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Question Recommended Gear / Find My Bottleneck (not a wifi issue)

southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
I want to stream from machine to machine as fast as possible- what router will give me the fastest ethernet speeds?

Is any other component here a bottleneck?

(Rather than describe my network, I just made a diagram. This is all CAT5e.)

Obviously my ISP-issued modem/router is my current performance bottleneck- dropped frames, latency, etc.

I'm not looking for a budget component, although I'm not opposed to one. Performance is paramount, and a good UI that makes management clear is a close second.
network-diagram@1.5x.png
 

VirtualLarry

Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
49,223
5,466
126
Are you talking about using some sort of remote-streaming, from one console on your (wired?) LAN, to your PC on the wired LAN, or vice-versa?

If the traffic is all LAN traffic, it doesn't run through the router's CPU, generally-speaking, and thus, doesn't have any real performance impact.
 

southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
Are you talking about using some sort of remote-streaming, from one console on your (wired?) LAN, to your PC on the wired LAN, or vice-versa?
Yep, this is all LAN traffic I’m talking about here.

All game streaming from device to device on my network is, in a word, mediocre. Steam games from one PC to another, Xbox to PC, PC to Shield. I get dropped frames, latency, lag, and I never get full resolution.

When I tried the Nvidia GeForce now service it blew away streaming the same game from my local machine. Shouldn’t local streaming via Ethernet be faster and more responsive?
 

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
5,523
667
126
How can you connect so many devices to your ISP modem ? If it's just a modem, it should only have one ethernet port.

I suppose it's a modem gateway? What model?

If it's all wired, there is no reason for dropped packets or latency for LAN traffic. Are you sure you are talking about LAN traffic, not internet?

Did you run ethernet cables right along electric cords? That might create electrical interference.
 
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VirtualLarry

Lifer
Aug 25, 2001
49,223
5,466
126
It sounds like (ethernet) cable problems to me. What happens, if you place both the console and PC in the same room? And connect them both to a router, doesn't have to be "the" internet router, just something that can pass LAN traffic, and offer DHCP services.
 

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
5,523
667
126
I wonder whether OP wired it wrong and the network diagram is also wrong , somehow he creates a loop inside his LAN?

OP please put IP address next to all devices so we have a more clear idea, please turn off one of the DHCP servers too if both the modem gateway and the TPlink AP are serving DHCP clients. In most cases you should turn off the DHCP server on TP-Link AP.

And be sure to uplink TP-Link AP to the modem gateway using a LAN port, not its WAN port. Using the WAN port creates a NAT network inside your LAN and you have 2 LANs.
 
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southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
Thanks for the replies, guys.

Yeah, I have the DHCP turned off on the TP Link . (Screenshots from the TP-LINK to follow)

Screen Shot 2020-04-08 at 9.12.40 AM.png

Additionally it's set to access point mode.

Screen Shot 2020-04-08 at 9.09.22 AM.png

And it's on a static IP

Screen Shot 2020-04-08 at 9.12.54 AM.png

Great question, however, the TP-LINK is *not* issuing IP addresses.

It's worth mentioning that the issue occurred *before* I even added the TP Link as an access point. Streaming from the first floor Win10 machine to the basement Shield is terrible. It's worth mentioning that the games in question run on the machine 1080p 60+fps no problem.

My ISP modem is also a router/firewall/etc- it *is* my network. That's why I have so many devices plugged into it.

I am 100% going to get another router so that my modem can merely be just a modem and not responsible for my network, I'm just wondering what would be the best to get with my current goals of streaming from device to device.
 

southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
How can you connect so many devices to your ISP modem ? If it's just a modem, it should only have one ethernet port.

I suppose it's a modem gateway? What model?
It's a Pace 5268AC.

If it's all wired, there is no reason for dropped packets or latency for LAN traffic. Are you sure you are talking about LAN traffic, not internet?
I can't say with absolute certainty how much Nvidia GameStream or Xbox streaming 'phones home', but in theory, this should just be local IP to local IP, yes.

The irony is, is that you can run a diagnostic on the Shield between the Shield itself and the machine you'll be streaming from. I pass the test with flying colors. Once it starts streaming though- it goes into 720p, starts dropping frames and becomes as laggy as all hell.

Xbox streaming (streaming from xbox to PC) behaves the same exact way. Tests amazingly, then resolution tanks, then it starts getting laggy.

I'm pretty fastidious with my Win10 machines. They are single-purpose, gaming machines. Steam, Origin, and Epic clients; drivers and OS, that's it. I don't even have google chrome installed on either of them.

Did you run ethernet cables right along electric cords? That might create electrical interference.
They're run right alongside the cables the previous owner used to run cable television throughout the house. I do not have cable, so they have no signal going through them.
 

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
5,523
667
126
I don't play game and don't have any nVidia Shield or MS Xbox, also hardly stream videos around the house.

I highly doubt it has anything to do with the router, however.

I did find that nvidia Shield 2017 has video stuttering problem from the beginning according to this nVidia forum post.


Reddit users have similar experiences too.

==

If you are really onto replacing the router, take a look at Ubiquiti Edge routers.


 
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southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
Hmm, still sounds like a cable-quality issue
Ok, fair enough. Going with both of those hypothesis- if it was a cable quality issue, would I still be able to get 122 megabits (15.25 MB) download speed from the internet on any of the devices on the other floors?

Anecdotal examples: the shield device in the basement is able to stream games from the internet with minimal latency, and the PC in the upstairs is able to download Steam games at 14MBs constantly.

or networking loop (broadcast storm) issue to me.
This is the first time I've heard that term, so I have definitely learned something, thanks.

In reading up on that, one way to diagnose the issue is to disconnect everything except the two devices attempting to communicate with one another, set a baseline, and then see if adding devices creates latency.

I should've done that to begin with. I will remove all devices, turn off wifi- verify that my PC and my Shield are the only devices connected and issued IP addresses, and then proceed.

Thank you for the discussion guys.
 

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
5,523
667
126
OP actually use a direct cable and plug in both ends to PC and nVidia Shield/MS Xbox to test the streaming video.
 

southernmagnus

Junior Member
Jul 12, 2006
6
0
66
Guys, thanks again for the discussion. Networking has always been an area of improvement for me, your suggestions have helped me move the needle forward.

So, got my Netgear Nighthawk X4S, placed my modem in bridge mode, and reserved IP addresses for every device on the network.

The Nighthawk is reporting its address on the WAN (?) as the same value that my modem reported, so I feel confident that bridge mode is set up correctly.

Here is my updated diagram, with IP addresses.

network-diagram@1.5x.png
Immediately after setting this up, with reserved IPs, the second floor machine (192.168.1.14) quit having an intermittent connection issue (we used to just reboot the Access Point at 192.168.1.70).

Thank you @SamirD for the iPerf suggestion. Again, this is a basic tool that I had no knowledge of.

Following the testing methodology laid out here, I ran an iPerf test from one Win10 machine (192.168.1.3) to another (192.168.1.14). As an aside, the ladies in the house were streaming HD video from Hulu and Netflix via Wifi during this test.

Annotation 2020-04-12 112853.png

Those results seem more than acceptable. Later, I moved the Win10 machine at 192.168.1.3 down to the basement where it would be behind the switch and ran the test to 192.168.1.14 again.

This would force traffic to go through the Netgear Switch > Nighthawk Router > TP Link extender. This represents the most complex ethernet based scenario in my network. The results were within 5-10 Mbits of the above screenshot- sometimes more, sometimes less, overall 902 Mbits/sec.

The end result? The nVidia Shield streaming finally works. It still has a slight 'networked' feel, with a hair of latency and some visible compression on the video, but it's night and day.

The Xbox Console companion (streaming from Xbox to PC), however, is still bad. Super compressed, big input latency, very noticeable image compression. I'm going to chalk that up to software/implementation.

Gentlemen, this was a very fun way to spend my quarantine. Thanks again.

EDIT: I feel reasonably confident I don't have a double NAT- the Nighthawk is able to assign IPs for devices connected through the Access Point upstairs.
 

mxnerd

Diamond Member
Jul 6, 2007
5,523
667
126
Does OP also have WiFi adapters that connect to the router at the same time? If yes, OP need to set network priorities for wired ethernet & wifi adapters for each PC. Give wired ethernet a lower number than wifi to have a higher priority.

 

Ready4Droid

Junior Member
Apr 12, 2020
12
1
11
Guys, thanks again for the discussion. Networking has always been an area of improvement for me, your suggestions have helped me move the needle forward.

So, got my Netgear Nighthawk X4S, placed my modem in bridge mode, and reserved IP addresses for every device on the network.

The Nighthawk is reporting its address on the WAN (?) as the same value that my modem reported, so I feel confident that bridge mode is set up correctly.

Here is my updated diagram, with IP addresses.

View attachment 19519
Immediately after setting this up, with reserved IPs, the second floor machine (192.168.1.14) quit having an intermittent connection issue (we used to just reboot the Access Point at 192.168.1.70).

Thank you @SamirD for the iPerf suggestion. Again, this is a basic tool that I had no knowledge of.

Following the testing methodology laid out here, I ran an iPerf test from one Win10 machine (192.168.1.3) to another (192.168.1.14). As an aside, the ladies in the house were streaming HD video from Hulu and Netflix via Wifi during this test.

View attachment 19520

Those results seem more than acceptable. Later, I moved the Win10 machine at 192.168.1.3 down to the basement where it would be behind the switch and ran the test to 192.168.1.14 again.

This would force traffic to go through the Netgear Switch > Nighthawk Router > TP Link extender. This represents the most complex ethernet based scenario in my network. The results were within 5-10 Mbits of the above screenshot- sometimes more, sometimes less, overall 902 Mbits/sec.

The end result? The nVidia Shield streaming finally works. It still has a slight 'networked' feel, with a hair of latency and some visible compression on the video, but it's night and day.

The Xbox Console companion (streaming from Xbox to PC), however, is still bad. Super compressed, big input latency, very noticeable image compression. I'm going to chalk that up to software/implementation.

Gentlemen, this was a very fun way to spend my quarantine. Thanks again.

EDIT: I feel reasonably confident I don't have a double NAT- the Nighthawk is able to assign IPs for devices connected through the Access Point upstairs.
Great, I was going to suggest iperf3 as well, I used it when I was having slow file transfer speeds through my wifi. Those numbers look very good and seems to be working well.
 

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