Russia on brink of ... NOPE! Russia INVADES Ukraine!

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K1052

Elite Member
Aug 21, 2003
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How mobile are the ATTAC'Em missiles we sent? Can they be moved into New Ukraine and used against deeper targets?

I doubt Ukraine wants to risk their M142s or M270s. They have a healthy amount of range to work with from inside their territory.
 

Dave_5k

Golden Member
May 23, 2017
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How mobile are the ATTAC'Em missiles we sent? Can they be moved into New Ukraine and used against deeper targets?
Quite mobile - The more mobile version is the M142 platform- anywhere you can take a 12 ton wheeled truck that can hit 50 mph on highway.

But moving into Kursk wouldn’t make any sense - first, Ukraine is only about 20km past the old border, no real difference on a 300km range missile. and second, the US (Biden) has completely and idiotically banned Ukraine from using them to attack Russian territory - with a minor recent exception allowing defense against imminent ground assaults / troop concentrations near the border.
 
Nov 17, 2019
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Maybe Vlad doesn't like playing the game he started now that it's on his home turf?




And from obviously questionable sources:




.
 

gdansk

Platinum Member
Feb 8, 2011
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Russia is being invaded because they attacked from Belgorod earlier this year. They themselves opened up the frozen border.
It seems Russian high command is incapable of foreseeing consequences of their own actions.
 

Brovane

Diamond Member
Dec 18, 2001
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Didn't the Kursk region used to be Ukrainian? I think Ukraine needs to claim historical precedent and schedule special referendums in the recently liberated areas of Russia.
 
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kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
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Watch them hook south, then hit Belgorod from two directions, cause the main source for orc support for the Donbas to collapse. With the exception of some Wagner elements, the Russians are poorly trained and don't really know what the hell they're doing. Those guys don't last long against AFU and their drones, which have been honed into nightmares these last 2 years. Damn right we're seeing large scale surrender now.

Years from now we could be looking at this push into Kursk as the blow that nicked an artery in the Russian bear. Things could really start to spiral downward from here it sounds like. Soon as Trump loses we're going to see Putin change his tune again. In the mean time, Zelenskyy is going to make 'returning to original pre 2014 borders' the least shitty option for Russia.
 
Nov 17, 2019
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Did a bit of reading on 1943. Some parallels, but back then it seems they had all but stopped it in a few days. There doesn't seem to be any sign of them doing so now.

Much bigger armies on both sides then. Massive losses early on.
 
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JTsyo

Lifer
Nov 18, 2007
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How mobile are the ATTAC'Em missiles we sent? Can they be moved into New Ukraine and used against deeper targets?
They are fired from HIMARS and that stands for High Mobility Artillery Rocket System. Trouble though is you can't fit many on there like the smaller rockets so you'll need a logistics train to bring you more.
 
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RnR_au

Platinum Member
Jun 6, 2021
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This could be political Kryptonite for Putin;

1723389923877.png

From my understanding conscripts should not be used for the Special Military Operation. War hasn't been declared by Russia against Ukraine.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
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This could be political Kryptonite for Putin;

View attachment 105091

From my understanding conscripts should not be used for the Special Military Operation. War hasn't been declared by Russia against Ukraine.
I wouldn’t be shocked if thousands of Russian families haven’t heard from the conscripted sons in months with no official word from the government.
 

kage69

Lifer
Jul 17, 2003
28,831
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This could be political Kryptonite for Putin;

View attachment 105091

From my understanding conscripts should not be used for the Special Military Operation. War hasn't been declared by Russia against Ukraine.

Just the beginning.

Imagine having zero military or weapons experience, being rounded up for 2ish weeks of "basic" let's call it, if that, then with rifle 'older than you are' in hand, you're expected to stop tanks, IFVs and drones - all piloted by very experienced people.

That is a truckload of Ukrainian garlic cured NOPE. Can't blame anyone for not wanting to throw away their life, let alone for Putin, right? The more stuff like this gets exposed, the more it's going to happen, and the more tenuous life becomes for little Putler. Moar.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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How would Ukraine have controlled their air?

While we definitely could have gotten F-16s to Ukraine faster I think people overestimate how much faster. For example before pilots or ground crews can learn anything about the F-16 they had to learn English.

I feel like we should have just implemented a program much like the Qataris did with their Olympic teams: "nationalize" a bunch of Bulgarians, suddenly, to make your new gold-medal-winning "Qatari Olympic team" by sending, I dunno, some of our retired, trainer, or you know..."bored pilots" to go "become Ukrainian" for a brief spell in the summer of 2022 to just unleash weeks-long hell on those fucking goblins.

Is it possible to re-flag an entire carrier group as a temporary "donation" for an ally?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
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Truth. In the West we train to take the fight to the enemy, then decapitate it. We attack 24/7 too, no time outs for sundown or bad weather. Tends to end conflicts decisively. In the East they train to trade blows, in quantity, across long lines and for long periods of time. Works as long as you have enough men to treat them as expendable assets, no different than gun powder or MREs, as well as a society not averse to such losses.

The proof behind modern Western military doctrine was put on display in Iraq back in the 90s. China and Russia both shat bricks at how fast we dismantled a huge military, particularly one in a different hemisphere. Tactically, strategically and logistically America and it's NATO allies outclass the Russian military, and not by slim margins either. The last thing Putin should want is for what's left of his military to attack NATO. That just hits fast forward on Russia's demise, and his.

yeah but please do, maybe?
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,165
30,117
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They could have used ATACAMS earlier, without a stupid 100km imposed limit, hit airfileds, hit airplanes standing but they always hit a "escalation fear" which seen from Eastern Europe looks reaaaaaly retarded. They needed long range weapons to hit factories, but... nope. They had to create themselfs. Russia obeys only force, does not respect any word given, and laughs of western stupidity of self imposed limits. There will be no nuclear war because the power circle in Russia likes it's lavish way of life too much to risk ending it, but they will bluff until Kingdom comes, because else they cannot maintain their power image for the serfs back home.

Agree to a large degree, but there was still valid concern early on, and without knowing how Ukraine would go about it, that attacking within Russia would give Putin a lot of ammo for recruiting meatbags and keeping the war from the Russian perspective legitimately popular: right now, it seems to remain popular only from the extreme cultists and the rest purely out of fear. It remains important for Ukraine to limit its strikes to purely military targets despite the abject terrorism that Putin unleashes against them. It always does matter that what he screams about is pure lies, and most Russians know this whether or not they feel safe vocalizing what they think.

It doesn't take much more than a single school or hospital targeted by Ukraine to flip that switch.
 

you2

Diamond Member
Apr 2, 2002
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The more stuff like this gets exposed, the more it's going to happen, and the more tenuous life becomes for little Putler. Moar.
We can wish and sometime wishes come true; but just look at the shit Trump got away with and his 'base' cheers him on. People are idiots.
 

Dave_5k

Golden Member
May 23, 2017
1,925
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I feel like we should have just implemented a program much like the Qataris did with their Olympic teams: "nationalize" a bunch of Bulgarians, suddenly, to make your new gold-medal-winning "Qatari Olympic team" by sending, I dunno, some of our retired, trainer, or you know..."bored pilots" to go "become Ukrainian" for a brief spell in the summer of 2022 to just unleash weeks-long hell on those fucking goblins.

Is it possible to re-flag an entire carrier group as a temporary "donation" for an ally?
There is precedence for this, although not only as volunteers. See both Vietnam and Korea.

Vietnam had hundreds of Soviet pilots flying Migs against the US.

Korea had the entire Soviet 64th aviation corps, 300 aircraft with over 20,000 personnel, fighting against the UN/US.