Rebuilding PC Gaming rig (old E8500 C2D)

Vampirrella

Golden Member
Apr 5, 2001
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Hey folks!

I want to rebuild my old gaming rig (see sig below) which I put together back in '09 or late '08 i forget. It's starting to show its age horribly and I think it's time to finally bite the bullet.

The budget I am working with is pretty strict at the moment, what with x-mas right around the corner. Looking at a max of say $550 (or cheaper) The plan is to just replace the big three: "CPU / Mobo / ram" and try to reuse all the other components I have already in the current old build for now.

Another thing I'd like to do is dabble in streaming on Twitch.tv, and play my games as well. No clue what requirements I need for streaming other then a decent upload speed which I have (10mbit up).

The CPU's I am looking at are the Haswell refreshes:
i5-4670K $239 on Newegg
i7-4770K $339 on Newegg

Other then missing hyper-threading on the i5, am I missing anything important for streaming if I go the cheaper rout of the i5? Should I not skimp out and go i7 for more longevity of the cpu/mobo/ram combo?

As far as motherboards go, all I know is I need a 1150 socket, but I really do not need anything fancy as I probably won't be OCing, unless it's effortless. I'd rather have stability during streaming/gaming and less to worry about temps and potential lock-ups during the streams.

Should I be looking at any mobo with Z87 only? No idea what is a good mobo to get right now, I really don't need all the features.

Regarding memory, I'd like to have at least 2x4gb to start. But I worry that once I want more of the same ram, they discontinue that particular model and then I cannot add more later. Should I just spend 140-160 on 16GB ram and be done with it?

I have a vidcard still, the gtx 670ftw edition so I think im ok there.

This about sums it up. My budget is $550 or less. What do you all think I should do? I don't see the point in waiting till after black friday, I need the rebuild now and if im going to wait till dec, then i might as well wait till next year and the next lol

im ready to pull the trigger!
 

lehtv

Elite Member
Dec 8, 2010
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For streaming the most important thing is fast upload speed.

An i7 should help with streaming, especially high resolutions. Higher bitrate -> more work for the processor -> more likely to become a bottleneck for framerates. It doesn't really matter whether the streaming software is heavily multithreaded or not... you can always assign it to different cores from the processing of the game you're streaming.

I would recommend a Xeon E3-1230V3 for $254. It's locked and lacks an IGP but performance is within 5% of an i7-4770K. Combine with a decent H87 board like Asrock H87 Performance $95 (ALC1150 sound, Intel LAN). This leaves plenty in the budget for a 2x8 kit: Crucial 2x8GB DDR3-1600 $120. Total $469

Do you have an SSD yet? If not, you should think about getting one. You can fit a 120GB one in that budget if you buy a cheaper board.
 
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Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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Thx for the reply.

Ive honestly never even considered the Xeon cpu? But from the specs im reading about it and what you have informed me of, this sounds really good actually. And the cost is perfect for my budget.

Regarding the memory you mentioned... that the ram is ddr3 1333 and not 1600? Does it matter at all? Again im just wanting to play my games well and stream on twitch.

thx again for the input. I will deff consider the xeon for sure
 

mfenn

Elite Member
Jan 17, 2010
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Agree with Lehtv. The E3 Xeons are a perfect fit for people whose applications can benefit from HyperThreading but don't need overclocking capability.
 

Vampirrella

Golden Member
Apr 5, 2001
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Thx for all the info, i really am leaning towards getting the E3 xeon now. It seems just right for what i need.

Lehtv, you mentioned an SSD drive. I have not yet gotten one or used one in my system. Right now i just have a 1TB WD Black mechanical drive. How would i incorporate an SSD drive with the current WD drive i already have?

Would i use the SSD for the OS (win7) or use it as my gaming drive? Currently my WD drive has 3 partitions on it and i put all the games on drive G:\. I guess i never gave SSD a thought cos it cost way more and you only get 1/10th of the space in comparison to a 1 or 2TB mechanical drive? Are SSD that much better?

thx for all your responses in advance guys, its been very helpful
 

mfenn

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Jan 17, 2010
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www.mfenn.com
Are SSD that much better?

YES. Absolutely, emphatically yes!

To put it in perspective, a new CPU might be about twice as fast as what you had in '09. A new GPU might be 4 times faster. An SSD is around 10 times faster than your WD Black.

What people typically do with SSDs is install the OS and their most frequently used applications on it. Having applications on an SSD makes every window open instantly rather than the couple of seconds wait you typically have on an HDD. Once you get used to an SSD, it is honestly pretty painful to go back to an HDD system. There is just that big a difference.

Installing games the SSD can also help loading times for some games, but it's not as big of a benefit as the OS and normal Windows applications.
 

Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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This sounds great. I will definitely add an SSD into the budget then. I'm thinking I can add it as my OS drive and maybe then install a few of the most demanding games I play on it as well to help speed things up.

One concern I have about the limited space of the SSD drive tho, as I am still using Win7 64bit, over time the Winsxs folder gets so huge and blown up, that it starts eating into all the valuable SSD space. How does anyone combat that?

I recently did a fresh reinstall (about 2 months ago) due to the fact that my OS partition of 50GB was literally taken over by the winsxs folder which blew up to about 30gb while the win7 install was still barely under 20gb. I ended up with 2gb free for months and was just limping along, then finally after months of dealing with it and procrastination I said eff this, and did the reinstall. Just wondering how you all deal with it?

Thx again you guys for the great recommends, I am going to start ordering the parts from Newegg next week.
 

Joeydubbs

Senior member
Jun 11, 2008
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Your rig is very similar to mine and I am also starting to hit the wall. Do you have an oem or retail version of windows? If oem, you may need another copy (you should get windows 8.1 anyway :) )

Any concern about reusing your PSU or case? I'm was thinking about reusing mine but not sure if I'd want to trust a 6 year old power supply with my new gear...

Do XEON's have any compatibility issues with parts or software?
 

Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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The PSU im using is an Enermax 600W, I dont remember the model nr tho. This is something ive been a tad worried about myself. The PSU has been humming along nicely for years now, and I figured i would just keep using it till it dies. 600W should be enough right?

If I am forced to get a PSU, then I cannot get the SSD as it will cut too much into my budget for this rig. But obviously a PSU will come before an SSD which I currently see as a luxury item.

Anyone else have thoughts on this?
 

lehtv

Elite Member
Dec 8, 2010
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A 600W Enermax should be fine even if it's a few years old. Enermax has several 600W units though which differ greatly in quality and actual power, can you post the model number?
 
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Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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Also, to recoup some of the costs for the upgrades, I was thinking about selling the current setup cpu /mobo /ram (see sig again) on local craigslist. Anyone know what I should post as a decent price for the three components together? It's all in great working order and Im currently on the machine typing this as we speak. Might be a good way to beable to demo it to someone as its all in working condition still and not taken apart yet?
 
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lehtv

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Dec 8, 2010
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Yeah that unit needs upgrading. It may have been good when it was released eight years ago but today, it's simply crap. <80% efficiency, are you kidding me?
 

Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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ok, recommend me a good affordable PSU then. I just need to power up the basics, not running sli or anything big
 

lehtv

Elite Member
Dec 8, 2010
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Well I'm tempted to recommend this new arrival: Antec TP-650C Classic $80 AP ($60 AR)
Seasonic-built, Gold-efficient, and more powerful than you really need but IMO hard to pass if you can afford it. I believe they've got some introductory promo going on, in week it'll probably be up to about $90-100 and no rebate like all other 650W gold units

If you can't afford it... Corsair CX600 $58 AP ($38 AR) or Rosewill Hive 550W $53 AP
 
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Vampirrella

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Apr 5, 2001
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I guess I dont understand how wattages work. I mean i have a 600w psu but this 650w psu is better? I take it that a 600w psu from 7 yrs ago isnt the same as one from today?

The price seems fine, anything under80 bucks is great. I just wont be able to get the SSD then, but that can wait till later.

BTW, do you think then current setup isnt running as optimally as it could with the current PSU? It seems to run fine. How would I tell if im underpowered?
 
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lehtv

Elite Member
Dec 8, 2010
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I guess I dont understand how wattages work. I mean i have a 600w psu but this 650w psu is better? I take it that a 600w psu from 7 yrs ago isnt the same as one from today?

Well you can't just compare wattage labels. It's like comparing processor performance based only on clock speed, and forgetting about factors like CPU architecture and core count.

But it's true that any PSU from 7 years ago is far from an equivalent tier unit today. Manufacturers have become better at making PSUs, and big PSU brands have become more inclined to use high quality manufacturers for their units, especially when marketing for the higher tier PC gaming crowd.

Older units were built for systems which didn't rely so heavily on +12V for power, so their +12V rail ratings were much lower than the labeled wattage. Today, systems barely even use other voltages. The Enermax 600W unit you have only provides about 400W on the +12V, while the 650W Antec provides almost all of its labeled wattage on the +12V.

Older units were also much less efficient; the SPCR article linked earlier mentioned that "any power supply that can achieve efficiency above 80% is worthy of special mention", which would sound ridiculous in today's context. It's not even unusual to be well over 90% efficient.

So in the context of current hardware, your unit is a 450W unit with terrible efficiency, even if it may have been an awesome 600W unit way back when.

BTW, do you think then current setup isnt running as optimally as it could with the current PSU? It seems to run fine. How would I tell if im underpowered?

I don't think your PSU is necessarily causing problems with your current setup. But it may do so before long, given its age. Also, it doesn't make sense to use such a low efficiency, old unit for a new expensive setup. It's mostly a safety precaution, but the 15% difference in efficiency will also have a small impact on your electricity bill... the magnitude of that depends on how much you use your PC and how much your electricity costs per kW.
 
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mfenn

Elite Member
Jan 17, 2010
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This sounds great. I will definitely add an SSD into the budget then. I'm thinking I can add it as my OS drive and maybe then install a few of the most demanding games I play on it as well to help speed things up.

One concern I have about the limited space of the SSD drive tho, as I am still using Win7 64bit, over time the Winsxs folder gets so huge and blown up, that it starts eating into all the valuable SSD space. How does anyone combat that?

I recently did a fresh reinstall (about 2 months ago) due to the fact that my OS partition of 50GB was literally taken over by the winsxs folder which blew up to about 30gb while the win7 install was still barely under 20gb. I ended up with 2gb free for months and was just limping along, then finally after months of dealing with it and procrastination I said eff this, and did the reinstall. Just wondering how you all deal with it?

Thx again you guys for the great recommends, I am going to start ordering the parts from Newegg next week.

Well, if you've been living with a 50GB OS partition, you have been dealing with a much tougher task than managing a 120GB SSD for a while. The SSD should be like a breath of fresh air to you. Needless to say, I do not recommend partitioning up an SSD.

As for the winsxs directory, I don't worry about it and let Windows manage it on its own. I find that it balloons up to about 10 GB and then grows extremely slowly from there. I am sitting on a Windows install that is as nearly as old as Windows 7 itself (install date 01/27/2010) and my winsxs directory is 12.8 GB.