Rosewill RSV-L4(5/0)00 maximum heatsink clearance advice

[Dxun]

I am considering to buy either RSV-L4500 or RSV-L4000 for a silent, rackable workstation build. I am looking for maximum height cleareance inside the case but find anectodal and contradictory information only - can anyone point me in the right direction? I intend to put a 158.7 mm heatsink (Megahalems Rev C) inside it and I just don't know if it would fit.

I've written to their sales dept, sifted through their manual and went through various video and owner reviews and I just can't get a definitive, non-conflicting answer. For example, some people claim the max clearance is 142 mm, there are people who have been able to fit a cooler (at least) 151 mm tall and I've found instances where people were seemingly able to fit a 159 mm cooler (Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus). For example, a review here claims the heatsink hits the top of the case but it doesn't say if the contact prevented him from actually closing the case or not (just search for "Hyper 212" string).

Personally, I would be ok with (a slight) contact, as long as there is no *excessive* force pressuring the motherboard (as it is easy to isolate the contact surface). For example, I now use a $40 Fractal Design Core 1000 with a 159 mm heatsink and it fits just barely, with a benign contact. The case is 175 mm, whereas the Rosewills are 177 mm, so it would seem that, ceteris paribus, the heatsink should fit, so I really don't understand how people claim 142 mm or 151 mm heatsinks "barely fit". Am I missing something obvious here?

Lastly, if you are positive the heatsink would not fit in this case - what alternatives exist in 4U size?

 

[ClockHound]

4U external height is 178mm - 8mm? cpu socket - 6mm? MB standoffs - 2x 1mm thick panels = 162mm - so no worries.

However, we don't know the height of the MB standoffs - maybe they're 4Upped too. Or the CPU socket height (or at least I don't). ;-)

According to Frosty, 4U heatsinks are 154mm or less.

The new Scythe Ninja 4 is 155mm tall and is very, very good. The extra 1mm could be provided via manual panel convexifcation.

If you really want to use your Megahalems, then in the worst case, I vote for case dimensional manipulation - make some dremel magic and create a beautifully modded windowed 4U case.

Or...you get some low-rider standoffs at McMasters.

Or you wimp out and use a good pancake cooler like the Noctua C14S or Cryorig C1 - or follow the server herd and use one of those cute little mini-tower coolers like the NH-U9S or NH-D9L.

Or...If the stats are right and 154mm is the hard limit and you intend to put the rig in a rack, then you could install a bottomless 1U case above the topless 4U case. Use the 1U case to store drives or future slacker case mod ideas.

 

[Dxun]

Well, this is exactly the kind of stuff I am looking for, thanks!

I am looking at your calculation and I don't fully follow it. So the external height is 178 - 2 mm (panels) - 6? mm (standoffs) - 8 mm (socket) -> it's the socket depth I don't fully understand - what goes into these 8 mm? Aside from motherboard PCB, what else do you have to account for? Mounting mechanism? The socket protrusion itself? It seems a lot, then again I haven't looked in a while.

The standoffs are my prime candidate for replacement - I had no idea you could buy standoffs shorter than 6 mm. Looking at the site you had provided, it seems a little over my head - could you help me out with selection? I can't seem to spot any of those standoffs with < 6 mm height.

Ninja 4 is an excellent cooler but as most things Scythe in North America, they are either unavailable or cost an arm and a leg (just look at the prices of three Scythe pancake coolers - absurd). If I could find one, I'd buy it in a heartbeat and wouldn't mind the manual panel convexification at all

Dimensional manipulation , OTOH, would be really last resort of last resorts. I can't have a case with a hole in it (for various reasons). On the flipside, if I go with a 92 mm cooler, I am afraid it would destroy the silent part of the workstation build.

Bottomless 1U case is a great idea, however I am placing the workstation together with a 4U receiver in a modified lack-rack, so there won't be room for that (lack-rack is 9U max, minus the rails and some cooling distance - 8U).

 

[fralexandr]

motherboard standoffs are male - female standoffs

there is a small diagram indicating that the first number, LG(A) is the height of the standoff after it is secured in place. If you wanted a shorter standoff, you would buy either 1/8" = 3.175mm or 3/16" = 4.7625. You should need ~9 of these to mount the motherboard to. FYI ATX specification calls for standoffs that are 6.4mm (1/4") or higher. This is intended as a safety margin to prevent shorting the motherboard.

A chassis and its related elements (e.g., stiffening ribs, base pan, structural supports fasteners, etc.) must allow &#8805; 0.250” clearance to the bottom planar surface of the motherboard PCB. This does not including mounting hole standoffs, which may extend to and contact the PCB at the mounting holes within the prescribed 0.400”-square areas.

Thread B is the male portion of the standoff. This portion screws into the case. It should be SIZE 6-32.

Thread C is the female portion of the standoff. This portion receives the screw you put through the motherboard into the standoff. The SIZE is usually 6-32. It can vary, but cases tend to come with an abundance of 6-32 screws used for mounting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_case_screws#Motherboard_standoff

 

[Dxun]

...FYI ATX specification calls for standoffs that are 6.4mm (1/4") or higher. This is intended as a safety margin to prevent shorting the motherboard. ...

Excellent, thanks for the explanation!

How *dangerous* is it to have shorter standoffs than the spec prescribes? Should I take some steps to insulate the chassis panel? I was thinking some plain, transparent box tape to cover the panel and prevent any contact?

 

[fralexandr]

It's probably to account for abnormal amounts of flex, possibly from having installed too few standoffs. I have no idea what the minimum standoff height should actually be.

 

[Dxun]

So you don't think any insulation is necessary unless one plans to bend the motherboard with some hefty components?

 

[fralexandr]

Pretty much. If I understand correctly, arcing shouldn't be a problem given that motherboards are working off 12V

 

[XavierMace]

Few things to be aware of with those cases. I've got 2 of the RSV-R4000's. They are shitty cases. The case itself is 4U. The handles are not. So you either have to sacrifice 1U of space above and below the case or do some heavy duty grinding to the handles.

The removable drive bays are extremely cheaply made. Drives won't clear larger RAID controllers, however you're looking at the longer L series so that shouldn't be an issue.

The front door can't open all the way if it's sitting flat on a desk which prevents you from removing the drive bays.

Regarding your actual question... I fit Noctua U12DX's (158mm) mounted on a Tyan E7320 board in mine. The top of the case did slightly push down on them, but I had no issue. You do however have to remove the support crossbeam to fit any sort of larger heatsink.

 

[ClockHound]

Ninja 4 is an excellent cooler but as most things Scythe in North America, they are either unavailable or cost an arm and a leg (just look at the prices of three Scythe pancake coolers - absurd). If I could find one, I'd buy it in a heartbeat and wouldn't mind the manual panel convexification at all

$47.95 at the Coolerguys - so it's available and only costs a pinkie or two. ;-)

 

[therealnickdanger]

RSV-L4000 owner here. It is a beast of a case. I had the 212+ on my Q6600 and now it's on my i5, so there are no issues with height that I know of. Also, I have the exterior handles on it in my 42U rack and it doesn't interfere with any equipment above or below it - it's really just 4U.

From my own experience trying to save money, I have to say that you should just go ahead and buy the RSV-L4412 from the start.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147233

I had a glut of Seagate HDD failures over the course of a year and taking that monster case off the rack to service it was a pain every time. Even if you don't plan to regularly use hot-swapping, it is just so worth it!

I have since replaced all three front drive bays in my L4000 with three RSV-SATA-Cage-34 hotswap bays. They are normally like $50 each ($150), but I found some on Amazon a while back for $30 each ($90). Complete LIFE SAVER! Basically, I ended up with the L4412:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816132037

 

[XavierMace]

RSV-L4000 owner here. It is a beast of a case. I had the 212+ on my Q6600 and now it's on my i5, so there are no issues with height that I know of. Also, I have the exterior handles on it in my 42U rack and it doesn't interfere with any equipment above or below it - it's really just 4U.

I'm curious what makes you consider it a beast of a case? It's cheap, I'll I'll give it that.

 

[therealnickdanger]

I'm curious what makes you consider it a beast of a case? It's cheap, I'll I'll give it that.

Size, weight, and generally sharp corners make it difficult to carry or move outside of the rack. Combined with the weight of 12 HDDs and other components, it can be quite cumbersome - which is why I recommend the L4412 or, if you can get them cheap, the hot-swap drive bays for the other models.

 

[Dxun]

Gents, first of all, thanks for your suggestions. I should say my goal here is to build a decent, and silent (<= 20 dBA) air-cooled Haswell-E workstation.

1) I don't plan on having more than a single NVM SSD plus an additional SSD (from my current laptop), so RSV-L4412 would be contraindicated and a waste of money in this instance. The RSV-4500 would probably be the best choice for my needs (see next point).

2) Since this is a silent workstation I am building, I intend to provide decent airflow to the components together with fans on low RPM which is why I had chosen such a spacious case with many fan spaces. That is also why I insist on a tall heatsink. I also intend to replace existing jet turbines with silent, PWM fans (Nexus would be preferable but probably Yate Loons).

3) As to why I am choosing a server chassis - that is because I have another 4U device (a digital reciever) with I intend to put in a slightly modded lack-rack and tuck under my table, thus reducing the cable mess and getting additional table room.

If you have additional suggestions on how to better achieve this, please do fire away.

$47.95 at the Coolerguys - so it's available and only costs a pinkie or two. ;-)

Alas, shipping it to Canada adds 37-54 USD, which amounts to 102-133 CAD - ouch. I bought the Megahalems Rev C for 38 CAD (29 USD!).

Regarding your actual question... I fit Noctua U12DX's (158mm) mounted on a Tyan E7320 board in mine. The top of the case did slightly push down on them, but I had no issue. You do however have to remove the support crossbeam to fit any sort of larger heatsink.

I thought the crossbeam would be removed - how does it impact the chassis structure? Is it prone to bending or deformations?

RSV-L4000 owner here. It is a beast of a case. I had the 212+ on my Q6600 and now it's on my i5, so there are no issues with height that I know of.

This is now significant data: I have three data points - we have here a forum member who fitted Noctua U12DX's (158 mm), you with 212+ (158.5 mm) and a guy from a separate forum saying he's running the RSV-4000 with 212 EVO (159 mm) though he had to work a little to get the cover to close (quote: "When closed you can see the cover dented/bent at the area", i.e. manual panel convexification(tm) ).

As we suspected, it is going to a be a close shave and will probably completely depend on CPU socket (I suspect standoffs will be standard 6 mm - I have a Chenbro RM42300-F for an unrelated build next to me and it's coming with 6 mm standoffs, so I don't see why Rosewill would do something else). Just to increase my odds, I'll probably order a set of shorter standoffs (hope they don't cost an arm and a leg).

FWIW, I plan on building the workstation with Asus Sabertooth X99 (due to gobs of on-board fan controllers (11!) and fan excellent fan management) - if anyone accidentally has any first-hand info on the CPU socket height on that board, you know what to do....

 

[XavierMace]

I never had any significant weight resting on mine, so I couldn't tell you about the impact to the structure.

You explanation of why you want a server case makes sense. But if you're only installing two drives, choosing a 4U does not. What kind of hardware is going in this system besides the X99 board?

 

[Dxun]

I never had any significant weight resting on mine, so I couldn't tell you about the impact to the structure.

You explanation of why you want a server case makes sense. But if you're only installing two drives, choosing a 4U does not. What kind of hardware is going in this system besides the X99 board?

The reason why I am going for a 4U chassis is because smaller-sized chassis do not accept 120 mm fans. Anything smaller than that and in general it becomes annoyingly loud (for me). It's very difficult to achieve silence and decent airflow with 92 mm fans - physics is not just a good idea, it's the law. Potentially, if there were a 3U case with something like eight 92 mm fans spaces, that could work but I haven't seen such a case. If you can suggest an alternative, please do.

If it were possible, I would have gone with a Fractal Design Define S (which has no drive bays as such, fits the drives so that it doesn't impede the airflow) and would have simply tipped it on its side and slided it in but it doesn't fit in the rack (and neither does the Define R4/5, for that matter).

The reason I don't need extra drives is because I already host most my files on a separate NAS.

Hardware spec would be something like this:
- MBO: Sabertooth X99
- CPU: i5820K + Megahalems Rev C
- VGA: GeForce 980 Ti or ATI Fury
- SSD: Samsung SSD 950 (or Intel SSD 750)
- RAM: 32 GB
- PSU: Seasonic SS-660XP2
- CHA: Rosewill RSV-4500

Roughly, that would be it - I am waiting for Black Friday deals to start trickling in so I may snap up something different but this would be a general idea.

I have found one worrying aspect of the motherboard, see it here. It seems to be a motherboard backplate and I am unsure whether or how much would it raise the motherboard in addition to standoffs. I am not even sure how it fits the standoffs at all.

 

[ClockHound]

So the appeal of 4U rack case is to live in a rack with another 4U case? That's a lot of compromises for less cable clutter, but it's your personal choice for your personal computer. So, some sheet metal persuasion may serve your needs. Or...

Alternatively, if it were me with full rack fever, I'd get a CM XB Evo (17.4 x 13 x 16.7inch (W x H x D)). Next, remove the hideous molded plastic front bezel, fabricate a new front panel, attach some rack ears (the real support would be from a horizontal plate), install a pair of quiet 140mm fans (A14s or other quiet fans) intakes and enjoy a quieter system with better thermals with the large tower cooler of my choice.

In fact, I've done just that - except for the rack part. With the twin 140s up front (non-porous metal grille/air-choking plastic bezel removed), the cooler intake temp is 2-3 degrees above ambient at idle or load. Overclocked 5675 at 4.4 never hits 60c on benches under a D15. New svelte panel is under development.

It's another option for great airflow. And in my usage, despite being an open bench case, is quieter than the 'silent' case it replaced.

 

[XavierMace]

The reason why I am going for a 4U chassis is because smaller-sized chassis do not accept 120 mm fans. Anything smaller than that and in general it becomes annoyingly loud (for me). It's very difficult to achieve silence and decent airflow with 92 mm fans - physics is not just a good idea, it's the law. Potentially, if there were a 3U case with something like eight 92 mm fans spaces, that could work but I haven't seen such a case. If you can suggest an alternative, please do.
...
Hardware spec would be something like this:
- MBO: Sabertooth X99
- CPU: i5820K + Megahalems Rev C
- VGA: GeForce 980 Ti or ATI Fury
- SSD: Samsung SSD 950 (or Intel SSD 750)
- RAM: 32 GB
- PSU: Seasonic SS-660XP2
- CHA: Rosewill RSV-4500

That Rosewill case does not have what I would call good airflow by any means. You have to understand, server cases are designed to be cooled quietly. They are designed to be cooled by moving a metric crapton of air through the case as quickly as possible. With the right components, that can be done reasonably quietly, but definitely not silently.

Alternatively, if it were me with full rack fever, I'd get a CM XB Evo (17.4 x 13 x 16.7inch (W x H x D)). Next, remove the hideous molded plastic front bezel, fabricate a new front panel, attach some rack ears (the real support would be from a horizontal plate), install a pair of quiet 140mm fans (A14s or other quiet fans) intakes and enjoy a quieter system with better thermals with the large tower cooler of my choice.

I can't say I've ever looked into racking mine, but I'd second his suggestion of that case. It's a fantastic case.