Sexual Harassment question

[engineereeyore]

A friend of mine started a job for a big computer company and was going through that standard "Welcome to *****, time for some training." One of which is obviously sexual harassment.

In this meeting, he was told that he could be off the clock, eating at a restaurant, and if a fellow co-worker happened to be there and hear him say something "unappropriate", he could still be brought up on sexual harassment charges at his work. Now his reaction, which is the same as mine would have been, was to raise his hand and say, "I'm sorry. You guys have heard of the 1st amendment, right? If I'm off the clock, I have the right to say anything I wish." The HR person turn and said, "Try it."

Is this actually true? Cause if it is, sexual harassment has gone way too far.

 

[FoBoT]

you can be sued for anything and you can be terminated for almost anything

so it is probably true

 

[BigJ]

To an extent, it may be applicable.

If a person does it passingly, and doesn't say it because the person is there, but just in casual conversation, I don't believe they'd have any legal grounds to stand on. However, if it's an at-will employment state, doesn't really much matter.

If a person does it purposely because the co-worker is there, I can see how it could be brought up at work, but I'm still not sure how that works legally.

 

[JohnAn2112]

Sexual harrasment laws are put in place to keep the work environment from being hostile. If your friend happened to say something questionable to a fellow employee, on the clock or not, it would still create a hostile environment between the 2 employees when they are at work.

 

[j00fek]

Originally posted by: FoBoT
you can be sued for anything and you can be terminated for almost anything

so it is probably true

i think it is too

 

[RichardE]

If you are on Work Property yes, if you are off you can make a case with the labour board.

The main reason behind the stringent sexual harassment laws is lawsuits. The company can be sued for not providing a safe working envrionment.

 

[spidey07]

LOL, well he's already got a big target on his back by getting cute with HR.

But the company can make any policy they like. And in most situations you represent the company even while not on the the clock, so sure they can have something like this.

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

It is true. What's more, in the scenario you presented, even if the person in question isn't offended but someone else throught she should be offended, that third person can file a lawsuit on her behalf.

And yes, sexual harassment laws, as they are written, are just stupid.

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: JohnAn2112
Sexual harrasment laws are put in place to keep the work environment from being hostile. If your friend happened to say something questionable to a fellow employee, on the clock or not, it would still create a hostile environment between the 2 employees when they are at work.

Yes, that I can understand. But off the clock, not even talking to the person, but that person just happens to over-hear the conversation and takes offense. That's freakin crap.

 

[AMDZen]

Originally posted by: engineereeyore
Is this actually true? Cause if it is, sexual harassment has gone way too far.

Your just now realizing this?

She could probably get him on sexual harrassment even if she didn't work for the same company he did - the company being involved only makes it easier to be prosecuted for said charge.

 

[BoomerD]

Much of it will depend on the particular in-house standards (or state/federal law) which have been set down as applying at the company, but something like you've described COULD indeed be applicable.
Here are a couple of links on the (unpleasant) subject:

http://www.apa.org/monitor/dec98/jn.html

http://ccac.berkeley.edu/policies.shtml

http://www.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/sexhar00.html

http://employment-law.freeadvice.com/sexual_harassment/[/L

http://www.lawguru.com/faq/16.html

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/employment/sexual_harassment.html

Edit...BTW, "Unpeleasant" is used in reference to how unpleasant it can be to the person being harassed, or someone unfairly accused of harassing, and many standards refer to what might be offensive to a "reasonable woman"...as if there is such a creature...

 

[dmw16]

The 1st ammendment doesn't universally protect speach that infringes on the rights of others. Such as yelling "fire" on a crowded theater.

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: dmw16
The 1st ammendment doesn't universally protect speach that infringes on the rights of others. Such as yelling "fire" on a crowded theater.

Yes, but in that case you are directing your comments towards a specific group of people. I just don't see it in this situation.

Man I freakin glad I'm married. I'd be scared to death to be single today have to actually try and find a wife. I'd be scared every woman I talked to would bring me up on charges just for saying hello.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: BigJ
To an extent, it may be applicable.

If a person does it passingly, and doesn't say it because the person is there, but just in casual conversation, I don't believe they'd have any legal grounds to stand on. However, if it's an at-will employment state, doesn't really much matter.

If a person does it purposely because the co-worker is there, I can see how it could be brought up at work, but I'm still not sure how that works legally.

:thumbsup:

Originally posted by: JohnAn2112
Sexual harrasment laws are put in place to keep the work environment from being hostile. If your friend happened to say something questionable to a fellow employee, on the clock or not, it would still create a hostile environment between the 2 employees when they are at work.

:thumbsup:

Originally posted by: spidey07
LOL, well he's already got a big target on his back by getting cute with HR.

But the company can make any policy they like. And in most situations you represent the company even while not on the the clock, so sure they can have something like this.

:thumbsup:

 

[rbV5]

If anyone can hear you speaking inappropriately at a restaurant, you're speaking too loud. Your own manners should keep that from ever being an issue. Do you really need some idiot policy to keep yourself civil in public?

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: rbV5
If anyone can hear you speaking inappropriately at a restaurant, you're speaking too loud. Your own manners should keep that from ever being an issue. Do you really need some idiot policy to keep yourself civil in public?

Ok, try a different location if you think a restaurant is too loud. Consider just walking down the street.

 

[2Xtreme21]

My friend got a sexual harassment suit filed against him for text messaging a co-worker (who was en route to work) from home. They were in a mutual relationship at the time, and a supervisor, who was friends with the girl and not with my friend, happened to read it and thusly took it up with management. Now explain how THAT is fair...

Edit: The text message was not obscene in nature. Was a simple "hi, hope you have a good day at work, love you, bye" type thing.

 

[engineereeyore]

They need to just scrap the entire set of sexual harassment laws and start over again, cause they've obviously lost control.

 

[aidanjm]

If you can be fired for smoking on your own time/ at home, I guess you can be fired for this, too. I think it should be illegal, though. The power is too much in the hands of the employers. I would categorize this as "unfair dismissal" - should definitely be laws against it.

 

[engineereeyore]

Originally posted by: aidanjm
If you can be fired for smoking on your own time/ at home, I guess you can be fired for this, too. I think it should be illegal, though. The power is too much in the hands of the employers. I would categorize this as "unfair dismissal" - should definitely be laws against it.

Exactly. I mean, that's something that follows you around. You go to get a job after you get fired and the new company is almost guaranteed to find out about it. And over something that stupid is just ridiculous.

 

[rbV5]

Originally posted by: engineereeyore

Originally posted by: rbV5
If anyone can hear you speaking inappropriately at a restaurant, you're speaking too loud. Your own manners should keep that from ever being an issue. Do you really need some idiot policy to keep yourself civil in public?

Ok, try a different location if you think a restaurant is too loud. Consider just walking down the street.

I didn't say the restaurant was too loud. I said you shouldn't need an idiotic policy to be civil in public, why would the street be any different?

I love examples like above "co-workers in a relationship" yea, that never leads to problems, or is inappropriate:roll:

or an employer that provides medical coverage to its employees enforcing a no-smoking policy as being "unfair" as if smoking outside the workplace doesn't have any effect on his insurance premiums or place the burden of your dirty habits onto the backs of your co-workers.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: JohnAn2112
Sexual harrasment laws are put in place to keep the work environment from being hostile. If your friend happened to say something questionable to a fellow employee, on the clock or not, it would still create a hostile environment between the 2 employees when they are at work.

^^^^ BINGO ^^^^

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: 2Xtreme21
My friend got a sexual harassment suit filed against him for text messaging a co-worker (who was en route to work) from home. They were in a mutual relationship at the time, and a supervisor, who was friends with the girl and not with my friend, happened to read it and thusly took it up with management. Now explain how THAT is fair...

Edit: The text message was not obscene in nature. Was a simple "hi, hope you have a good day at work, love you, bye" type thing.

i hereby raise the BS flag

 

[tfinch2]

He's lucky he didn't get fired for sexual harassment for getting cute with HR like that.

 

[PingSpike]

Yeah, you really can't date your coworkers. Its just not a good idea.