In the same vein of this thread, I'm looking for a new TV. Thinking something between 42"-46", HD, and LCD. I will be using it for computer gaming in addition to HD TV (thus the desire for 1080p). I'd say viewing distance is between 8-12 feet (where 720p might cut it.. but for gaming I'd like the 1080 resolution a bit more - agreed?). Also wanted some opinions on contrast ratios, most TVs are only listing dynamic contrast ratios overtly, and I was wondering what kind of range you guys would recommend. I've been leaning toward a 46" Sharp Aquos with a dynamic ratio of 10,000:1 (pretty nice blacks?) that seems much higher than a lot of its counterparts. However, the banding issues that are being noticed with the d62u series are kinda holding me back. Having said all that, anyone have some suggestions? 🙂 I was over at avsforum, but really, there's almost too much information there without some more direction from me. Looking to spend somewhere upwards of 17-1800. So not too heavily, will that be a problem?
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Recommendation on a 1080p HD LCD?
- Thread starter TheVrolok
- Start date
kalrith
Diamond Member
First of all, calculating dynamic contrast ratio is subjective and therefore should not be used unless comparing two TVs from the same manufacturer. See this thread at avsforum starting with the post I linked you to. According to them a native CR of 1500:1 to 2000:1 is excellent. Native CR can be objectively tested and should have more weight behind the numbers. Also, good reviews will do their own objective testing of the native CR, and you should scout the net for any and all professional reviews you can find about the TVs you consider purchasing.
The main question I have is where you plan to purchase it. If you're willing to order it online, then you'll probably be able to fit a better TV into your budget. Is glare an issue in your room? If so, then be sure to get a TV with a matte screen and not a glossy screen.
This 46" Sony Bravia seems to be a good deal at $1,900 shipped. It's $2,300 at Circuit City and Best Buy. Another TV to consider is the Olevia 747i. Here are two reviews: 1 & 2. It's a little out of your price range, but according to this thread it was $1,710 + tax + shipping a few days ago. I tried to input the coupon code, and Amazon wouldn't take it.
The main question I have is where you plan to purchase it. If you're willing to order it online, then you'll probably be able to fit a better TV into your budget. Is glare an issue in your room? If so, then be sure to get a TV with a matte screen and not a glossy screen.
This 46" Sony Bravia seems to be a good deal at $1,900 shipped. It's $2,300 at Circuit City and Best Buy. Another TV to consider is the Olevia 747i. Here are two reviews: 1 & 2. It's a little out of your price range, but according to this thread it was $1,710 + tax + shipping a few days ago. I tried to input the coupon code, and Amazon wouldn't take it.
Let me just say this. Contrast ratio ratings have become useless. As soon as manufacturers realized consumers had heard that they should look at the contrast ratio to tell a good LCD from a bad one...up went the ratings and away went their credibility.
The only way to judge contrast ratio is to go to the store and into the video settings. Change the picture mode to "standard" instead of "dynamic" or "vivid" or whatever word they may use for "overly white and crappy dark enhancement" mode. In addition turn off any contrast enhancement that the set may try to do to fool your eyes at the expense of PQ.
Then judge the sets. See which truely has the best black level.
How concerned should I be with response time? 8ms on the mentioned Bravia, vs, say, the 4ms of the Sharp Aquos? What about tuners? Do I need an NTSC tuner? Will ATSC support the analog signals of my non-HD channels? I'm pretty much a HD newbie, and I've read the wiki articles and some things I could find on the net but some of it is conflicting and convoluted. Should I get a TV that has both NTSC and ATSC tuners, or even one with a QAM tuner? Or does it really only matter if I plan on picking up Over-The-Air signals?
I know of no TV that has a ATSC tuner that will not tune to NTSC stations.
Definitely get an ATSC tuner though. QAM I don't consider a big deal. You can always have a cable box.
As for response times...again judge them yourself as they are also subject to...advertising. In general, I doubt you will find any objectionable.
What would you recommend for a TV that'll last me at least a few years (say 3-7?)? (negating budget - without getting too extreme) Also, what would you say about sucking it up for a bit longer and waiting until say .. Black Friday, or perhaps the Holiday Season for a purchase? Much better bang for the buck then? (obviously, the longer you wait for technology the cheaper things get)
kalrith
Diamond Member
I think Black Friday is great if you don't want to order online. You MIGHT be able to get a better deal on Black Friday than you can online, but I can't say for sure. Some sites like slickdeals will have a Black Friday forum with a lot of leaked information from employees about what deals there will be and how many of each will be in the store.
Here's another set to consider: JVC 47" for $1,900 shipped. A lot of good things have been said at avsforum about the JVCs, so it's probably a good set to consider. If I were personally getting a 46-47" LCD, the Samsung 4671F, the Sony 46XBR4, and the Toshiba 46LX177 would be at the top of my list. CNET just reviewed the Sony and said "Although not quite as impressive as the best plasmas, the 46-inch Sony KDL-46XBR4 outperforms any flat-panel LCD we've tested so far." They also review the 52" version of the Toshiba. The Samsung 4661F and 4665F have also received good scores from CNET. They are two good models to consider, and they fit better within your price range.
All three of those Samsungs have glossy screens, so don't get them if reflections would be a problem. I'm not sure about the screens on the other TVs.
One big question I have is if you will be doing any PC usage other than gaming. If not, then I would recommend looking into a 1080p plasma, specifically the Panasonics. They have great deals right now, and the only reason I wouldn't get them is if you'll do a lot of web surfing, text typing, etc. that might cause burn in. Even if you do those, if you have a 1-minute screen saver and hid the taskbar, then it could be a non-issue. According to this thread at slickdeals, the 50PZ700U was (and might still be) $2,140 + tax at Sears B&M when you use your Sears card. This isn't the best plasma out there, but only the very best LCDs should be able to trump it in PQ, meaning you would have to spend about 50% on a 52" LCD to match the PQ that the Panasonic plasma will deliver. The Samsung 4671F and Sony 46XBR4 might be able to match the PQ, but they cost more than this TV and are smaller. The jump from 46" to 50" might not seem like much, but the screen size increases by 18% from 903.45 sq. in. to 1067.52 sq. in. (source).
Edit: Here's a link to some more support for 1080p plasmas. In case you don't go there here's a quote:
Here's another set to consider: JVC 47" for $1,900 shipped. A lot of good things have been said at avsforum about the JVCs, so it's probably a good set to consider. If I were personally getting a 46-47" LCD, the Samsung 4671F, the Sony 46XBR4, and the Toshiba 46LX177 would be at the top of my list. CNET just reviewed the Sony and said "Although not quite as impressive as the best plasmas, the 46-inch Sony KDL-46XBR4 outperforms any flat-panel LCD we've tested so far." They also review the 52" version of the Toshiba. The Samsung 4661F and 4665F have also received good scores from CNET. They are two good models to consider, and they fit better within your price range.
All three of those Samsungs have glossy screens, so don't get them if reflections would be a problem. I'm not sure about the screens on the other TVs.
One big question I have is if you will be doing any PC usage other than gaming. If not, then I would recommend looking into a 1080p plasma, specifically the Panasonics. They have great deals right now, and the only reason I wouldn't get them is if you'll do a lot of web surfing, text typing, etc. that might cause burn in. Even if you do those, if you have a 1-minute screen saver and hid the taskbar, then it could be a non-issue. According to this thread at slickdeals, the 50PZ700U was (and might still be) $2,140 + tax at Sears B&M when you use your Sears card. This isn't the best plasma out there, but only the very best LCDs should be able to trump it in PQ, meaning you would have to spend about 50% on a 52" LCD to match the PQ that the Panasonic plasma will deliver. The Samsung 4671F and Sony 46XBR4 might be able to match the PQ, but they cost more than this TV and are smaller. The jump from 46" to 50" might not seem like much, but the screen size increases by 18% from 903.45 sq. in. to 1067.52 sq. in. (source).
Edit: Here's a link to some more support for 1080p plasmas. In case you don't go there here's a quote:
Hulk
Diamond Member
I'm in the same boat and have started researching for a 52" 1080P LCD. Since I want to drive it from a computer as well as the cable box I want to be sure that it will accept HDMI input from the computer video card at 1920x1080. Many LCD's won't do this it seems.
I've been downloading manuals and looking to see what HDMI signals they will accept. The Aquos won't do it. The Sony XBR4 and the W3000 Sony's will, or at least the manual says they will.
If you're going to be hooking up to a computer and you want 1080p just make sure that the LCD will accept the signal.
Just another thing to consider!
I've been downloading manuals and looking to see what HDMI signals they will accept. The Aquos won't do it. The Sony XBR4 and the W3000 Sony's will, or at least the manual says they will.
If you're going to be hooking up to a computer and you want 1080p just make sure that the LCD will accept the signal.
Just another thing to consider!
Right now I have 5 things hooked up to the TV (not counting my audio reciever).
Wii via Component (480p)
Xbox 360 Via Component (1080p)
Comcast Cable HDDVR via HDMI (1080i)
Upscaling HDMI DVD Player via HDMI (1080i)
Media Center PC via Dvi->HDMI cable (1920x1080p60)
Got an X2600XT. Works via HDMI with audio passing using their adapter, or just video with a DVI->HDMI cable which I am using now because I had a free monster DVI->HDMI cable laying around and opted to use 7.1 Analog to my reciever.
Honestly this was the easiest TV I have ever setup a video card to work with. I hit format on the remote and set it to unscaled and I was done,
Depends. The motion interpolation used by some 120hz sets is not suited for all content. So, when it's disabled I am not sure how 120hz sets stand up to 60hz for the normal hold and release blur that's associated with LCDs.
I can't see any blur on my 60hz set. I could probably train my eyes to notice it, but for everyday folks I think the blur issue is overrated.
You may want to test it in person if you can to see if you see blurring. I don't see any in 60fps games, but someone conditioned to notice blur might.
I strained my eyes looking for it so I asked on avs how to create it. The advice I got was to spin around fast in Ninja Gaiden Sigma and look at the trees. They did blur in that the detail was lost in them (didn't see trails or anything) as I was spinning, also the focal point stayed clear as day. So I asked how it looks on a plasma and the answer was slightly less blurry but on a CRT completely no detail at all is lost.
So I guess if that sort of thing bothers you, flat-panel technology is not the way to go.
I'm starting to become somewhat sheepish about spending upwards of 2,000. So I'm thinking about making a line at a 42" TV. At 8-10 feet max distance that's still a large set. Having said that, am I overspending on a 1080p? From what I've looked at it sorta seems that I'd need to be absurdly close to the set to notice the difference between 720 and 1080. However, since I do plan on using it for PC Gaming, would that still suggest the 1080? I'm thinking yes. Bottom line, I'd rather buy a decent name brand 42" set for the price I'd spend on an off-brand/lesser quality 46" set.
Remember the 2 biggest manufacturers of the LCD screens themselves are LG-Phillips and Samsung, so I dont know if for some reason you consider Philips and off brand but they are one of the top tiers IMO.
As I mentioned already, the Philips 47in 1080p @costco or sams is 1700 bucks, 3 HDMI inputs and quite nice.
The top 4 IMO are Sony, Sharp, Samsung and Phillips, and you should be able to find a sharp 46/47in 1080p in your range. Sony and Samsung just tend to be a bit more on the expensive side, with Sony being the most overblown for the least gain.
I was looking at a 46" Aquos for a bit, but I've heard that it won't accept 1920x1080 in? (See Hulk's post earlier in this thread) I've also heard the black levels are eh, at best. My 'rents both have Sam's memberships while I don't, but they're coming to visit this weekend so I think I'll take a trip out and see what's in stock. The Phillips 47PFL7422D does seem like a good deal at 1700 shipped. (not available locally) The 47" Westinghouse in the hot deals forum for just under 1300 is pretty tempting too, however, I feel that I might be sacrificing too much PQ (black levels especially based on the reviews) for cost; but man, that thing's inexpensive.
CrystalBay
Platinum Member
I dunno , I just bought an 52XBR4 and I'm thinking the 52w3000 may have suited my needs . The w3000 have the same three HDMI in/out's ....-$500 compared to the XBR4.
However the XBR4 is superlative , I have no buyers remorse on this set...
When It all boils down, the nex gen retail prices are close to the same,Samsungs,Sony's, Sharp's and Toshibas . Go for the deal that gets you a free BD/HD player ,there are some incentives out there ...
This seasons models are much improved along all brands.
However the XBR4 is superlative , I have no buyers remorse on this set...
When It all boils down, the nex gen retail prices are close to the same,Samsungs,Sony's, Sharp's and Toshibas . Go for the deal that gets you a free BD/HD player ,there are some incentives out there ...
This seasons models are much improved along all brands.
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