Seeking quick estimate: pwr consumed with older-gen nVidia

[BonzaiDuck]

Hope nobody is annoyed. I can probably gather the info without help, but it's been a long day and I'm pooped.

this is very simple. I've been re-assessing my younger brother's computer in the upstairs bedroom. It has two 9600 GT cards in SLI. But Bro uses Playstations to game.

Our other machines are consuming (at idle) less than 150W each. Mom's system idles at 75W. Bro's system at idle is showing 200W on the UPS software meter.

I want to pull his two drives (RAID0) and replace with an SSD, and I'm wondering how much power I'd save by:

(a) pulling one of the GT 9600's leaving the system without SLI
(b) replacing both of them with something like this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc..._-14487024-L0D

I can't tell if the Egg link shows a "Maxwell" card or the earlier-gen. Either way, I'm wondering if the newer cards pull less juice than the 9600 GT(s).

 

[lyssword]

I think 9600gts do around 30w idle each, and that 750ti probably like 6-10w. It must be using inefficient/high oc processor that doesnt throttle down, is it p4 or something? 200w seems way high

 

[lyssword]

http://ht4u.net/reviews/2014/amds_tonga-gpu_-_radeon_r9_285_im_test/index47.php

 

[VirtualLarry]

(b) replacing both of them with something like this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc..._-14487024-L0D

I can't tell if the Egg link shows a "Maxwell" card or the earlier-gen. Either way, I'm wondering if the newer cards pull less juice than the 9600 GT(s).

Yep, that's the 750ti, the first card of the "Maxwell" generation. Yes, it is far more power-efficient than literally any other video card on the market, save for another Maxwell card.

That's a good price too, $20 off.

But, TBH, that's really only a solution for your younger Bro, if he still games on his PC. You can get cheaper, lesser, entry-level NV cards, like the GT620, for less money. I've picked up one for $25 AR on ShellShocker, and I got three of them from Newegg when they were marked for $35 ea, no rebate. In terms of Performance / Watt, they aren't as good as Maxwell cards, but in terms of absolute watt draw, they are comparable or even superior.

Edit: BTW, you wouldn't replace both 9600GT cards with those, because those Maxwells sadly, do not SLI.

To give you an idea of the difference, I believe, unless they are special low-power 9600GT cards, that each of them take one PCI-E 6-pin power connector.

The 750ti you linked, takes none.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I think 9600gts do around 30w idle each, and that 750ti probably like 6-10w. It must be using inefficient/high oc processor that doesnt throttle down, is it p4 or something? 200w seems way high

If your estimate is correct, than that accounts for 60W. The total is more like 190W. There are two WD black HDDs in RAID0.

As far as I know, the system is set up to use EIST, and it sleeps after maybe an hour of idle time, always waking up flawlessly as needed.

The mobo is a 780i -- LGA-775 with the 780i NVidia chipset. I don't think those mobos were touted for power-savings.

I can also add up the fans: three 140mm side fans, two 120mm front-intake, a 120mm CPU fan and 120mm exhaust. Oh. Have to add the CoolerMaster barrel fan in the CM Stacker case.

Bro makes regular but spotty daily usage, so the system spends a lot of time in suspended/sleep-state.

If it were only total daily or weekly power-consumption, it would amount to nothing.

But my attention was raised to it after replacing UPS batteries in our systems. I have three of the same model APC UPS devices -- two allocated to Mom and Bro. With my Mom's rig, the software shows nearly 60 minutes of run-time before depleting the battery. With Bro's, it's more like 9 minutes. Mom has something like a GT 430 card and an Elm-Crest SSD -- no hard disk. And there are only three fans in her system.

Those batteries cost money, even if a trickle over their three to four-year lifespan. No need causing one to age prematurely.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Yep, that's the 750ti, the first card of the "Maxwell" generation. Yes, it is far more power-efficient than literally any other video card on the market, save for another Maxwell card.

That's a good price too, $20 off.

But, TBH, that's really only a solution for your younger Bro, if he still games on his PC. You can get cheaper, lesser, entry-level NV cards, like the GT620, for less money. I've picked up one for $25 AR on ShellShocker, and I got three of them from Newegg when they were marked for $35 ea, no rebate. In terms of Performance / Watt, they aren't as good as Maxwell cards, but in terms of absolute watt draw, they are comparable or even superior.

Edit: BTW, you wouldn't replace both 9600GT cards with those, because those Maxwells sadly, do not SLI.

To give you an idea of the difference, I believe, unless they are special low-power 9600GT cards, that each of them take one PCI-E 6-pin power connector.

The 750ti you linked, takes none.

And thank you, too, Larry, for your insight and response. My concerns about this are explained in the post before this one. It's just a matter of a balancing act with the household equipment, and I'm thinking Bro doesn't really need 2x in SLI for that rig. He uses it for serious business and music.

 

[VirtualLarry]

But my attention was raised to it after replacing UPS batteries in our systems. I have three of the same model APC UPS devices -- two allocated to Mom and Bro. With my Mom's rig, the software shows nearly 60 minutes of run-time before depleting the battery. With Bro's, it's more like 9 minutes. Mom has something like a GT 430 card and an Elm-Crest SSD -- no hard disk. And there are only three fans in her system.

Those batteries cost money, even if a trickle over their three to four-year lifespan. No need causing one to age prematurely.

I don't follow your logic here. Lead-acid batteries age with time, mostly, and not with usage.

The UPS requires a rated size and spec battery when it comes replacement time. I don't think it matters whether he will see 9 minutes or 60 minutes of runtime, to the battery, although it might matter to him.

 

[Deders]

I would double check the bios for C states and EIST, you can use Argus Monitor to see exactly what the CPU is doing in real time, it's a very handy utility. The only one I've ever paid past the free trial for.

I was amazed at how much less power I was using when switching from 9800GTX+'s to a 560TI, more modern cards do clock down much much lower than anything from that era, but a single 9600 shouldn't pull too much. Question is if you were to replace it, how long before the savings equal the cost of the new card.

 

[Yuriman]

I second Larry's thoughts, it's not killing your UPS batteries any faster, they just die after a few years regardless.

I did a bit of math and, assuming you're paying around $0.15 per kwh, and if the computer is on for 4 hours per day, 365 days per year, you'll save about $9 per year in electricity by swapping out the 9600GT's for a 750Ti. (Δ55w)

Simply pulling one of the cards will save you about $4.50 per year.

 

[lyssword]

Honestly I think switching platform from that core2 duo to haswell will save more power (80-100w less idle) than vid cards(50w). But its a more complicated upgrade

 

[VirtualLarry]

Question is if you were to replace it, how long before the savings equal the cost of the new card.

This, especially if the PC spends most of its time in sleep.

 

[Flapdrol1337]

if he doesn't game you can just rip out one of the gpu's.

I wouldn't really upgrade to save power, it'll take ages to make the investment worth it and it's bad for the environment as well.

 

[AtenRa]

If you will not game or game occasionally sell your current system and get a new APU like the A8-7600 or A10-7700K.

I you still want to stay with what you have take off one of the GPUs, replace the RAID HDDs with a single SSD and properly setup bios energy settings. You will be able to go bellow 100W at idle easily.

 

[VirtualLarry]

If you will not game or game occasionally sell your current system and get a new APU like the A8-7600 or A10-7700K.

I you still want to stay with what you have take off one of the GPUs, replace the RAID HDDs with a single SSD and properly setup bios energy settings. You will be able to go bellow 100W at idle easily.

Below 100W at idle? On a Core2-era 775 mobo without an IGP, that depends on a discrete card for video output? Good luck to that.

 

[Piroko]

That's a lot of fans for a system that isn't pushed anymore...

I would take out one of the 9600GTs and probably all three 140mm side intake fans (also >10W each when at 12V) and call it a day. I don't think you can get this system much more economical without essentially buying a new system.

 

[know of fence]

Anandtech says 49W (at the wall) in idle per 9600 GT, it's crazy!

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2624

 

[sm625]

My guess is that a 750 ti maxwell card upgrade would drop about 80 watts from your idle power consumption. With the fans gone too you're looking at about 100 watts saved. That is $0.30 a day ($100 a year) if left running 24/7. If run for 6 hours a day that is $25 a year saved. All assuming 12 cent per hr electricity rate. Your savings rate could go up depending on how much time the PC was left idling in game, in game lobbies, etc. Many games tax the gpu quite heavily even when paused or in a lobby.

 

[coffeejunkee]

Below 100W at idle? On a Core2-era 775 mobo without an IGP, that depends on a discrete card for video output? Good luck to that.

Easy, just need to use one of the lowest end cards like NV6200 (from around that time, wouldn't use that now). Those old gaming cards really used tons of power while doing nothing, I think fex. 4870 was somewhere around 60W.

So if you're not playing games, I would dump both 9600's and get a second hand lowend card like 5450, GT610 or whatever. Then again, US power is cheap and you might not recoup costs before the whole system is (finally) obsolete. So might be better to just upgrade to Haswell and use igp. You would be somewhere around 25-30W idle.

 

[lyssword]

The whole cpu/whatever chipset also used more power, specially nvidia 680-780i sli style. I'm talking like 140w idle with no video card at all vs today's 50-60w cpu platforms

 

[BonzaiDuck]

I don't follow your logic here. Lead-acid batteries age with time, mostly, and not with usage.

The UPS requires a rated size and spec battery when it comes replacement time. I don't think it matters whether he will see 9 minutes or 60 minutes of runtime, to the battery, although it might matter to him.

Wow . . . a lot of posts in a short time!

Unless I've been misled, these lead-acid sealed batteries do not survive too many total discharges. His system is set up to shut down on battery after two minutes.

I'm not sure of any "guidelines," but I try to keep these APC units from discharging more than 25%.

A similar logic is supposed to apply to lappie Li-on batteries, designed to weather discharges down to 20% of the total.

If you know something I don't, I'd like to know more.

COST ME A WAD OF CHANGE TO RENEW ALL THESE APC's!! I'VE GOT AT LEAST TWO MORE THAN I NEED!! Gotta . . . . figure out what to do with 'em!

Back to "calm," though . . . Everyone is correct about the net-present values of costs and savings versus outlays. It would be easy to replace the whole damn system with a three-fan, IB-i3, 8GB system. But Bro don' like inconvenience, and I have to "sell" the idea of it. . . . Every time I suggest rocking the apple-cart a little bit, there is resistance. Perhaps my maintenance on these old systems is making the fam-damn-ily TOO comfortable . . .

 

[BonzaiDuck]

The whole cpu/whatever chipset also used more power, specially nvidia 680-780i sli style. I'm talking like 140w idle with no video card at all vs today's 50-60w cpu platforms

Anyway, Mom's is also LGA-775 and NVidia 610i with a GT 430-something card in it. At idle, I thought it was drawing about 75W.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

That's a lot of fans for a system that isn't pushed anymore...

I would take out one of the 9600GTs and probably all three 140mm side intake fans (also >10W each when at 12V) and call it a day. I don't think you can get this system much more economical without essentially buying a new system.

You're RIGHT about the fans! It was an E8600, which I'd initially over-clocked to 4.2 Ghz, so I went totally fan-boi-bazoobas when I built it. The CM Stacker mid-tower was just BEGGING for fans!!

I gotta get Bro in the right mood and jump on this. Not sure how, though. Maybe . . . when he runs out of E&J VSOP. :whiste:

 

[Deders]

I seem to remember with those old cards, only one clocks down to desktop speeds when SLI is enabled.

 

[dave_the_nerd]

Anyway, Mom's is also LGA-775 and NVidia 610i with a GT 430-something card in it. At idle, I thought it was drawing about 75W.

Depends on the CPUs too. If Mom has an E7200 and Bro has an overclocked QX6700, there's going to be some difference in idle power use.

(If you mentioned CPU models and speeds, I didn't see that info.)

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Depends on the CPUs too. If Mom has an E7200 and Bro has an overclocked QX6700, there's going to be some difference in idle power use.

(If you mentioned CPU models and speeds, I didn't see that info.)

I didn't, but good point.

Bro has the E8600 running at stock and auto settings -- a Wolfdale.

Mom has an E6700 -- not the Conroe, but the reincarnated model number and CPU produced in 2010 -- also a Wolfdale. The E8600 has a top speed of (stale memory, here . . ) -- somewhere between 3.2 and 3.4Ghz. The E6700 was about 3.3 or 3.4Ghz, I think. Maybe it was lower. But they're both configured with EIST enabled.