Samsung sticking it to the consumer

[TheDarkKnight]

Why did Samsung cut the storage capacities of their most popular SSDs from 128GB to 120GB? That's a cursed number for a computer part. It's not a power of 2. Somebody at Samsung must be looking to upgrade their Porsche to a Lamborghini on the backs of the hardest working people in America, the middle class. Thanks Samsung.

I want a substantive answer for this matter. Otherwise, I may have to consult with an attorney.

 

[philipma1957]

Why did Samsung cut the storage capacities of their most popular SSDs from 128GB to 120GB? That's a cursed number for a computer part. It's not a power of 2. Somebody at Samsung must be looking to upgrade their Porsche to a Lamborghini on the backs of the hardest working people in America, the middle class. Thanks Samsung.

I want a substantive answer for this matter. Otherwise, I may have to consult with an attorney.

VERY FUNNY!

why not just buy the 250gb version you can get one for under 160 when it goes on sale.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

VERY FUNNY!

why not just buy the 250gb version you can get one for under 160 when it goes on sale.

That's not a power of 2. What part of mathematics don't you understand?

 

[VirtualLarry]

That's not a power of 2. What part of mathematics don't you understand?

OP, get a grip. $10 says you're bi-polar.

PS. Storage devices haven't been sold in power-of-2 sizes since, well, pretty-much forever in the PC world. I remember buying 120MB HDDs. NOT 128MiB exactly.

PPS. Most likely the difference between 120GB and 128GiB is used for over-provisioning, firmware storage, and mapping tables.

 

[rsutoratosu]

buy the pro version, they're full size

 

[TheDarkKnight]

OP, get a grip. $10 says you're bi-polar.

PS. Storage devices haven't been sold in power-of-2 sizes since, well, pretty-much forever in the PC world. I remember buying 120MB HDDs. NOT 128MiB exactly.

PPS. Most likely the difference between 120GB and 128GiB is used for over-provisioning, firmware storage, and mapping tables.

Yes, that's exactly right, I am bi-polar. And you came to that conclusion before anybody else...ummm....exactly how...because I like to post colorful messages?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820147163

The point to be made is that in the "recent" past Samsung released an SSD 830 series product at a capacity of 128GB. You can follow the link above in case you think I have fallen victim to some sort of conspiracy theory. Well, unless NewEgg is in on the conspiracy as well. And if you believe that, I just can't help you.

I have so much more to say but it's time for me to take my Prozac pills and whatever the little blue ones are called. They are rather pretty though.

 

[Ketchup]

That's not a power of 2. What part of mathematics don't you understand?

The part that says certain numbers are cursed. Thanks for the laugh.

 

[frostedflakes]

I want a substantive answer for this matter. Otherwise, I may have to consult with an attorney.

:hmm:

The reason is likely greater overprovisioning. The TLC NAND in the 840 non-Pro is less durable than MLC so they do this to give the SSD controller more space for wear leveling, spare blocks to replace ones that go bad, etc. Same reason SandForce SSDs were sold in capacities of 60, 120, 240, etc., they had more overprovisioning than most other SSDs.

Better get used to it, because as NAND geometry shrinks larger amounts of overprovisioning are likely going to be necessary. There are other ways controller and SSD manufacturers can deal with the lower P/E cycles, but that's one of the tools in their bag.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Yes, that's exactly right, I am bi-polar. And you came to that conclusion before anybody else...ummm....exactly how...because I like to post colorful messages?

Not to drag this thread too far off-topic, but I have a bi-polar friend. I can kinda spot it a mile away. Not that that's any slight on you, living with mental illness is tough.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

Not to drag this thread too far off-topic, but I have a bi-polar friend. I can kinda spot it a mile away. Not that that's any slight on you, living with mental illness is tough.

Some people suffer from mental illness. I however, on the other hand, enjoy every minute of it. There's a knock at the front door. I think they're coming for me now.

 

[F1shF4t]

That's not a power of 2. What part of mathematics don't you understand?

Open the SSD case and you will see 128GiB/256GiB etc of NAND. The difference between that and what you see in Windows is used for over-provisioning, remapping etc.

The advertised GB size is what you get. So I have no idea what your problem is.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

Open the SSD case and you will see 128GiB/256GiB etc of NAND. The difference between that and what you see in Windows is used for over-provisioning, remapping etc.

The advertised GB size is what you get. So I have no idea what your problem is.

VirtualLarry has already stated my problem. What, you don't believe he can make an accurate diagnosis over the internet? After all he does have a friend who is bi-poloar. That should qualify him to make these professional diagnoses. Are you calling VirtualLarry a liar?

But seriously,
Thanks for the answers. It basically comes down to Samsung expecting the customer to pay the same price for a lesser amount of storage than was previously available to consumers. The 500GB PS3 bundles are still sold as such even though you don't get all of that space right off the bat.
Microsoft Surface Pro 32GB doesn't come with 32GB available. They might have been better off to keep calling it a 128GB. Then I would have just been calling them false advertisers versus greedy crooks.

Edit: I'll bet there wasn't 128GB available in the 128GB version of Samsungs 830 SSD either. The difference in the advertised size versus the available size probably increased to the point which forced a name change to avoid consumer backlash.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Each mfg does it differently. For example, most flash drives are sold as 32GB, even though many I've tried seem to only have 30GiB available in Windows, even though, most likely, 32GiB of NAND is actually physically present on the device.

Likewise, some SSDs are 30GB, versus 32GB, even though both of them likely contain 32GiB of NAND.

 

[Elixer]

:hmm:

The reason is likely greater overprovisioning. The TLC NAND in the 840 non-Pro is less durable than MLC so they do this to give the SSD controller more space for wear leveling, spare blocks to replace ones that go bad, etc. Same reason SandForce SSDs were sold in capacities of 60, 120, 240, etc., they had more overprovisioning than most other SSDs.

Better get used to it, because as NAND geometry shrinks larger amounts of overprovisioning are likely going to be necessary. There are other ways controller and SSD manufacturers can deal with the lower P/E cycles, but that's one of the tools in their bag.

Yeah, this pretty much is the reason for the "missing" MBs. It still is there, but you can't use it because of the crappier (IMO) TLC NAND.

 

[F1shF4t]

Edit: I'll bet there wasn't 128GB available in the 128GB version of Samsungs 830 SSD either. The difference in the advertised size versus the available size probably increased to the point which forced a name change to avoid consumer backlash.

Nah the 830 is actually 128GB which roughly equals 119GiB as shown in windows. (Windows says GB but its actually showing GiB).

The one time I have seen that wasn't the case was with OCZ 34nm to 25nm NAND switch. The usable space went from 120GB (or 111GiB) to 115GB (or 107GiB), however it was still sold as a 120GB SSD. They got a good backlash for that switch-a-roo.

 

[Charlie98]

I want a substantive answer for this matter. Otherwise, I may have to consult with an attorney.

It's Bush's fault.

 

[jaedaliu]

Why did Samsung cut the storage capacities of their most popular SSDs from 128GB to 120GB? That's a cursed number for a computer part. It's not a power of 2. Somebody at Samsung must be looking to upgrade their Porsche to a Lamborghini on the backs of the hardest working people in America, the middle class. Thanks Samsung.

I want a substantive answer for this matter. Otherwise, I may have to consult with an attorney.

They didn't cut it. They're telling you the default overprovisioning setup for the drive.

Feel free to change it after you buy it. Just be aware performance and drive life may decrease.

I feel that sticking it to the consumer would be selling the drive at full NAND size and the consumer losing performance and life on the drive. (which is apparently what you want)

 

[GlacierFreeze]

They didn't cut it. They're telling you the default overprovisioning setup for the drive.

Yes and he still doesn't get it. Rather just complain instead of looking up the benefits and purpose. Oh well.

 

[taq8ojh]

Is it just me or do I see way more trolling threads than necessary these days?

 

[Ketchup]

Is it just me or do I see way more trolling threads than necessary these days?

Compared to what? you've only been here since March.

 

[Eug]

Is it just me or do I see way more trolling threads than necessary these days?

Yes, but there were way more trolling threads than necessary in previous years too.

Anyhoo, I have a 96 GB SSD in my Windows laptop. Not even close to 60, 64, 120, or 128. In wonder how the NAND config is set up on that.

 

[Remobz]

THis thread was funny

 

[taq8ojh]

Compared to what? you've only been here since March.

Exactly! And I already got that impression...

 

[Hellhammer]

Anyhoo, I have a 96 GB SSD in my Windows laptop. Not even close to 60, 64, 120, or 128. In wonder how the NAND config is set up on that.

Twelve 8GB dies (assuming the NAND is 2Xnm) - Either twelve single-die packages or six dual-die packages. The controller is just running in six-channel mode instead of the normal eight-channel mode (which may result in slight decrease in performance).

 

[Eug]

I bought the drive in 2011 IIRC, but the model was released in 2010.

Google found me a teardown of the 128 GB version of my Kingston V+100 and it looks like it has 8 x 16 GB Toshiba chips (and a Toshiba controller). They say it is 32 nm. It also has a 128 MB DDR cache.

So it sounds like mine is 6 x 16 GB 32 nm.

www.legitreviews.com/article/1469/2/

Also, here is Anand's teardown.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4010/kingston-ssdnow-v-plus-100-review

Anand says the garbage collection is extremely aggressive, maybe even too aggressive. Now I wonder again if I should have bothered activating TRIM with this model on my MacBook. I still find this confusing.