Samsung SSD Magician: "Disk defragmenter should be disabled"

[Carson Dyle]

Why?

Windows 7 is smart enough not to run a scheduled defrag on installed SSDs. Why then should the Disk Defragmenter service be disabled? There are HDDs in the system that need to be defragmented.

 

[Elixer]

Maybe samsung thinks that only SSDs will be on the system.
That program also works on vista, and XP I think as well.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Possibly. It should be trivial to tell what OS the program is running under, though.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Now it has me wondering about the other recommendations under "OS Optimization". I always disable indexing anyway, so that's of no concern. But what about SuperFetch?

 

[postmortemIA]

Now it has me wondering about the other recommendations under "OS Optimization". I always disable indexing anyway, so that's of no concern. But what about SuperFetch?

same thing - it ignores SSDs

BTW there was claim on this forum that defragmenting SSD is not terribly bad idea - it will at least resolve logical fragmentation that Windows thinks is taking place.

 

[corkyg]

Defragging is not good for SSDs - it creates excessive writes and will add to premature wear. Besides, a solid state drive ignores fragmentation. Some apps consolidate white space, but that is handled by SSD ware.

 

[Soundmanred]

With hard drives defrag, and always check for bad sector,, if you have them, you can get rid of them with HDD Regenerator and you have 0 bad sectors again.. Also make sure its screwed on tight and unmovable. Also make sure its temp is not more then 34c in its life. With SSD ,, always gotta do firmware updates and use CrystalDisk. Go this route for speed and reliability and no noise. gl

 

[Carson Dyle]

With hard drives defrag, and always check for bad sector,, if you have them, you can get rid of them with HDD Regenerator and you have 0 bad sectors again.. Also make sure its screwed on tight and unmovable. Also make sure its temp is not more then 34c in its life. With SSD ,, always gotta do firmware updates and use CrystalDisk. Go this route for speed and reliability and no noise. gl

Thanks for the totally random advice.

34C is 93 degrees F. Yeah, right....

 

[yefi]

Yeah, I noticed this too. Samsung's decision to disable defrag outright seems pretty dumb when you could have a hdd in the system. I didn't bother with any of their other putative "optimizations", except for enabling the power schema.

 

[corkyg]

Yeah, I noticed this too. Samsung's decision to disable defrag outright seems pretty dumb when you could have a hdd in the system. I didn't bother with any of their other putative "optimizations", except for enabling the power schema.

Should not be a problem. In my system, defrag is controllable by drive.

 

[Elixer]

Thanks for the totally random advice.

34C is 93 degrees F. Yeah, right....

Some people may not understand, this is a tweakboy type of post.

Anyway, I highly doubt that their utility is intelligent enough for use with anything but a pure SSD system. The more options I look, that they have, it sure seems that way.

 

[yefi]

Should not be a problem. In my system, defrag is controllable by drive.

If you have Samsung's SSD Magician, and you elect to disable defrag through it, then you lose defrag for all drives. You can't even run Disk Defragmenter from the start menu when it's set.

 

[Carson Dyle]

If you have Samsung's SSD Magician, and you elect to disable defrag through it, then you lose defrag for all drives. You can't even run Disk Defragmenter from the start menu when it's set.

That's correct, and how I got into this to begin with. I was trying to manually run the degragmenter to defrag the one HDD in the system, but it wouldn't even open up due to the Disk Defragmenter service being disabled. That 'Disabled' was because I had used the Samsung software (rather stupidly, I'll admit) and followed its recommendations without looking into what it actually does.

Makes no sense to disable the defrag service under Windows 7, since Win7 works well with SSDs as is. I'm fairly surprised at just how dumb the Samsung "Magician" software is.

 

[Nothinman]

Makes no sense to disable the defrag service under Windows 7, since Win7 works well with SSDs as is. I'm fairly surprised at just how dumb the Samsung "Magician" software is.

Idiocy of non-free software never surprises me. Almost all of them make some really stupid assumptions that are either impossible or very difficult to work around. But I guess that's the trade-offs they decided to make in order to meet their deadlines.

 

[Coup27]

With hard drives defrag, and always check for bad sector,, if you have them, you can get rid of them with HDD Regenerator and you have 0 bad sectors again.. Also make sure its screwed on tight and unmovable. Also make sure its temp is not more then 34c in its life. With SSD ,, always gotta do firmware updates and use CrystalDisk. Go this route for speed and reliability and no noise. gl

Are you tweakboy? Your post style, grammar, recommendation of support programs and signature of "gl" are all identical to tweakboy.

 

[taltamir]

Why?

Windows 7 is smart enough not to run a scheduled defrag on installed SSDs. Why then should the Disk Defragmenter service be disabled? There are HDDs in the system that need to be defragmented.

Disabling disk defragmented sabotages the performance of your HDD without having any effect on the SSD. Thus making the SSD appear even faster (relatively) to the custom and ensuring they keep on buying them / give them more favorable reviews.

Intel got a lot of flak for doing that exact same thing and as a result newer SSD toolbox from intel now say "no-action required - dual drive system detected"

It is still silly to disable defragmenter even if you have nothing but SSDs. because:
1. Defragmenter service does NOT run on startup (wasting ram and slowing startup process), it will only run if scheduled.
2. Defragmenter is not scheduled to run on SSDs, only on HDDs.

So as a result, windows 7 with only an SSD will never run defragmenter. Disabling it merely makes it impossible for it to schedule defragmenting if an HDD is added later

Now it has me wondering about the other recommendations under "OS Optimization". I always disable indexing anyway, so that's of no concern. But what about SuperFetch?

According to a semi famous interview with MS engineer, during early development they thought an SSD would be so fast they can disable superfetch for it. However, actual testing showed that this resulted in significant performance reduction so they chose to leave it on (duh, ram is a LOT faster than SSD).

As it stands though, superfetch will exclude SSD that windows benchmarks to be above a certain speed (automatically done by win7). As the slowdown is considered negligible and ... well I am not sure what the benefit of disabling it is, I am guessing power is conserved.

Indexing is also disabled by default for SSDs as a relic from the 1st gen Jmicron drives where it causes OS stutter due to being 2 orders of magnitude slower then HDDs in random access rather then 2-3 orders of magnitude faster like modern SSDs are. However, I force indexing on for everything. The effect on drive lifespan is infinitesimal, there is absolutely no slowdown, and I like having searches be done near instantly rather then taking a few minutes.

 

[Carson Dyle]

Disabling disk defragmented sabotages the performance of your HDD without having any effect on the SSD. Thus making the SSD appear even faster (relatively) to the custom and ensuring they keep on buying them / give them more favorable reviews.

Love it! The tinfoil hat theory...

 

[taltamir]

Love it! The tinfoil hat theory...

Tinfoil actually increases radio wave reception, as per my understanding of basic physics (which was later confirmed for me by people deciding to bust that myth that you can stop reception with tinfoil... I don't think it was mythbusters though).
Also radio has no effects on the human brain aside from being converted to heat that is so in obscene amounts it can bake you like a microwave oven.

Anyways, that line you quotred is not a theory, its a description of facts. It strongly insinuates but does not actually state outright that they have done it on purpose rather then due to sheer incompetence. I do believe it is done on purpose and feel free to call me a conspiracy nut based on that.

Oh, and for those who believe conspiracies are impossible: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-fined-euro331m-by-eu-regulators-1977541.html

 

[taltamir]

oh great, I just figured out how this could have been done via sheer incompetence rather then intentional sabotage... One that is actually so plausible that it is likely how it happens and that my assumption of ill intent to have been false.

Step 1: Project analysis writes a document of issues that might arise with SSD, one of said issues is WinXP defragging an SSD.
Step 2: Miscommunication of this data to the project manager or the project manager is an incompetent and misreads / misremembers the details of said report and writes up a list of overall "project goals" which includes amongst them "disable defrag".
Step 3: The actual programmers and software engineers follow the letter of the design document without question. Either not realizing the consequences of their false "optimization" or not willing to rock the boat.

 

[Soundmanred]

Are you tweakboy? Your post style, grammar, recommendation of support programs and signature of "gl" are all identical to tweakboy.

Thanks for insulting me, you have nothing better to do ? I have no problem with you. And no nothing can be done why are you soo irritated and angry and mad, you need to chill ,,,,,,, this is a good post so to answer you.

 

[taltamir]

what does gl even mean? tweakboy always signs his posts with that and I have no idea what it means

 

[Elixer]

what does gl even mean? tweakboy always signs his posts with that and I have no idea what it means

He still posts ? I thought everyone put him on ignore by now...

Anyway, yeah, the Magician software isn't the best thing to get advice from, as shocking as that may be.

Reminds me of "Clippy"!

 

[tweakboy]

I disagree. heres why.

Windows 8 doesnt have readyboost ,, but superfetch must be left on by default. I launched the defrag app and it detected SSD , and it gives option to optimize it,, I dont know if its a defrag or what it is but it takes couple seconds,, and your SSD is optimized... gl

 

[Nothinman]

what does gl even mean? tweakboy always signs his posts with that and I have no idea what it means

Good luck?

I disagree. heres why.

Windows 8 doesnt have readyboost ,, but superfetch must be left on by default. I launched the defrag app and it detected SSD , and it gives option to optimize it,, I dont know if its a defrag or what it is but it takes couple seconds,, and your SSD is optimized... gl

So you have no idea what it does but you're happy that it optimized your drive in some magical way?

 

[Carson Dyle]

I wish I could close this thread. It's served its purpose. Mods?