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Setting up small business network, input / comments would be helpful.

A

AncientPC

Golden Member
Well first of all, here's the setup.

Server machine:

I meant Tyan Tiger MP S2460, not S24600.

The 3 IBM's will be set up in a RAID 5 array, and just to clarify if one of the drive fails, the information is backed up on the other 2 and I can just swap the hdd with another one, right?

Do you think they need another backup method besides this security? Tape backup seems rather expensive.

Is there a better, cheap, soundcard besides the SB Live! v5.1? I'm thinking about the Hercules Fortismo II as well. Would that be a better alternative?

The Enermax EG465P-VE is enough to support a dual AMD proc mobo right? 🙂

Client machine:

Is there a cheaper fan that's good enough to cool the AMD 1.2ghz well? Perhaps something cheaper than the Swiftech MCX370-0A because these machines are not going to be overclock'ed.

The Matrox Millenium G450's are nice video cards for crisp text right? This is a business environment so I could care less about 3d performance.

Same thing applies to the sound card as above.

Does anybody know any cheaper, decent sounding, flat-panel speakers?

Network:

Mwave's terminology is confusing (or I'm just dumb). "4 pair UTP patch cable w/ snagless boot" means cat5 ethernet cord, right?

Software:

For setting up this network, would you recommend WinXP Pro or Win2k Pro? I am going to be running Win2k Server (BTW, what's the difference between Win2k Server and Win2k Advanced Server) on the server machine, and was wondering what I should run on the client machines.

I've decided to run Win2k Pro, but is there any reason why I should use WinXP over Win2k?

How many licenses do you get with the MSDN OS subscription? 10? 1? Buying licensing seems overpriced . . .

Are there cheaper alternatives to get multiple-copies (about 3) of Win2k Pro, Win2k Server, and 4 copies of Office 2000? Keep this legit, I don't need recommendations to use IRC or newsgroups.
 
Ok, quick skim over it, figure i would throw in a few things i caught and maybe someone else will come along and correct me. 🙂

The raid 5 array should be striping with redundancy, right? You should be fine on a temporary basis if a drive fails. Although Not sure if you can still maintain a raid 5 array if there is less than 3 drives (being that 3 is the minimum necessary). You may want to increase to 4 and leave one as a hotswap failover outside of the array. This especially in light if your not going to be doing any backup schemes.

On that subject, I will preach backup until I am blue in the face when it comes to a business environment. Not only for disaster recovery, but also for partial restoring of lost files/e-mails. It is especially nice when you have users that are prone to "losing" whole folders. I am still surprised when one of my national account people comes to me and asks for a spreadsheet from November of 99. Thank God we keep monthly tapes indefinately. You could even do a semi-backup of user data to CDRs or the like if you don't want to spend the money on a DAT tape solution. Use programs like nero or even friggin Easy CD creator which both have very user friendly backup wizards.

Not really sure why you would be wanting sound in your servers, but I'm sure you can find a super cheap crystal or ensonic based chipset card for less than 20 bucks at a place like ComputerGeeks. You don't need any special music or all that Sound Blaster bloatware that would come with a live on your server. Same could go for your user computers or you could just go for an all in one board like SIS chipsets, Some VIA chipsets, and other Intels that already have a decent sound solution on board.

Matrox is known for its quality on 2D. Still, if its more expensive then the new Geforce 2 cards, you may also want to look into those. They have remarkable 2D comparatively.

Flat pannel speakers.....hmm....isn't the monsoons decent? Not sure, but have heard some reviews on such. May want to do some searching on places like sharkey or even here at anand for reviews. 🙂

As for "4 pair UTP patch cable w/ snagless boot" That referrs to CAT5 wire. 4 pairs of wires (CAT3 is 6) and the snagless boot is that stupid little "protector" they have over the clip at the end of each wire that prevents the clip from snagging on other wires (not to mention also prevents it from going through small holes making it pain when doing drops).

Diff from XP and 2K is pretty much nuttin. Just consider 2K as NT5 and XP as NT5.5. Stick with 2K since they are already 2 service packs in. Again, difference between office environment and home. I personally like XP but I am willing to endure patch after patch to keep my one system going. 🙂 I'm a Novell Admin, limited NT server admin, so can't give you too many pointers that any self respecting Admin doesn't already know.

As for liscensing, Its a pain. You may want to contact someplace like Computer Companion. I worked for them once before and right before I left they were rolling out a special low cost way of purchasing liscences for pretty much anything online and not having to pay for the media and boxes. If you do call or e-mail them, ask for Frank Gallo. Tell them Dave Foose sent ya and they will cut you a deal. 🙂


Hope this all helps.
 
Seems like a waste of money on a couple fronts. First since theres only going to be 3 clients, there is no need for a server. Why did you want a server in the first place? Were you going to have apps hosted on it? Database? Storage? You're allowed to network up to 10 clients together before you need to buy a Server OS from MS. And it seems those 40GB HD's on the clients would be enough for most people.
If you decide to keep the server, why do you need a sound card? Unless you plan on playing games or something stupid with your server, it's unneccesary.

Perhaps I should inquire about the environment these PCs are going to be used in. That makes it easier to see what they truly need.
 
There's going to be a server because applications, profiles, database, and storage.

The reason there's sound is because this is a dual-use computer.

1) It's a server.
2) It's the boss's machine (probably going to have power user access). He doesn't do anything besides MS Word, a bit of Excel, and listen to music. Those 3 combined are not going to do a thing to this machine so I'm adding some nice speakers along with the server.

I'm probably going to drop the client's hdd size down to 20gb or lower.

I'm thinking about imaging the server after installation onto CD if possible, or another hdd if necessary. It's a toss-up between that and a 4th hdd in the RAID 5.
 
servers should NOT be used as workstations. You would be better of with just a workgroup than with letting the boss use the server for his personal machine. Don't put a sound card in the server. Servers should be as bare boned and locked down as you can possibly get it, you will run into problems if you have some non-tech sitting in front of the server all day. Considered a unix fileserver? If it's a small company and you aren't too worried about getting complicated with the folder rights, then a samba box might be a cheap server for you, with MUCH better performance per/hardware than any NT system.
 


<< There's going to be a server because applications, profiles, database, and storage.

The reason there's sound is because this is a dual-use computer.

1) It's a server.
2) It's the boss's machine (probably going to have power user access). He doesn't do anything besides MS Word, a bit of Excel, and listen to music. Those 3 combined are not going to do a thing to this machine so I'm adding some nice speakers along with the server.

I'm probably going to drop the client's hdd size down to 20gb or lower.

I'm thinking about imaging the server after installation onto CD if possible, or another hdd if necessary. It's a toss-up between that and a 4th hdd in the RAID 5. >>



Seriously don't use the server as a workstation!! It only creates problems, trust me on this one
What about when you need to work on it, do you just kick him off? spend another $800 bucks and get the boss his own computer.

For a friends company (16 pc's) They used to have an extra hard drive in the boss's computer for there serving needs, what a mess. I used Redhat Linux ans samba with some ide hard drives in dual raid1 ( money was tight)
works great.
 
Yeah, if you go back and check the pdf file again, I've made the server just a machine with a whole hunk of RAM and hdd space and Type 2 for the boss. All black, black flat screen monitor, black flat panel speakers, cordless optical desktop (black), black aluminum case . . . 😛
 
You know, you've gotten some very good advice in this thread and your previous one from people who have been doing this for many years.. Ignore it as you will, but be warned that you'll likely pay the price in stability and functionality over the long run.

Also, remember that MSDN is not a site licence, nor a license to use the application for non-development purposes. Since you said you want to remain legal, it's definitely not the way to go. Yes, MS apps are expensive, but there's lots of other alternatives - You could run it all on Linux and StarOffice for free!

- G
 
Take the advice of others here. Do not allow the boss to use the server.
In fact you don't really need a true server per say. Just a box with Linux or Win2k would be fine, with a super cheap 15" monitor, no sound, etc.
It would be about the same amount of money to make a box for your boss and have a server box that will meet your needs.
You have not mentioned any real reason to use Win2k Server. And you definately don't need Adv. Server.
If you feel you must buy 2k Server then I suggest doing your homework on AD, before you jump in.

As far as the client machine's go. What app are you using that will require a 1.2Ghz cpu? Just curious.

If you really wanted to save time and money, you should get 4 or 5 Dell $899 specials.
You may not like the idea of not building them yourself, but here are the pluses.

Support- both phone and online
Instant replacement of parts-
Software comes with it. (Just add up how much xp or 2k + office apps costs individually)
They are extremely quiet, almost silent
They look good. (I noticed you like black)
They work- because Dell does the homework for you.

There's nothing more frustrating then the boss coming to you asking why something doesn't work.
Or explaining to him he has to cough up more money if a part breaks, or wait for an RMA.
Most people would get fired for not preparing for Murphy's Law. So just a warning.

 
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