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Republican Religious Wackos Score a Win

strummer

Senior member
Feb 1, 2006
208
0
0
H.R. 4411 passed last night as an Amendment to a Port Security Bill. How nice of Bill Frist to tie this piece of nanny state legislation to a security Bill. Wjhat a nice little present for all the religious kooks out there. Link to Bill summary is below.

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=7230&sequence=0

All that needs to happen now is for the 10-gallon hat in the Whitehouse to sign it to make it law. Had enough yet? A bigger bunch of a$$holes has never been in power.

If you don't like gambling - don't gamble. How hard is that to understand. Leave me alone - I'll do what I want with my money. They are absolutely ruining our country.
 

strummer

Senior member
Feb 1, 2006
208
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Originally posted by: Leon
Republican Religious Wackos
OP forgot to mention that overwhelming number of D voted for the bill as well>


In typical shifty Republican fashion - they tied the Gambling Bill to a Homeland Security Bill. It was sponsered and championed by Republicans. Do some research.

That's why they did it that way - so the less enlightened among us proles would be fooled into thinking that this was some bipartisan Bill. Excuse me for being harsh - but get with the program.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
1
0
Originally posted by: Leon
Republican Religious Wackos
OP forgot to mention that overwhelming number of D voted for the bill as well>
I don't follow this that well.. Wasn't the vote for the "Port Security Bill" and not for the scumsucking pork they tie to it.

I want criminal punishment for ALL PORK BILLS .. ESPECIALLY THOSE TIED TO HOMELAND SECURITY
 

Harvey

Administrator<br>Elite Member
Administrator
Oct 9, 1999
35,052
28
86
There's more than enough religious BS used to justify legislation, but this has nothing to do with religion. I think gambling, online or in casinos, is tasteless parasitic garbage and it is known to be as addictive and destructive to some people as hard drugs. I have no problem avoiding them. but there are more serious issues.

The problem isn't whether gambling should or will be allowed. It already is in more places than I care to see. The problem is that, unlike U.S. based casinos, most gaming sites are off shore and unregulated. Without oversight, they can be, and have been, used for tax evasion, and money laundering, and they are very difficult to regulate to prevent access by minors.

Another problem is that onshore casinos are licensed by the jurisidictions where they're located. Unregulated online gambling deprives states and counties of a revenue source to support their jurisdictions.

Personally, I'd like to see the onshore casinos shut down, just as a matter of good taste. I know that's not going to happen, but the real problems posed by online gambling sites need to be addressed if they're ever going to be allowed.
 

bobdelt

Senior member
May 26, 2006
918
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In typical shifty Republican fashion
In typical politician fashion is more like it. Don't act like democracts are holy people and dont do that stuff either.

 

strummer

Senior member
Feb 1, 2006
208
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0
Originally posted by: Harvey
There's more than enough religious BS used to justify legislation, but this has nothing to do with religion. I think gambling, online or in casinos, is tasteless parasitic garbage and it is known to be as addictive and destructive to some people as hard drugs. I have no problem avoiding them. but there are more serious issues.

The problem isn't whether gambling should or will be allowed. It already is in more places than I care to see. The problem is that, unlike U.S. based casinos, most gaming sites are off shore and unregulated. Without oversight, they can be, and have been, used for tax evasion, and money laundering, and they are very difficult to regulate to prevent access by minors.

Another problem is that onshore casinos are licensed by the jurisidictions where they're located. Unregulated online gambling deprives states and counties of a revenue source to support their jurisdictions.

Personally, I'd like to see the onshore casinos shut down, just as a matter of good taste. I know that's not going to happen, but the real problems posed by online gambling sites need to be addressed if they're ever going to be allowed.


Don't like gambling - then don't gamble. It provides a lot of jobs and it is a form of entertainment. I have no problem with it. I like putting $50 on a couple games with my buddies. I like going to vegas and Atlantic City. If you don't like it - then just don't do it. It is a simple solution.

And this is all about appeasing religious wackos before the midterm elections. Look at some of Frist's quotes on the matter.
 

Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
11,710
1,015
126
I totally agree with what Harvey said above.

I remember a few months ago when this bill was being publically discussed that one of the main objections to it was it didn't really have any teeth to it, that it's provisions would be ridiculously easy to circumvent. Hopefully this is not the case.

If people are fool enough to gamble, it should be done locally (for jobs and tax income) and with vigorous, adequate regulation (nonexistent in on-line gambling).
 

Schadenfroh

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2003
38,416
3
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I think this has more to do with them not being able to tax internet gambling effectively.
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,210
456
126
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
I think this has more to do with them not being able to tax internet gambling effectively.
I think this poster hit the nail on the head.
 

Harvey

Administrator<br>Elite Member
Administrator
Oct 9, 1999
35,052
28
86
Originally posted by: strummer
Don't like gambling - then don't gamble. It provides a lot of jobs and it is a form of entertainment. I have no problem with it. I like putting $50 on a couple games with my buddies. I like going to vegas and Atlantic City. If you don't like it - then just don't do it. It is a simple solution.

And this is all about appeasing religious wackos before the midterm elections. Look at some of Frist's quotes on the matter.
Nice job of reading my post, there, buddy. You didn't address anything I said. :thumbsdown:

You're welcome to gamble on your own time, your own dime and your own turf, but online gambling on offshore sites doesn't accomplish any jobs or revenue for any Americans, and if you knew anything about math, you'd know that it's one of the worst investments you could make, even for your own entertainment.

My reply addressed the premise of your title, that the bille was passed by "religious whackos." If you've read many of my posts, you'd know I'm no fan of religion, especially when it comes to the law, but in this case, you're just dead ass wrong that this has anything to do with religion.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,908
44
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: strummer
H.R. 4411 passed last night as an Amendment to a Port Security Bill. How nice of Bill Frist to tie this piece of nanny state legislation to a security Bill. Wjhat a nice little present for all the religious kooks out there. Link to Bill summary is below.

http://www.cbo.gov/showdoc.cfm?index=7230&sequence=0

All that needs to happen now is for the 10-gallon hat in the Whitehouse to sign it to make it law. Had enough yet? A bigger bunch of a$$holes has never been in power.

If you don't like gambling - don't gamble. How hard is that to understand. Leave me alone - I'll do what I want with my money.

They are absolutely ruining our country.
It's not "our" Country anymore, it belongs to the Corporations and Politicos that have their puppet strings pulled.

Everything is all about the almight buck.

They couldn't get tax money from the offshore operations so they locked it down because it takes away revenue from State Lotteries and other Casinos in the U.S.

They tie everything to 9-11 and Homeland Security so the Sheeple feel like they are being "protected".
 

slash196

Golden Member
Nov 1, 2004
1,549
0
0
Honestly, I don't see this as that important. Gambling is the past-time of the foolish and ignorant, and the revenue collected by the state is as close as we have to a tax on stupidity. Frankly I don't see the big deal about this bill.
 

Strk

Lifer
Nov 23, 2003
10,199
4
76
It's not a religious issue. It's an issue with the sites mostly being in another country.
 

ericlp

Diamond Member
Dec 24, 2000
6,067
176
106
The way I see it is... Congress/white house whatever is full of religious crud.

There is no way around it. Repub or Dem.... You still gotta strut your religious pride or you won't even get your foot in the door. Sadly too many americans are so wrapped up in religious activities it has and will continue to change politics no matter who is in power. I'm sure religious people are all for it too and why not? I am sure there are some very few that got in by stroke of luck that are religious but don't bow down or let religion distort their judgment or ruling but most think they can talk to god and let their religion swing the vote for them... I fear if this gets much worse pretty soon if you want to go to a public state run school or a public college you'll have to recite some verse out of the bible or even come down to getting a loan for a car or home you may not get the rate of someone with faith. Dunno, I could be taking this too far... But, I can see it happening.

Welcome to America....

Sigh...

I don't gamble but if I did... I would gamble in the stock market at least if you lose you can get some of it back via a tax write off...
 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,210
456
126
Originally posted by: ericlp
The way I see it is... Congress/white house whatever is full of religious crud.

There is no way around it. Repub or Dem.... You still gotta strut your religious pride or you won't even get your foot in the door. Sadly too many americans are so wrapped up in religious activities it has and will continue to change politics no matter who is in power. I'm sure religious people are all for it too and why not? I am sure there are some very few that got in by stroke of luck that are religious but don't bow down or let religion distort their judgment or ruling but most think they can talk to god and let their religion swing the vote for them... I fear if this gets much worse pretty soon if you want to go to a public state run school or a public college you'll have to recite some verse out of the bible or even come down to getting a loan for a car or home you may not get the rate of someone with faith. Dunno, I could be taking this too far... But, I can see it happening.

Welcome to America....

Sigh...

I don't gamble but if I did... I would gamble in the stock market at least if you lose you can get some of it back via a tax write off...

If you believe this has to do with religion it seems to me the religious right has fooled you too.

If a way is found to tax this watch how fast it becomes legal just like all the lotteries these so called religious people you see spend billions on yearly.;)
 

strummer

Senior member
Feb 1, 2006
208
0
0
Originally posted by: Harvey
...and if you knew anything about math, you'd know that it's one of the worst investments you could make, even for your own entertainment.

My reply addressed the premise of your title, that the bille was passed by "religious whackos." If you've read many of my posts, you'd know I'm no fan of religion, especially when it comes to the law, but in this case, you're just dead ass wrong that this has anything to do with religion.

What does knowing something about math have to do with anything. That statement makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Its like trying to compare apples and dogs. Gambling is entertainment - investments are not entertainment - and thus gambling is not an investment. See the little logic thingy I did there. BTW - I hold a couple post graduate degrees, one in business and one in engineering, so maybe I know a little bit of math. Just a little tiny bit.

Unfortunately, I must also disagree with your conclusion vis-a-vis religion and the gambling Bill. If you know anything about the good Dr. Bill Frist, you know he is running for President in 2008, and he needs to make his make his bones on some cultural issues before Dobson, Falwell, Robertson and all the other leaders of the American Taliban will line up to support him. Dobson et al have complained recently that they haven't gotten their just rewards for providing the GOP with their electoral successes in 2000, 2002 and 2004. They are getting a little antsy, and boy do they have the GOP by the balls right about now. You see, most of the sane part of the electorate is pissed off at W and the GOP for giving us the Iraq fiasco and if the religious wacko base doesn't turn out in November, the GOP is going to get their a$$es kicked.

Don't take my word for it. Go to Focus on the Family's (Dobson's) website. Go to any of the website's for these Christofascists. They have a problem with all gambling, not just the internet variety. Its just that the offshore variety is an easy target becasue they don't have the monster lobbying presence of the casinos/horse betting and no one is relying on a tax revenue stream from them. So this has everything to do with religion, and these people forcing their beliefs and wants on the entire society. Frist is doing their bidding for personal and party reasons. The personal reason - he wants to be President; the Party reason - he needs Dobson et al to get out the vote this November or the GOP will get trounced (still going to happen - by the way).

Now thoughout the thread people have been writing that the government really just wants to tax the revenue stream. The thing is the taxes that the Casinos and tracks pay are essential income streams for local and State governments. They could not function without them, just like they could not function without the State lotteries. Now if the internet gaming was hosted Stateside - then they would've probably been safe because no one is going to accept losing that tax base to placate some religious wackos. They were an easy mark because no one relies on them for tax revenue, thus they were served up to make the Christofascists happy.

 

1prophet

Diamond Member
Aug 17, 2005
5,210
456
126
This bill which was reintroduced by both a democrat and republican, with an exemption for horse racing , as always follow the money.;)

"Congress has grappled with this issue for ten years, and during that time we've watched this shadow industry explode," said Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist (R-Tennessee). "For me as majority leader, the bottom line is simple: Internet gambling is illegal. Although we can't monitor every online gambler or regulate offshore gambling, we can police the financial institutions that disregard our laws."


Internet Gambling Prohibition Act re-introduced


Congressmen Bob Goodlatte (R-Virginia) and Rick Boucher (D-Virginia) on Thursday re-introduced the Internet Gambling Prohibition Act, which would crack down on illegal, off-shore gambling and gambling with the assistance of the Internet.

The bill includes a provision to exempt horse racing, which will be allowed to continue to accept Internet wagers.

The representatives said illegal gambling sucks billions of dollars each year out of the United States economy, serves as a vehicle for money laundering, undermines families, and threatens the ability of states to enact and enforce their own laws. Goodlatte said illegal Internet gambling is a $12-billion industry.

"I have been continuously committed to putting an end to gambling on the Internet," Goodlatte said. "For too long, our children have been placed in harm's way as online gambling has been permitted to flourish into a $12-billion industry. The Internet Gambling Prohibition Act brings the current ban against interstate gambling up to speed with the development of new technology."

Congressmen Goodlatte and Boucher previously introduced similar legislation in both the 2002-'03 and the '03-04 sessions of Congress only to have the legislation derailed. The Internet Gambling Prohibition Act cracks down on illegal gambling by updating the Wire Act to cover all forms of interstate gambling and account for new technologies.

Under current federal law, it is unclear whether using the Internet to operate a gambling business is illegal. The closest useful statute currently is the Wire Act, which prohibits gambling over telephone wires.

"The explosive growth of the Internet has provided a means for gambling operations to evade existing anti-gambling laws," Boucher stated. "These Internet gambling websites typically operate offshore and often serve as a prime vehicle for money laundering and other criminal enterprises. Our bill sensibly updates federal law to keep pace with new technologies by bringing the Internet within the fold of the anti-gambling restrictions that govern telephones."

The Internet Gambling Prohibition Act has been referred to the House Judiciary Committee, on which Goodlatte and Boucher both are members, for further consideration.

Looks like the Christofascists ponies got an exemption, so much for this being about religion:laugh:



One more link about internet gambling.
 

Lucky

Lifer
Nov 26, 2000
13,126
1
0
You're welcome to gamble on your own time, your own dime and your own turf, but online gambling on offshore sites doesn't accomplish any jobs or revenue for any Americans, and if you knew anything about math, you'd know that it's one of the worst investments you could make, even for your own entertainment.


Bzzzzzzzzzzt. Plenty of people gamble, quite effectively. Many of those depend on that income for either part or all of their income.

There are plenty of forms of gambling that are not completely dependent on chance. Even for those games that are, there are still ways to make decent money playing them. "Investment"? Hah. Many people make a living via online gaming. I did for several years.
 

BaliBabyDoc

Lifer
Jan 20, 2001
10,737
0
0
I'm a little confused. Does the bill ban offshore gambling or online gambling? The former basically means US companies will just swoop in and take over the racket . . . I bet the mob will get a big piece of that action. The latter seems odd. Why ban one particular medium used for gambling? Further, if it's so bad . . . why allow any exemptions?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Sep 30, 2003
26,916
172
106
Originally posted by: 1prophet
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
I think this has more to do with them not being able to tax internet gambling effectively.
I think this poster hit the nail on the head.
Yes, and I woundn't be surprised if another reason was to protect the U.S.'s casino's. I wonder if they lobbied for this?

While I really don't think it has anything to do with religion, I wouldn't be surprised to see some polititions spinning this to religious groups to get votes come election time.

Fern
 

engineereeyore

Platinum Member
Jul 23, 2005
2,070
0
0
Unless I'm misunderstanding, the law only affects people who are betting illegally anyway. How does it affect people who are doing everything legally?

Please help me understand if I'm missing something.
 

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