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Recording Woes

M

Minerva

Platinum Member
Fellas!

What would you do?

17 albums were recorded into 24/96 format. We just found the turntable was NOT checked for accuracy and indeed, everything is 58 cents fast. (verified with test record and two engineers with freaking bat ears! :Q)

If we shift the pitch straight down 58 cents it sounds like it should but these guys are arguing that it is NOT the same as if the record was spinning at the correct speed. They're talking about stylus contact with the grooves and all this other stuff.

Obviously it would be a LOT easier to shift down the files on the HDD but (I'm told) the right thing to do is re-record all 17 LP's! :frown:

Any LP fans have any input on this? I'm sure there is a a difference or they would not argue over this (then again men argue over the dumbest things like BEER and FOOTBALL hehehe). I supposed I can compromise for the benefit of the doubt and try one record at the right speed and see if there is an audible difference. 🙂
 
Originally posted by: Minerva
Fellas!

What would you do?

17 albums were recorded into 24/96 format. We just found the turntable was NOT checked for accuracy and indeed, everything is 58 cents fast. (verified with test record and two engineers with freaking bat ears! :Q)

If we shift the pitch straight down 58 cents it sounds like it should but these guys are arguing that it is NOT the same as if the record was spinning at the correct speed. They're talking about stylus contact with the grooves and all this other stuff.

Obviously it would be a LOT easier to shift down the files on the HDD but (I'm told) the right thing to do is re-record all 17 LP's! :frown:

Any LP fans have any input on this? I'm sure there is a a difference or they would not argue over this (then again men argue over the dumbest things like BEER and FOOTBALL hehehe). I supposed I can compromise for the benefit of the doubt and try one record at the right speed and see if there is an audible difference. 🙂
Click to expand...

Are these 33 1/3 rpm LP's or 78's? As far as I know, the only REAL stylus / groove geometery issues are with really old 78's. I see you say LP in one sentence.
That being said.....They are correct, the PROPER way is to re-record them and check speed for each record prior to transfer if it is a belt drive TurnTable. Heat becomes an issue with PLATTER speed.
I believe the issue with Pitch Shifting down electronically would be harmonic dissonances .

Pro-Tools may have a Pitch Shifting plug in ( I assume this is the platform you recorded to). I would try one electronically and then re-record the same. Set up a double blind test and compare. Go with the one you ( the rate paying customer) like better.
Then I would not let the 1st engineer off the hook for not verifying Turntable pitch. That's like not checking bias level and reproduce levels prior to tracking on 2 inch. Not really good technique.
Sometimes engineers do things the hard way just to say they did it that way.
< Done things the hard way before.... like (at the artist's request) synching 8 ADATs for a major label CD project instead of renting 2 x 24 track Studers

 
Originally posted by: C6FT7
It looks ok but usenet has been around forever. 😉
Click to expand...
I'm sure it has.
As for OK,

If you look and see who is actually posting in the ProSound Web site forum's , it reads like a virtual compendium of Audio Engineering in all it'f facets, the continuation of the Classic Audio Magazine Recording Engineering / Producing aka R E/P as well as today's cuurent print media giant ProSound News.
I'ld say it's a bit more than OK, but then I've been doing it (audio ...recording , live and Installed) for over 30 years, so, what the hell do I know?😉
 
Originally posted by: Minerva
Fellas!

What would you do?

17 albums were recorded into 24/96 format. We just found the turntable was NOT checked for accuracy and indeed, everything is 58 cents fast. (verified with test record and two engineers with freaking bat ears! :Q)

If we shift the pitch straight down 58 cents it sounds like it should but these guys are arguing that it is NOT the same as if the record was spinning at the correct speed. They're talking about stylus contact with the grooves and all this other stuff.

Obviously it would be a LOT easier to shift down the files on the HDD but (I'm told) the right thing to do is re-record all 17 LP's! :frown:

Any LP fans have any input on this? I'm sure there is a a difference or they would not argue over this (then again men argue over the dumbest things like BEER and FOOTBALL hehehe). I supposed I can compromise for the benefit of the doubt and try one record at the right speed and see if there is an audible difference. 🙂
Click to expand...


what is 58 cents? thats like what, a whole step? A crappy pitch shifting algorith will leave audible artifacts even if you shift just a 1/4 step....
 
Yeah those vinyl hounds are weird. Look if aliens did land and hid their spaceship somewhere, these guys probably were flying the darn thing! 😀
 
This might be over simplifying it, but with the tools I've worked with, pitch shifting is done independent of time...you can change the pitch without speeding up or slowing down the recording, or you can speed it up or slow it down without changing the pitch. it sounds like you need to do both. IIRC, in most software it involves using the speed up/slow down function, and disabling the "leave pitch unchanged" option. that would proabably be the best option short of re-recording.
 
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