Semi-regular reminder for sane Republicans

[fskimospy]

This article describes a situation during the 1/6 insurrection where GOP house members felt they had to vote to decertify the election against their own beliefs because they thought if they didn't, Republican activists would come to kill them and their families.

On the House floor, moments before the vote, Meijer approached a member who appeared on the verge of a breakdown. He asked his new colleague if he was okay. The member responded that he was not; that no matter his belief in the legitimacy of the election, he could no longer vote to certify the results, because he feared for his family’s safety.

For all the people who #bothsides things, who say it's not that bad, who justify doing nothing by saying the other side is worse -- no. It is that bad, and it's not both sides.

What the GOP Does to Its Own Dissenters

After January 6, Peter Meijer thought he could help lead the Republican Party away from an abyss. Now he laughs at his own naïveté.

www.theatlantic.com

I don't think anyone knows how to fix the current Republican Party but the first step has to be the sane people who are left recognizing there's a problem. An extremely, extremely serious problem.

 

[feralkid]

Cult. of. Death.

 

[eelw]

As crazy they are these MAGAtards, they are too chicken to go through with these death threats.

 

[fskimospy]

As crazy they are these MAGAtards, they are too chicken to go through with these death threats.

I mean the article is largely about when a bunch of them attacked the capitol building in an attempt to assassinate lawmakers, the Vice President and Speaker of the House in particular.

 

[K1052]

As crazy they are these MAGAtards, they are too chicken to go through with these death threats.

There are some dead and injured capitol cops who probably have a differing opinion.

 

[eelw]

I mean the article is largely about when a bunch of them attacked the capitol building in an attempt to assassinate lawmakers, the Vice President and Speaker of the House in particular.

Only because such a large group of them came together. As disorganized they were, chaos was going to ensue. And other plan of violence, they are too dumb to pull anything off

 

[fskimospy]

Only because such a large group of them came together. As disorganized they were, chaos was going to ensue. And other plan of violence, they are too dumb to pull anything off

I suspect on 1/5 people would have said they were too chicken to assault the Capitol and attempt to kill the Vice President and Speaker of the House.

 

[Commodus]

Not to get too philosophical, but "both sides" has bugged me because it presupposes that perfect equality is either present or always possible. And that's not how life works. Even if a situation is messy, there's still a good chance one side is more problematic than the other.

The Democrats certainly have their problems. They're frequently wishy-washy (although uncertainty can be a sign of intelligence), too afraid of taking firm stances they really should, and prone to some of the same vices of politics as usual (including flagarant corruption, in extreme cases). But they're not nearly as problematic as many Republicans, who on their current path genuinely want a one-party, anti-intellectual dictatorship.

 

[SmCaudata]

Not to get too philosophical, but "both sides" has bugged me because it presupposes that perfect equality is either present or always possible. And that's not how life works. Even if a situation is messy, there's still a good chance one side is more problematic than the other.

The Democrats certainly have their problems. They're frequently wishy-washy (although uncertainty can be a sign of intelligence), too afraid of taking firm stances they really should, and prone to some of the same vices of politics as usual (including flagarant corruption, in extreme cases). But they're not nearly as problematic as many Republicans, who on their current path genuinely want a one-party, anti-intellectual dictatorship.

Some of the wishy washy behavior has to do with liberal ideology and willingness to hold themselves accountable. When Trump played his my way or the highway routine, every republican joined, even those that despised him. Look at Cheney for what happens if they didn't. When Biden does something that democrats disagree with, they don't get behind him. They shun him and pull support. This lack team mentality is the real reason democrats don't control more than they do and why nothing gets done. Then the dem leaders need to make compromises, often making them appear uncertain.

The democratic way is probably better, but in a bitter, partisan, 2 party system the only thing that it does well, is to lose.

 

[K1052]

I suspect on 1/5 people would have said they were too chicken to assault the Capitol and attempt to kill the Vice President and Speaker of the House.

Many people figured the police would use lethal force to safeguard the government from being overthrown and our electeds killed or taken hostage. If the mob is made up of white "patriots" turns out not so much.

 

[fskimospy]

Some of the wishy washy behavior has to do with liberal ideology and willingness to hold themselves accountable. When Trump played his my way or the highway routine, every republican joined, even those that despised him. Look at Cheney for what happens if they didn't. When Biden does something that democrats disagree with, they don't get behind him. They shun him and pull support. This lack team mentality is the real reason democrats don't control more than they do and why nothing gets done. Then the dem leaders need to make compromises, often making them appear uncertain.

The democratic way is probably better, but in a bitter, partisan, 2 party system the only thing that it does well, is to lose.

I don't think that sort of governance for Democrats is 1) desirable or 2) possible.

The reason Republicans can act in concert this way is because they have no goals they are trying to accomplish other than to get and retain power. Democrats have a wide range of goals and are actually trying to govern, so this would be impossible.

So of course the party whose only goal is to gain power will have a more efficient strategy for gaining power, but if both parties did this then what's the point of Democrats winning to begin with?

 

[SmCaudata]

I don't think that sort of governance for Democrats is 1) desirable or 2) possible.

The reason Republicans can act in concert this way is because they have no goals they are trying to accomplish other than to get and retain power. Democrats have a wide range of goals and are actually trying to govern, so this would be impossible.

So of course the party whose only goal is to gain power will have a more efficient strategy for gaining power, but if both parties did this then what's the point of Democrats winning to begin with?

Well. If all dems would have allied with Biden, we wouldn't have had to cater to Manchin or Sinema with regards to voting rights, fair taxation, or green energy. If the same would have happened with Obama in office, we wouldn't have had to gut the ACA and provide yet another handout to insurance companies. We'd have lower drug costs, green energy, universal health care, etc. Not to mention we'd have protections for everyones ability to vote.

While I agree with you philosophically, the reality is that the US would be in a better place now if that were the case. Could it backfire long term? Most certainly.

 

[MrSquished]

It can't hurt to reach out to the 10% of Republicans left who are sane. Better than not reaching out at all.

 

[fskimospy]

Well. If all dems would have allied with Biden, we wouldn't have had to cater to Manchin or Sinema with regards to voting rights, fair taxation, or green energy. If the same would have happened with Obama in office, we wouldn't have had to gut the ACA and provide yet another handout to insurance companies. We'd have lower drug costs, green energy, universal health care, etc. Not to mention we'd have protections for everyones ability to vote.

While I agree with you philosophically, the reality is that the US would be in a better place now if that were the case. Could it backfire long term? Most certainly.

Right but I'm saying Democrats can't/won't do that because they don't share the same goals. So yes, it would be nice if they all united around one common goal, but they won't, since that common goal doesn't exist.

 

[K1052]

Anybody who thinks the Rs have a common goal, or any goals really, besides basically shitposting are going to get an education if they do retake the house in 22. Going to make the Tea Party years look like a well synchronized ballet.

 

[fskimospy]

Anybody who thinks the Rs have a common goal, or any goals really, besides basically shitposting are going to get an education if they do retake the house in 22. Going to make the Tea Party years look like a well synchronized ballet.

I'm looking forward to the bi-weekly impeachments for wearing a tan suit or whatever.

 

[trenchfoot]

Repubs have been propagandized into a condition of manic depression and paranoia with the rest of mankind to blame for it. They've dug their trenches and their only recourse is to keep digging them trenches deeper and deeper until it caves in on them.

It keeps their middle class and their poor entirely focused on defeating their "enemies" rather than demanding from their legislators (get this) that the taxes they pay should benefit themselves rather than the very wealthy who have convinced them with ease that corporate welfare is good and social welfare provided by the gov't for the commoners is very very bad.

It certainly is ludicrous and downright laughable for the Repub's working class and poor to think that way yet there they all are in all their glory denying themselves their own well being for their party that is bent on denying their own rank and file what they rightfully deserve from their gov't.

The Repub party's rank and file have been mind-fucked into thinking that it's of the highest priority to deny themselves the benefits their gov't could afford them simply because it's the Democrats that are trying their best to do that for them.

 

[theeedude]

Sane Republicans?
Anyone?
Bueller?

 

[TheVrolok]

I'm looking forward to the bi-weekly impeachments for wearing a tan suit or whatever.

Unless there's is some dramatic change, we can count on a Republican house impeaching every Democratic president. It will be scary if there's a Republican senate as well.

 

[Commodus]

Some of the wishy washy behavior has to do with liberal ideology and willingness to hold themselves accountable. When Trump played his my way or the highway routine, every republican joined, even those that despised him. Look at Cheney for what happens if they didn't. When Biden does something that democrats disagree with, they don't get behind him. They shun him and pull support. This lack team mentality is the real reason democrats don't control more than they do and why nothing gets done. Then the dem leaders need to make compromises, often making them appear uncertain.

The democratic way is probably better, but in a bitter, partisan, 2 party system the only thing that it does well, is to lose.

Pretty much. To borrow from Yeats: the best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity.

The difference between Yeats circa 1919 and a century later is that it feels like the worst are winning, even in countries where they were supposed to be marginalized.

 

[fskimospy]

Unless there's is some dramatic change, we can count on a Republican house impeaching every Democratic president. It will be scary if there's a Republican senate as well.

Doesn't really matter if there's a republican senate as you need 67 votes to convict, which will never happen.

Yes though, they will impeach Biden for 'revenge' on the basis that apparently using your official powers to blackmail foreign officials into attacking your domestic political enemies and attempting to overthrow democracy are not impeachment worthy.

 

[nOOky]

Many people figured the police would use lethal force to safeguard the government from being overthrown and our electeds killed or taken hostage. If the mob is made up of white "patriots" turns out not so much.

I guess if it ever happens again word needs to get out that it's a BLM rally instead. You can bet that the police presence then will be extremely beefed up.

 

[fskimospy]

I guess if it ever happens again word needs to get out that it's a BLM rally instead. You can bet that the police presence then will be extremely beefed up.

All jokes aside, yes. Police are much more likely to react violently to left wing protests than right wing ones.

Police three times more likely to use force against left-wing protests: analysis

U.S. police are three times as likely to use force against Black Lives Matter demonstrators and other left-wing protests as they are against right-wing or pro-Trump protesters, according to a Guard…

thehill.com

 

[TheVrolok]

Doesn't really matter if there's a republican senate as you need 67 votes to convict, which will never happen.

I used to say a lot of things will never happen. I've relaxed my usage of never. (Understanding that 67 is ludicrously unlikely, at least in the foreseeable future)

 

[Zorba]

I suspect on 1/5 people would have said they were too chicken to assault the Capitol and attempt to kill the Vice President and Speaker of the House.

On 1/5 I'm sure most people assumed there would've actually been real riot security at the capitol, and the police would've actually used their weapons to protect it. I had no idea the in a country where a police officer can shoot you for reaching for your ID that they asked for, that you could beat a police officer on national TV and not have anything happen to you.