scsi drive replacement

[zigzag03]

this will be my first time changing out a scsi boot drive. i am replacing the original fujitsu 9g wide ultra 2 drive in my compaq ap240 workstation. i got myself a couple of seagate 18g wide ultra 2 drives, one to boot from and one as a second drive. there are plenty of jumper settings to choose from, well documented on the label, and a utility will come up on bootup for setting drive numbers. so my question is: do i partition and format in similar fashion to an ide drive? master and slave? any tips or tricks that might come in handy? i'm on new ground here, and appreciate any help. thanks, zz

 

[mechBgon]

Where IDE drives have master/slave, SCSI drives have ID numbers. I'd make the drives ID #'s 0 and 1.

For Windows setup (assuming you use Windows), put your SCSI card's drivers on a floppy diskette. Start Windows Setup by booting from your Windows CD. Right off the bat, it will prompt you to press F6 if you have third-party SCSI drivers, so press the F6 key there. Windows Setup will get itself ready and then prompt for your drivers on floppy, and after that, it will be able to see your SCSI drives so you can install Windows in the usual fashion (including partitioning and formatting).

Make sure the drives are getting direct forced-air cooling, because older SCSI drives could get darn hot :Q

 

[mastertech01]

There is no master or slave on SCSI. You can place the drives on any connector between the two ends as long as they have independent IDs set. Most common boot ID is 0 or 1. So set the drive you want to boot from in the SCSI bios, then set that drives ID to that number. Then you can set the other drive to any ID you want OTHER than the boot ID. You can low level format the drives from the SCSI bios, then do the normal high level format to your boot drive and install the OS. If you are installing Win2K or XP Pro you can create a partition and format the other drive or drives from the Disk Management utility.


Argh, Mech you beat me to it..

 

[zigzag03]

excellent, thank you, just what i needed.... zz

 

[zigzag03]

ok, a complication... these drives use 80 pin connectors and i have a controller and cable with 68 pin connectors... the tiny difference of a "c" at the end of the model number instead of a "w". can i get around this? (like buying a diff controller, or are there adaptor cables? as you may know, the 80 pin does not have a standard 4 pin power connector on the drive, it all comes thru the scsi cable, or so i think i understand. further thanks, zz

 

[mastertech01]

You will need a pair of LVD rated SCA adaptors. You can find them on Ebay for anywhere from 10.00 to 15.00 each. Maybe even find a couple by advertising a want to buy on our for sale forum. You gotta know SCSI terms to ensure you get the right stuff these days. That "c" is a substantial difference in price and functionality on home systems. BUt dont sweat it, I use SCA drives here at the house and have for years. They are just as good properly implemented.

LOOKS LIKE THIS

 

[zigzag03]

ok i am searching that out now, and i am in your debt again. thanks to both who have responded here. just when i thought i had nothing left to learn... ya right. when you said "a substantial diff in price and functionality" or something to that effect, do you mind elaborating a little? i note these drives are twice the height of the original fujitsu, and so i may not have room to mount two of them, short of being "creative" so i may just stick with the one and try and add a little cooling for it. zz

 

[mastertech01]

Originally posted by: zigzag03
ok i am searching that out now, and i am in your debt again. thanks to both who have responded here. just when i thought i had nothing left to learn... ya right. when you said "a substantial diff in price and functionality" or something to that effect, do you mind elaborating a little? i note these drives are twice the height of the original fujitsu, and so i may not have room to mount two of them, short of being "creative" so i may just stick with the one and try and add a little cooling for it. zz

Thats known as a half height drive, and you will need a full CD drive bay for one. You will need to get one of those drive bay coolers with the fans mounted to the front. Older generation drives like that can fill a case quick.

I simply meant that its easier to use 68 pin drives in a home box. SCA drives are less expensive because they dont have the features you will have to add with the adaptor. SCA drives are intended for use in an SCA raid tower where the backplane provides all the IDs and power connections.

FULL HEIGHT= TWo full CD drive bays
HALF HEIGHT= One full CD drive bay
Low Profile= one inch height drive as is common on most drives today.

 

[zigzag03]

like you got nothing to do but help me out, but if you don't mind, check this item on ebay, eBay Item # 2744212314, i think this is the device i need. and in fact check out the guy's ebay store, he's seriously into scsi. thanks for your explanation, that tells the story. red sox hanging on, it's nail bitin' time... zz

 

[mastertech01]

Thats the guy I have bought several from in the past. But that is the wrong adaptor. You need the LVD version for U2W, U160, and U320 drives.

 

[zigzag03]

thank you!

 

[zigzag03]

just as a follow up, when i didn't hear from you last nite, i went ahead (cuz i'm stupid) and ordered those adaptors anyway. when i heard from you this morning, i was not suprised with your news, that's my kind of luck. but i called the folks at their webstore phone number, the order was changed quick and freindly and the right ones are on the way, thanks to you and them. nice to find good folks to do biz with, and nice of you to hold my hand thru this. drinks on me, zz

 

[mastertech01]

Im sorry I was late to respond, have been having some long days at work lately and been going to bed early. Glad you got it squared away. McPrice is a fine seller and Ive done business with them a couple years so they arent some freak company that will disappear over night. Good people to do business with for your SCSI needs.

 

[zigzag03]

good day mr mastertech, first let me say i followed your "my michelle" link, thinking you had named your rig after someone. i was both horrified and moved with what i read. i'm sure it's all been said, so i'll simply offer our prayers to you and your whole family.

if you remember, i was trying to rig a segate cheetah 18g wide ultra 2 drive into my compaq ap240, as the boot drive. i got the proper adaptor. 68pin to 80pin lvd, but can not get the drive to be recognized. i have the drive and it's adaptor set to id# 0, as recommended in the docs for the adaptor. it is also the default for both components, which is to say, no jumpers. i get a drive lite when i power the machine, and i can hear the drive spin. i am hooked to an adaptec AHA-2940U2W adaptor, which is lvd. the id for the adaptor is id# 7. the only advice the drive adaptor doc has is "if you have an lvd drive and are not using it in an lvd application, set the jumper on the drive for single ended mode" i presume this would be an lvd application, but i have tried it both ways and not gotten the scsi utility to find the drive. the same terminator is on the end of the cable as before, i didn't touch that.

i have been to seagate, and downloaded their boot disk installation software, but when i attempt to boot with the resulting floppy disk i get a "cannot load dos! push any key to restart" msg. i appear to be stymied on that route.

do you have any thoughts on this problem? thanks, zz

 

[Big Lar]

Check in your scsi bios to see if termination for the drive is set to auto, if not, set it to auto, and try that.

 

[zigzag03]

termination is indeed set to auto... anthing else? thanks

 

[lobadobadingdong]

does the scsi bios point to device 0 as the boot drive, is the mainboard bios set to boot to scsi(some older machines have to have that set as well)

 

[zigzag03]

in both cases, yes. i am replacing a failed id 0 boot drive with another. nothing has been changed from the original config. thanks for the response, zz

 

[mastertech01]

Are you installing a proprietary Compaq OS that may be limiting your ability to boot to the SCSI due to a proprietary BIOS?

What operating system are you using? 98,ME,2k,XP?
\

But first things first.. can you see the drive from SCSI bios? If so I would do a low level format from the bios and check the drives sectors using the SCSI bios utility. If all formats fine and checks fine it has to be a settings problem. Make sure that INT13 support is enabled and BIOS is enabled. These settings I would assume are already set if you were using SCSI drive to boot from before the change however. Im also assuming you are using an LVD terminated LVD cable as well.

I guess its also remotely possible that the units bios will only allow booting from a certain ID. What were your original drives settings?

 

[zigzag03]

gentlemen. i think i have found the answer to the immeditate problem. i found a damaged cable, controller to adaptor. this is surely my immediate problem, and did not exist when i condemned the original drive. how did the cable get damaged you ask? please don't ask. i'll replace this cable and hopefully be able to move forward, and thanks for all the help and advice. zz