penalty for an avalance of massive and unrelenting lies. Even when fact checking organizations all across the country repeatedly expose these lies, he continues with them.

So my question is, should Obama start lying too? I mean, if it's come to this point that your opponent shows such a wanton disregard for the truth, is your only choice to stoop down into the gutter with him? The problem with this is that Obama has pledged a new kind of politics, one that's supposed to be above this. (of course McCain used to pledge the same thing... but too late for that one eh?) What is more important, winning or principle?

 

[Stoneburner]

Obama did stretch the truth with mccaains 100 years in Iraq remark and his $5 million dollar remark. But I agree, he should claim McCain is bush's illegitimate child and that the viet cong have brainwashed him.

 

[sandorski]

The Democrats have more of a Conscience. So it seems anyway, Republicans don't care, anything can be done as long as Power is achieved. As soon as Democrats begin getting shady though, Democrats begin jumping ship and turning on their own Party.

 

[StageLeft]

Hard to say because if he cannot win he cannot get in there with non-gutter stuff. I would much rather he build a case that convinces retarded monkies (i.e. most of the voters out there) about the illegitimacy of the lies.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Stoneburner
Obama did stretch the truth with mccaains 100 years in Iraq remark and his $5 million dollar remark. But I agree, he should claim McCain is bush's illegitimate child and that the viet cong have brainwashed him.

Oh, I wasn't saying Obama has never lied or stretched the truth or whatever, but he hasn't even come into the same ballpark as McCain. So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

 

[TheVrolok]

I just don't see how Obama can win unless he starts rebutting these absurd lies with more force.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

 

[OrByte]

The type of lies coming from McCains camp is unprecedented. Every politican stretches the truth to fit their message.

McCain is just flat out lying and denying things.

In the end I still say Obama needs to stick to his message.

Was Hillary's campaign really that much more different than McCains?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

McCain has a Black Baby.

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

From a tactical standpoint the article had some good ideas. Painting McCain as an insane warmonger probably would get people to believe things they are already predisposed to think about him anyway. People probably wouldn't like the idea of McCain going to war with Iran and/or Russia.

I don't really want to discuss specific lies though, just the question of whether or not Obama should begin these sorts of smears, considering the complete disregard for the truth that McCain has been displaying. Again, what is more important winning or principle? I for one would probably go with winning.

 

[Gooberlx2]

Originally posted by: TheVrolok
I just don't see how Obama can win unless he starts rebutting these absurd lies with more force.

Shit...I think he needs to get more campaign ads out. I've been seeing McCain ads at probably a 3 or 4-to-1 ratio vs Obama. Maybe it's the stations I've been watching recently, but I wouldn't think so. (A&E, TruTV, FX, TNT, USA)

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

From a tactical standpoint the article had some good ideas. Painting McCain as an insane warmonger probably would get people to believe things they are already predisposed to think about him anyway. People probably wouldn't like the idea of McCain going to war with Iran and/or Russia.

I don't really want to discuss specific lies though, just the question of whether or not Obama should begin these sorts of smears, considering the complete disregard for the truth that McCain has been displaying. Again, what is more important winning or principle? I for one would probably go with winning.

I think it's better to stick to principles. Eventually the People will come around and see who is better. Stooping to those levels just undermines oneself in the longrun.

 

[OCGuy]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

McCain has a Black Baby.

Well, that might be a + for Mccain. It would help balance out some of the racist voting that will go on for BHObama.

 

[Fern]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

McCain has a Black Baby.

I thought the point was lies, not stealing Bush's campaign material.

I'm very curious about what lies in specifics. I think that might be difficult to pull-off since McCain has been around so long, run for POTUS before and is well known.

Otherwise, the Dems look to be pretty crappy at lying. It ain't for lack of trying, they tried it mightily with *Palin the Unknown* but came away with nothing good to show for it.

Fern

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Ocguy31

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

McCain has a Black Baby.

Well, that might be a + for Mccain. It would help balance out some of the racist voting that will go on for BHObama.

The voting for Obama is not based on racism, it's based on partisanship. If you go look at John Kerry's and Al Gore's share of the black vote you will see that it's very close to the same as what Obama is getting right now. Obama's is slightly higher, but by no means is it that different. (last time I checked Obama was at about 93%, Gore got 90% if I remember right)

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

McCain has a Black Baby.

I thought the point was lies, not stealing Bush's campaign material.

I'm very curious about what lies in specifics. I think that might be difficult to pull-off since McCain has been around so long, run for POTUS before and is well known.

Otherwise, the Dems look to be pretty crappy at lying. It ain't for lack of trying, they tried it mightily with *Palin the Unknown* but came away with nothing good to show for it.

Fern

Same thing really, no? Might as well use what has proven to work!

 

[Fern]

Oh jeebus, no wonder the Dems are bad at lying. Check this one out:

The misstatements of 2004 suggest a category of lies that Obama could get away with?ones that the public is already primed to believe about McCain. McCain's signature policy goal is cutting out earmarks. But as the Washington Monthly's Steve Benen points out, in promising to veto all earmarks, McCain has inadvertently called for cutting some popular programs?including all U.S. assistance to Israel, which is technically provided through a kind of earmark. Of course McCain doesn't really want to stop giving aid to Israel; an ad that suggested McCain's cost-cutting zeal would lead to abandoning Israel would be as dishonest as McCain's sex-ed ad. But it might also be effective, reinforcing the idea that McCain wants to cut too much.

Bwuhahaha,

First, they act like people think the government CAN cut spending too much. Hell, everybody's been complaining for years about spending. Cutting too much is inconceivable as a negative thingy to label a politician with. Cutting THEIR favorite program is what annoys people, but the problem with that is there is only small audience for any one program - and no, fear mongering about SS won't work any more.

Second problem, every election we hear about cutting. Does it happen? Nope. I don't think anybody would believe a lie of that type.

Other possible lies:
- McCain is senile. Nope, that's already been tried
- McCain is clueless about the economy. Same as above.
- McCain wants to stay in Iraq for a 100 yrs. Same as above
- Mcain cheats on his wife. Same as above

Come to think of it, they've made a pretty thorough effort, but got nothing out of it.

They can't say a lie like - McCain supports gay marriage, or gays in the military or is for abortion - he might end up with more votes.

Fern

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

From a tactical standpoint the article had some good ideas. Painting McCain as an insane warmonger probably would get people to believe things they are already predisposed to think about him anyway. People probably wouldn't like the idea of McCain going to war with Iran and/or Russia.

I don't really want to discuss specific lies though, just the question of whether or not Obama should begin these sorts of smears, considering the complete disregard for the truth that McCain has been displaying. Again, what is more important winning or principle? I for one would probably go with winning.

I think it's better to stick to principles. Eventually the People will come around and see who is better. Stooping to those levels just undermines oneself in the longrun.

LOL...did you grow up in a cave on the moon with your eyes shut and your fingers stuck in your ears? This is America we're talking about here...Paris Hilton is a celebrity!

 

[fskimospy]

Originally posted by: Fern

Bwuhahaha,

First, they act like people think the government CAN cut spending too much. Hell, everybody's been complaining for years about spending. Cutting too much is inconceivable as a negative thingy to label a politician with. Cutting THEIR favorite program is what annoys people, but the problem with that is there is only small audience for any one program - and no, fear mongering about SS won't work any more.

Second problem, every election we hear about cutting. Does it happen? Nope. I don't think anybody would believe a lie of that type.

Other possible lies:
- McCain is senile. Nope, that's already been tried
- McCain is clueless about the economy. Same as above.
- McCain wants to stay in Iraq for a 100 yrs. Same as above
- Mcain cheats on his wife. Same as above

Come to think of it, they've made a pretty thorough effort, but got nothing out of it.

They can't say a lie like - McCain supports gay marriage, or gays in the military or is for abortion - he might end up with more votes.

Fern

Actually the argument against cutting spending too much works incredibly well everywhere but on this forum. This place is in some sort of bizarro libertarianism bubble.

Cutting popular social programs = political death. Look at the buzzsaw Bush ran into when he tried to change social security. All the Democrats did was say "you're going to decrease people's benefits", and Bush was toast. I bet you tons of children's programs, things like that are funded that way. Run an ad talking about how McCain wants to cut off funding to Israel and abandon children's programs and you might have a winner there.

EDIT: To be clear, I think that fear monering about popular programs will be extremely effective, especially in this economy. That includes social security.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

From a tactical standpoint the article had some good ideas. Painting McCain as an insane warmonger probably would get people to believe things they are already predisposed to think about him anyway. People probably wouldn't like the idea of McCain going to war with Iran and/or Russia.

I don't really want to discuss specific lies though, just the question of whether or not Obama should begin these sorts of smears, considering the complete disregard for the truth that McCain has been displaying. Again, what is more important winning or principle? I for one would probably go with winning.

I think it's better to stick to principles. Eventually the People will come around and see who is better. Stooping to those levels just undermines oneself in the longrun.

LOL...did you grow up in a cave on the moon with your eyes shut and your fingers stuck in your ears? This is America we're talking about here...Paris Hilton is a celebrity!

No, but I have Hope that people will get their act together.

 

[jonks]

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

I don't think He needs to lie, but if he did get really fast and loose with the facts, I'd do the following:

Start with one against Palin hitting hard on her wanting to charge traumatized rape victims $750 for the collection of DNA evidence. And when the Alaska state legislature eventually passed legislation banning the practice, Palin's handpicked police chief complained about the cost to taxpayers. No, there's no evidence Palin really "wanted" this, but it existed under her administration in Wasilla, and that's too subtle a difference for most tv watchers to figure out.

As for McCain, pull out the old gem about his calling his captors Gooks and contrast it with him claiming he "doesn't have a prejudiced bone in his body." Don't forget his hysterical joke he told at a republican dinner about how ugly chelsea clinton is. Charming. Then there's the old saw about him calling his wife a C**T.

There's ammunition aplenty. But Obama is as far as I can tell way above it. He may lose for it, I mean, Bush beat McCain in the primaries with that whole "your wife is a drug addict and you fathered an illegitimate black child" campaign. Now that's how you win elections.

 

[JS80]

Originally posted by: PingSpike

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: eskimospy

Originally posted by: Fern

Originally posted by: eskimospy
-snip-
So, the question isn't if Obama should lie at all, but if he should lie much more and much larger.

What lies do you recommend?

Fern

From a tactical standpoint the article had some good ideas. Painting McCain as an insane warmonger probably would get people to believe things they are already predisposed to think about him anyway. People probably wouldn't like the idea of McCain going to war with Iran and/or Russia.

I don't really want to discuss specific lies though, just the question of whether or not Obama should begin these sorts of smears, considering the complete disregard for the truth that McCain has been displaying. Again, what is more important winning or principle? I for one would probably go with winning.

I think it's better to stick to principles. Eventually the People will come around and see who is better. Stooping to those levels just undermines oneself in the longrun.

LOL...did you grow up in a cave on the moon with your eyes shut and your fingers stuck in your ears? This is America we're talking about here...Paris Hilton is a celebrity!

you make it sound like in europe writers and noble prize winners are celebs.

 

[senseamp]

Because American people deserve to have better presidents than John McCain. If everyone runs campaigns like a scumbag, we'll only have scumbag presidents.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: eskimospy
Topic Title: Should Obama lie more?

Why doesn't Obama lie more?

Basically the article states that McCain so far hasn't paid much of a penalty for an avalance of massive and unrelenting lies. Even when fact checking organizations all across the country repeatedly expose these lies, he continues with them.

So my question is, should Obama start lying too? I mean, if it's come to this point that your opponent shows such a wanton disregard for the truth, is your only choice to stoop down into the gutter with him? The problem with this is that Obama has pledged a new kind of politics, one that's supposed to be above this. (of course McCain used to pledge the same thing... but too late for that one eh?) What is more important, winning or principle?

Palin is destroying what little chance the Dems had with her awesome lying skills.

 

[winnar111]

Originally posted by: jonks

I don't think He needs to lie, but if he did get really fast and loose with the facts, I'd do the following:

Start with one against Palin hitting hard on her wanting to charge traumatized rape victims $750 for the collection of DNA evidence. And when the Alaska state legislature eventually passed legislation banning the practice, Palin's handpicked police chief complained about the cost to taxpayers. No, there's no evidence Palin really "wanted" this, but it existed under her administration in Wasilla, and that's too subtle a difference for most tv watchers to figure out.

As for McCain, pull out the old gem about his calling his captors Gooks and contrast it with him claiming he "doesn't have a prejudiced bone in his body." Don't forget his hysterical joke he told at a republican dinner about how ugly chelsea clinton is. Charming. Then there's the old saw about him calling his wife a C**T.

There's ammunition aplenty. But Obama is as far as I can tell way above it. He may lose for it, I mean, Bush beat McCain in the primaries with that whole "your wife is a drug addict and you fathered an illegitimate black child" campaign. Now that's how you win elections.

Good luck with that bit about McCain I guess. He's entitled to hate them.