should felons permanently lose the right to vote?

[Jeff7]

No. I don't understand the absolute hatred and lust to punish instead of rehabilitate that so many seem to embrace. First of all, it is easy as shit to get some low level felonies. This trend we see of politicians who have to be "tough on crime" is wildy destructive to society. Many of us seem happy to lock up and throw away the key and have the gall to act surprised when systemically marginalized offenders happen to be all but forced into repeating their criminality because so called civilized society tells them to pound sand.

Puritan values, love of Scarlet Letter punishments, for-profit prisons. High recidivism rate = repeat business.


The US has to do what it can to maintain its award-winningly-high imprisonment rate.

 

[glenn1]

Generally speaking voting rights should be restored. However for crimes like vote or election fraud, disenfranchisement might be exactly the correct punishment.

 

[ch33zw1z]

I voted No. I don't think they should lose it, ever. Especially after they've paid their debt to society.

 

[ch33zw1z]

Generally speaking voting rights should be restored. However for crimes like vote or election fraud, disenfranchisement might be exactly the correct punishment.

I could get behind this, if you try and put the fix on voting, voting privileges revoked.

 

[Sonikku]

Yes. And with it, any obligation to pay taxes. Because that is only fair.

 

[Darwin333]

it is totally ridiculous to put somebody in prison for years and then, after his release, strip him of his reputation, ability to work, and even his right to have any say in the laws which he is to follow. i still don't understand why this practice continues.


if you get a felony in this country and don't have the resources to circumvent the consequences your life is ruined. you are over as a contributing member of society in any persistent sense. if there are two glaring problems in this country right now it is law enforcement and the prison system, and they go hand in hand

I would throw the entire justice (or JustUs) system in there with that. The police are a symptom of that system, a system in which has given us a full 50% of the worlds prisoners despite only having 5% of the wolds population and we are number one in total and per capita inmates of any other country in the world. Consider the population of China at 1.3BILLION people, roughly a billion more people than us, yeah we have way more prisoners than them.

Those statistics say one of two things, we are the most dangerous and criminal society in the entire world, hell probably in the history of the world too, or something is seriously fucked up with our justice system. I always go with the latter but the "tough on crime" politicians assume it's the first I guess.

 

[BoberFett]

I would throw the entire justice (or JustUs) system in there with that. The police are a symptom of that system, a system in which has given us a full 50% of the worlds prisoners despite only having 5% of the wolds population and we are number one in total and per capita inmates of any other country in the world. Consider the population of China at 1.3BILLION people, roughly a billion more people than us, yeah we have way more prisoners than them.

Those statistics say one of two things, we are the most dangerous and criminal society in the entire world, hell probably in the history of the world too, or something is seriously fucked up with our justice system. I always go with the latter but the "tough on crime" politicians assume it's the first I guess.

Truth. Our system is fucked up.

 

[sm625]

Felons shouldnt lose their right to vote at all. If they are going to have their rights violated then they should be stripped of citizenship to make it official. There is no reason why any citizen of the US over the age of 18 shouldnt be able to vote. Especially when a lot of felons didnt actually commit any crime at all, and most who actually did commit a crime have done their time. They are given a sentence and once that sentence is complete they should have full rights, not some sort of sick and twisted unconstitutional 2nd class citizenship.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

I would throw the entire justice (or JustUs) system in there with that. The police are a symptom of that system, a system in which has given us a full 50% of the worlds prisoners despite only having 5% of the wolds population and we are number one in total and per capita inmates of any other country in the world. Consider the population of China at 1.3BILLION people, roughly a billion more people than us, yeah we have way more prisoners than them.

Those statistics say one of two things, we are the most dangerous and criminal society in the entire world, hell probably in the history of the world too, or something is seriously fucked up with our justice system. I always go with the latter but the "tough on crime" politicians assume it's the first I guess.

Or could it be that prisons are so much worse in other countries that people do everything they can to avoid being sent to one. Imagine prisoners in the US having to depend on their families for subsistence (food, clothing, bedding) as well as not having the amenities in US prisons (A/C, TV, gym).

 

[Theb]

No. In fact they should never lose their right to vote to begin with. Felons should have a say in how the government that is run, considering it's running their lives. If there's a concern that felons could sway an election, maybe that's a sign that you have too many felons and need to re-examine your laws...

:thumbsup:

 

[Moonbeam]

We could improve the prison system by having those who run it imprisoned anonymously for a few months annually.

 

[OBLAMA2009]

I would throw the entire justice (or JustUs) system in there with that. The police are a symptom of that system, a system in which has given us a full 50% of the worlds prisoners despite only having 5% of the wolds population and we are number one in total and per capita inmates of any other country in the world. Consider the population of China at 1.3BILLION people, roughly a billion more people than us, yeah we have way more prisoners than them.

Those statistics say one of two things, we are the most dangerous and criminal society in the entire world, hell probably in the history of the world too, or something is seriously fucked up with our justice system. I always go with the latter but the "tough on crime" politicians assume it's the first I guess.

thats called the prison industrial complex. everything in america is explained by someone making money--courts, cops, cities, corporations etc... govt's owe so much money to banks that they engage in "criminalization of living" and try to make everything a crime that generates revenue. i read the average cop spends 90% of his time giving out revenue generating citations (instead of preventing crime or helping people) because the average city gov gets 40% of their revenue from that

 

[OBLAMA2009]

Felons shouldnt lose their right to vote at all. If they are going to have their rights violated then they should be stripped of citizenship to make it official. There is no reason why any citizen of the US over the age of 18 shouldnt be able to vote. Especially when a lot of felons didnt actually commit any crime at all, and most who actually did commit a crime have done their time. They are given a sentence and once that sentence is complete they should have full rights, not some sort of sick and twisted unconstitutional 2nd class citizenship.

i recently read that if ur a felon u cant get any kind of public benefits. id even have a problem with that (if its true) if a felon was a taxpayer. i dont understand what the reasoning is behind no letting felons vote. there are plenty of bad people/criminals voting that just havent been convicted.

 

[Subyman]

Or could it be that prisons are so much worse in other countries that people do everything they can to avoid being sent to one. Imagine prisoners in the US having to depend on their families for subsistence (food, clothing, bedding) as well as not having the amenities in US prisons (A/C, TV, gym).

Yeah people look forward to their stay in the lavish US prisons. Its not the prison terms for a few doobies in the cup holder or anything like that.

 

[cubby1223]

Yeah people look forward to their stay in the lavish US prisons. Its not the prison terms for a few doobies in the cup holder or anything like that.

Not so much looking forward to their stay, as not horrified straight by the thought of returning. I'm not adding my own opinions on the subject, just correcting your interpretation of his comments.

 

[cubby1223]

Consider the population of China at 1.3BILLION people, roughly a billion more people than us, yeah we have way more prisoners than them.

Partially because China kills their prison population, thus reducing the still-living headcounts:
http://www.amnestyusa.org/research/reports/death-sentences-and-executions-2013

 

[werepossum]

As per the link there are only 11 states where it is possible to lose the right to vote entirely. And all of those 11 have steps to regain voting rights after the sentence is completed.

This is exactly how I think it should be handled. Ideally, in a process simply enough to be done without a lawyer - if you have a job, have served your probation, and have made any required restitution, you should automatically regain your voting rights simply by documenting that.

There should also be gradations in felonies. Or as BoberFett and Darwin implied, a massive shift in what constitutes a felony or even a crime.

 

[werepossum]

Partially because China kills their prison population, thus reducing the still-living headcounts:
http://www.amnestyusa.org/research/reports/death-sentences-and-executions-2013

Not "killed", simply reassigned to a different job: organ donor.