• Guest, The rules for the P & N subforum have been updated to prohibit "ad hominem" or personal attacks against other posters. See the full details in the post "Politics and News Rules & Guidelines."
  • Community Question: What makes a good motherboard?

Romania and Bulgaria accepted to join European Union on January 1st, 2007

Page 2 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.

JEDIYoda

Lifer
Jul 13, 2005
33,273
2,971
126
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Unified Europe---NEVER!!
I beg to differ...
I took special courses in European integration, I worked for the European Commission in Brussels... those people realy plan for the long term, and despite the amount of bureaucracy, they are aware that the future of the continent is at stake.
I really don`t care who you worked for.....
you were protected by your surroundings...
trust me when i say this...on paper yes Europe will appear to be United...
In actuallity never...those are the fatcs...

There is still bad blood amongst alot of the nations that are part of the EU even now.
Sooner or later Germany`s arrogance will lead to its downfall again......

You may have taken spcial courses, bwsides going to college in Eurpe and doing my graduate studies also un Europe, I also have hands on experiance living in all the countries at one time or another that I speak there language......

 

B00ne

Platinum Member
May 21, 2001
2,168
0
0
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda

Nobody trusts the Germans and likewise the Germans only care about themselves they actually hate everybody else...


Unified Europe---NERVER!!
Huh???

 

AnitaPeterson

Diamond Member
Apr 24, 2001
5,648
41
91
Originally posted by: IdaGno
If Romania were a horse, it would be shot dead just to put it out of its collective misery.

GL! dealing w/that, EU.

This is bollocks.
I've often heard Romanians sigh in desperation at Western media focusing exclusively on the street children and orphans, forsaking everything else that's good and positive about their country.

The facts that abortion was illegal in Romania during Communism, that all birth control means were forbidden, and that there is still a lack of education (and resistance to education) among the poorest groups of the population, concerning safe sex (particularly among the Gypsy minority) somehow escape all the bleeding hearts from the West.

Romania also has a problem with stray dogs (another by-product of the Communist era), but a lot of international organizations are quite vocal whenever elected officials try to euthanize the couple of hundred thousand strays which roam the streets at night and attack people.

Nice trolling!
 

forfor

Senior member
Jul 7, 2006
390
0
0
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson
Originally posted by: IdaGno
If Romania were a horse, it would be shot dead just to put it out of its collective misery.

GL! dealing w/that, EU.

This is bollocks.
I've often heard Romanians sigh in desperation at Western media focusing exclusively on the street children and orphans, forsaking everything else that's good and positive about their country.

The facts that abortion was illegal in Romania during Communism, that all birth control means were forbidden, and that there is still a lack of education (and resistance to education) among the poorest groups of the population, concerning safe sex (particularly among the Gypsy minority) somehow escape all the bleeding hearts from the West.

Romania also has a problem with stray dogs (another by-product of the Communist era), but a lot of international organizations are quite vocal whenever elected officials try to euthanize the couple of hundred thousand strays which roam the streets at night and attack people.

Nice trolling!
When I lived in Germany, I remember a friend telling me that the German government some many many years ago actually did euthanize hundreds of thousands of strays. True or not I don't know... it was a German that told me this.
 

AnitaPeterson

Diamond Member
Apr 24, 2001
5,648
41
91
What's funny - in the context, considering IdaGno advocates "putting things out of their misery" - is that these issues cannot be solved by the local government in a manner acceptable to Westerners, simply because they don't have money to do things "by the book", yet the Westerners never get truly implicated, and really love pointing fingers.

Hopefully, EU membership will solve this, once the economy is stable. Communism left a criminal legacy which will take decades to completely dissipate...
 

CanOWorms

Lifer
Jul 3, 2001
12,414
0
0
Originally posted by: BouZouki

Turkey needs to start to accept the Armenian and Pontian Genocide and also get there 48,000 troops the hell out of Cyprus.

There 32 year illigal occupation of Northen Cyprus won't help them seeing the entire island of Cyprus is a full EU member.

Maybe then they can start talking about joining up.
I'm still waiting for the UK to accept their worldwide genocide (during colonialism) and get out of their illegal occupations as well. Same to France and so many others.

It seems that Turkey not accepting the genocide moves them closer to the other members of the EU.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,179
0
71
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson

Romania also has a problem with stray dogs (another by-product of the Communist era), but a lot of international organizations are quite vocal whenever elected officials try to euthanize the couple of hundred thousand strays which roam the streets at night and attack people.
A friend of mine was telling me how during the mid 90s they tried to get rid of all the strays, but immediately Brigitte Bardot and a bunch of other celebs descended on Romania and stopped it, heh.
 

Martin

Lifer
Jan 15, 2000
29,179
0
71
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Unified Europe---NEVER!!
I beg to differ...
I took special courses in European integration, I worked for the European Commission in Brussels... those people realy plan for the long term, and despite the amount of bureaucracy, they are aware that the future of the continent is at stake.
I really don`t care who you worked for.....
you were protected by your surroundings...
trust me when i say this...on paper yes Europe will appear to be United...
In actuallity never...those are the fatcs...

There is still bad blood amongst alot of the nations that are part of the EU even now.
Sooner or later Germany`s arrogance will lead to its downfall again......

You may have taken spcial courses, bwsides going to college in Eurpe and doing my graduate studies also un Europe, I also have hands on experiance living in all the countries at one time or another that I speak there language......
Depends on what you mean by "Unified Europe". A lot of people assume that the EU wants to be US v2.0 (hence why everyone was saying they should copy the American model for their constitution, when that was in the news), but that's not really the case. Due to its history, it will remain a supernational union of sovereign countries and will not be a federal state. The vast majority of poeple do not want this as well. Having said that being "unified" doesn't mean being a single federal state. It has done a lot and has a lot more to do as a union of countries.

My view is, the EU should be striving to bring as many benefits to countries from integration and size, while still respecting their sovereignty. Not an easy task, but they've done alright so far...
 

Forsythe

Platinum Member
May 2, 2004
2,825
0
0
Originally posted by: Martin
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson
Originally posted by: JEDIYoda
Unified Europe---NEVER!!
I beg to differ...
I took special courses in European integration, I worked for the European Commission in Brussels... those people realy plan for the long term, and despite the amount of bureaucracy, they are aware that the future of the continent is at stake.
I really don`t care who you worked for.....
you were protected by your surroundings...
trust me when i say this...on paper yes Europe will appear to be United...
In actuallity never...those are the fatcs...

There is still bad blood amongst alot of the nations that are part of the EU even now.
Sooner or later Germany`s arrogance will lead to its downfall again......

You may have taken spcial courses, bwsides going to college in Eurpe and doing my graduate studies also un Europe, I also have hands on experiance living in all the countries at one time or another that I speak there language......
Depends on what you mean by "Unified Europe". A lot of people assume that the EU wants to be US v2.0 (hence why everyone was saying they should copy the American model for their constitution, when that was in the news), but that's not really the case. Due to its history, it will remain a supernational union of sovereign countries and will not be a federal state. The vast majority of poeple do not want this as well. Having said that being "unified" doesn't mean being a single federal state. It has done a lot and has a lot more to do as a union of countries.

My view is, the EU should be striving to bring as many benefits to countries from integration and size, while still respecting their sovereignty. Not an easy task, but they've done alright so far...
What they're trying to accomplish is making a united front, military and political, but added in breaking down the trade barriers.
But i the goal is not a united states. And many europeans don't want it that way.

My goal would be getting the entire world in the european union.
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Originally posted by: AnitaPeterson
What's funny - in the context, considering IdaGno advocates "putting things out of their misery" - is that these issues cannot be solved by the local government in a manner acceptable to Westerners, simply because they don't have money to do things "by the book", yet the Westerners never get truly implicated, and really love pointing fingers.

Hopefully, EU membership will solve this, once the economy is stable. Communism left a criminal legacy which will take decades to completely dissipate...

The example of Czech Republic, Hungary and especially the baltic republics proves that entering the EU triggers major economic developments mostly caused by increased inflow of foreign direct investments. Let's see if Romania and Bulgaria repeat the miracle.

On related news, Ukraine seems to be able to meet the targets they fixed in order to ask as soon as possible to enter the EU also.
 

chcarnage

Golden Member
May 11, 2005
1,751
0
0
Congratulations to Bulgaria and Romania. They made it now after missing the 2004 round. However the hesitating majority of the EU members percieved Romania and Bulgaria as a compulsory exercise. EU membership is a good motivator for reforms but the moment comes when it has to be realised. It's not 100% over yet as some iudicative reforms still are in progress. Should Bulgaria or Romania fail to deliver the final result, the EU could hold back or cut down its support money. The other members are free to decide if they fix an immigration or workforce contingent for a limited period of time. Bottom line, it's an important step for two countries that often are percieved as peripheral. But it's not a switch to flip but a process that requires much preparation and postprocessing.

After its Iraq dispute, the EU has understood that it needs to act more united. Uncoordinated foreign policy with Iraq dimensions won't happen anymore. Uncoordinated actions make them less attractive for the US and less powerful in negotiations with other powers.

The Balkan states are in an unconfortable situation. First, the EU thinks that it is saturated for a while now. It is unlikely that they turn a blind eye on closely missed membership criteria. Second, they often don't fulfill said criteria. Croatia is the only candidate who may become a member in the forseeable future. Serbia is on a nationalistic ego-trip and it has a snowball's chance in hell to enter the EU as long as Mladic is free and the Kosovo relationship in limbo. Most aren't ready from an institutional and economical viewpoint. In the long run, the Balkan risks to become a white spot on the political map again.

Turkey put its EU efforts on hold at the moment. It formally has a EU minister but he has other jobs as well. It is true that many in the EU are sceptic about Turkey but Turkey has the means to convince them. In my opinion religion isn't a big issue (the EU doesn't define itself through religion). But the political influence of the military and the limited independence of the iudicative are serious obstacles. I think that membership is impossible as long as Article 301 allows to incarcerate anybody for "insulting the Turkish nation". The EU might overlook the Armenian genocide but the Turkish-Cyprian relations are another problem yet to be solved.
 

halik

Lifer
Oct 10, 2000
25,708
1
0
hmm how the hell will those two countries pass the economic criteria to join?
 

chcarnage

Golden Member
May 11, 2005
1,751
0
0
Originally posted by: halik
hmm how the hell will those two countries pass the economic criteria to join?
The hard criteria aren't per capita statistics but percentages. In the Maastricht Treaty, EU countries agreed that their new indebtness should be lower than 3% of the GDP and the total national debt should not cross the 60% mark. I don't know of other written economy criteria. Apparently both countries are below the limits.

But like I said, the EU didn't have much leeway, both countries are on the waiting list since quite some time, promises were made, the candidates made some important steps and the membership is still tied to some last criteria but these hopefully are only technicalities.

Originally posted by: Art Vandelay
Few dare to answer after me!
Do I get a cookie? :p
Give me some time... You're the first who asks.
 

ASK THE COMMUNITY