SAT Privilege

[Cozarkian]

The Wall Street Journal has discovered that parental income correlates with scores on the SAT.

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2014...me-inequality-how-wealthier-kids-rank-higher/

Their ultimate conclusion appears to be that wealthy families have access to better schools so their kids do better on SATs. Interestingly, however, they also found that free test prep wouldn't close the gap. But if test prep can't close the gap, why would a better school?

Again, we are left with the question of which came first. Do schools in wealthy neighborhoods create better students, or does the behavior of students from wealthy families create better schools?

It would be a fascinating study to have two schools, one in a wealthy neighborhood and one in a poor neighborhood swap budgets, teachers and administrators. Would the better resources and better teachers allow poor students to increase their success, or would lack of parental involvement cause those resources to be wasted? Similarly, would wealthy students' scores decline because their education is worse, or would they make full use of every resource they have and still get good value from their education, and high scores?

Here's a suggestion for anyone who is exorbitantly wealthy: Find a large number (100+) low-income families with toddlers and fund their entire education from pre-school through 12th grade at quality private schools. Also order a food service to insure quality meals, provide an annual budget for clothing/supplies, and pay participation fees for community sports teams. Then we can compare their results to children from similar communities who went to local public schools and finally determine whether privilege or attitude is a more important factor in one's success.

Don't think of it is a welfare to an undeserving individual, think of it as a contribution to science.

 

[BoberFett]

But don't you see? Having loving, supportive parents who value education is a privilege of it's own.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

But don't you see? Having loving, supportive parents who value education is a privilege of it's own.

We must eliminate this privilege of parental involvement. Ship all school-age children to boarding schools where they will have no contact with the outside world so they can all be ignored equally.

 

[BoberFett]

We must eliminate this privilege of parental involvement. Ship all school-age children to boarding schools where they will have no contact with the outside world so they can all be ignored equally.

Now you're thinking like a Social Justice Warrior!

 

[dphantom]

We must eliminate this privilege of parental involvement. Ship all school-age children to boarding schools where they will have no contact with the outside world so they can all be ignored equally.

it's the only way to be sure.

 

[cabri]

Test prep is like a surface charge on a dead car battery vs a long deep cycle charge.

Initially when read by the meter, both show 12V.

However, trying to start the vehicle in the cold demonstrates the difference quite easily.

 

[Jaskalas]

But don't you see? Having loving, supportive parents who value education is a privilege of it's own.

I know... the Government can provide this privilege to all children. All we have to do is take them away from their parents so we can provide equal outcomes.

And as we all know the Constitution requires equal "protection". So this process is both mandatory and already law.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

The most consistent predictors of academic achievement are parental expectations and personal involvement in their child's education. Parents of high-achieving students set higher standards for their children’s educational activities than parents of low-achieving students. It's not about how wealthy you are or how much money you spend for teachers and schools...it's really much more about parental involvement and expectations than anything else.

http://www.hfrp.org/publications-re...ement-and-student-achievement-a-meta-analysis

 

[DrPizza]

Test prep is like a surface charge on a dead car battery vs a long deep cycle charge.

Initially when read by the meter, both show 12V.

However, trying to start the vehicle in the cold demonstrates the difference quite easily.

What an outstanding analogy!

 

[Pipeline 1010]

We must eliminate this privilege of parental involvement. Ship all school-age children to boarding schools where they will have no contact with the outside world so they can all be ignored equally.

I like how you think, comrade! You have proven your worth to the Party.

 

[quikah]

Here's a suggestion for anyone who is exorbitantly wealthy: Find a large number (100+) low-income families with toddlers and fund their entire education from pre-school through 12th grade at quality private schools. Also order a food service to insure quality meals, provide an annual budget for clothing/supplies, and pay participation fees for community sports teams. Then we can compare their results to children from similar communities who went to local public schools and finally determine whether privilege or attitude is a more important factor in one's success.

This is sort of anecdotal, but this happens already to an extent in Silicon Valley.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinsley_Voluntary_Transfer_Program

I am not sure how successful it really is, but there is this article which seems pretty positive:

http://www.almanacnews.com/news/2011/12/06/how-tinsley-program-affects-students

Some difficulties are unavoidable. A lot of the parents of students in the program work 2+ jobs to make ends meet so they cannot be as involved as they like. Also there can be a long commute time for some of the kids. They can be locked out of afterschool activities (no transportation or they need to get home to help take care of siblings) or even friendships with their classmates (few are going to want to drive their kid to the poor neighborhood for a playdate).

I live in Palo Alto school district, my eldest won't be starting K until next year, I guess I will see first hand how it well works then.

 

[Cozarkian]

This is sort of anecdotal, but this happens already to an extent in Silicon Valley.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinsley_Voluntary_Transfer_Program

I am not sure how successful it really is, but there is this article which seems pretty positive:

http://www.almanacnews.com/news/2011/12/06/how-tinsley-program-affects-students

Some difficulties are unavoidable. A lot of the parents of students in the program work 2+ jobs to make ends meet so they cannot be as involved as they like. Also there can be a long commute time for some of the kids. They can be locked out of afterschool activities (no transportation or they need to get home to help take care of siblings) or even friendships with their classmates (few are going to want to drive their kid to the poor neighborhood for a playdate).

I live in Palo Alto school district, my eldest won't be starting K until next year, I guess I will see first hand how it well works then.

Interesting. One problem, however, is that the parents who apply are more likely to be those who would have taken a larger interest in their child's education anyway. It might provide valuable information if the students accepted were compared solely to those who applied but were not accepted.

I guess my proposal has the same problem. Although it would be reduced if the person providing the money went out looking for people rather than allowing people to apply. A parent who doesn't care enough about their child's education to apply to a program might not turn down an offer that is handed to them on a silver platter.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

Test prep is like a surface charge on a dead car battery vs a long deep cycle charge.

Initially when read by the meter, both show 12V.

However, trying to start the vehicle in the cold demonstrates the difference quite easily.

So you're saying we need to crank the heat in the testing centers?

 

[rudder]

I know... the Government can provide this privilege to all children. All we have to do is take them away from their parents so we can provide equal outcomes.

And as we all know the Constitution requires equal "protection". So this process is both mandatory and already law.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3qtpdSQox0

 

[cabri]

So you're saying we need to crank the heat in the testing centers?

Most people that take the SAT are already sweating it.()

 

[pauldun170]

The Wall Street Journal has discovered that parental income correlates with scores on the SAT.

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2014...me-inequality-how-wealthier-kids-rank-higher/

Their ultimate conclusion appears to be that wealthy families have access to better schools so their kids do better on SATs. Interestingly, however, they also found that free test prep wouldn't close the gap. But if test prep can't close the gap, why would a better school?

Again, we are left with the question of which came first. Do schools in wealthy neighborhoods create better students, or does the behavior of students from wealthy families create better schools?

It would be a fascinating study to have two schools, one in a wealthy neighborhood and one in a poor neighborhood swap budgets, teachers and administrators. Would the better resources and better teachers allow poor students to increase their success, or would lack of parental involvement cause those resources to be wasted? Similarly, would wealthy students' scores decline because their education is worse, or would they make full use of every resource they have and still get good value from their education, and high scores?

Here's a suggestion for anyone who is exorbitantly wealthy: Find a large number (100+) low-income families with toddlers and fund their entire education from pre-school through 12th grade at quality private schools. Also order a food service to insure quality meals, provide an annual budget for clothing/supplies, and pay participation fees for community sports teams. Then we can compare their results to children from similar communities who went to local public schools and finally determine whether privilege or attitude is a more important factor in one's success.

Don't think of it is a welfare to an undeserving individual, think of it as a contribution to science.

Those who value education earn higher incomes. They also are more likely to pass that on to their children.

A child that does well in poor district will do just as well in wealthy district.
I've seen plenty of crappy educators.
The kid with the supportive parents will do well even in the crappiest classroom.

Parents in the wealthy districts are constantly calling the school complaining "Why did you give my child a low grade or why did you do something that impacts my childs gpa\self esteem. what can we do to help improve.....o" or in some cases "The lunchroom is too cold....YOU NEED TO RAISE THE TEMPERATURE BECAUSE ITS AFFECTING MY KIDS GRADES!!!! I"LL SUE THE DISTRICT!!!

Parents in the poorer district....not so much. However, the parents that do engage the school are the parents of the kids that do well in High School and then go on to higher education, whether its directly to university or through military service.

 

[piasabird]

I don't agree there are plenty of stupid rich kids that end up going to jail. Of course it is nice to have a warm bed, Christmas presents, a well balanced Meal, a steady home environment, a safe neighborhood, and a better school. So naturally the rich start out with a better chance to take advantage of all these nice things. Plus they can afford to go to summer camp and take vacations in Europe or wherever they want to go.

I think what is most important is to have 2 parents that provide a steady home environment. If given just a little help and encouragement any child can succeed.

Still if your dad can make large donations and get you a job that might help a bit.

 

[werepossum]

So you're saying we need to crank the heat in the testing centers?

I think that would have a significant effect on test scores.

1. When it is chilly, nipples tend to erect.
2. When girls' nipples erect, boys' test scores plummet.

Ergo higher temperatures lead to better test scores.

 

[Fern]

The most consistent predictors of academic achievement are parental expectations and personal involvement in their child's education. Parents of high-achieving students set higher standards for their children’s educational activities than parents of low-achieving students. It's not about how wealthy you are or how much money you spend for teachers and schools...it's really much more about parental involvement and expectations than anything else.

http://www.hfrp.org/publications-re...ement-and-student-achievement-a-meta-analysis

Yep. IMO, it's all about the parents.

In addition to your points I would add that during the child's pre-school years (think toddler etc) (s)he is exposed to better language and communication skills etc due to the parents likely higher education. The topics of regular family discussions are also likely to be of a higher standard.

Fern

 

[Zaap]

I think that would have a significant effect on test scores.

1. When it is chilly, nipples tend to erect.
2. When girls' nipples erect, boys' test scores plummet.

Ergo higher temperatures lead to better test scores.

Good points. NPI.

 

[drebo]

Why must test scores be equal?

Everyone's different, thus everyone's test scores are going to be different.

This political correctness quest for absolute equality has to stop or we're all going to end up flipping burgers and too undereducated to do anything else.

 

[MrCassdin]

We must eliminate this privilege of parental involvement. Ship all school-age children to boarding schools where they will have no contact with the outside world so they can all be ignored equally.

Karl would be proud. :thumbsdown: