Question Raptor Lake - Official Thread

[Hulk]

Since we already have the first Raptor Lake leak I'm thinking it should have it's own thread.
What do we know so far?
From Anandtech's Intel Process Roadmap articles from July:

Built on Intel 7 with upgraded FinFET
10-15% PPW (performance-per-watt)
Last non-tiled consumer CPU as Meteor Lake will be tiled

I'm guessing this will be a minor update to ADL with just a few microarchitecture changes to the cores. The larger change will be the new process refinement allowing 8+16 at the top of the stack.

Will it work with current z690 motherboards? If yes then that could be a major selling point for people to move to ADL rather than wait.

 

[nicalandia]

Of course it is.

DDR6400 RAM says It's NOT stock.!

 

[tamz_msc]

DDR6400 RAM says It's NOT stock.!

So what? The CPU is running at default frequencies as per Raichu.

 

[nicalandia]

So what? The CPU is running at default frequencies as per Raichu.

Let's make a few things clear here.

1. It's a Non-Release Sample of Raptor Lake(ES/QS)
2. It's using High Speed DDR5 RAM
3. Let see what it does on Release date with default JEDEC profile RAM to call it a world record on INT Performance


But seen how the non-K 13900 QS samples have performed INT wise, I can see stock 13900K getting very close or matching the 2,000 INT ST Score

Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd. Z690 GAMING X - Geekbench

Benchmark results for a Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd. Z690 GAMING X with an Intel Core i9-13900 processor.

browser.geekbench.com

 

[tamz_msc]

Let's make a few things clear here.

1. It's a Non-Release Sample of Raptor Lake(ES/QS)
2. It's using High Speed DDR5 RAM
3. Let see what it does on Release date with default JEDEC profile RAM to call it a world record on INT Performance


But seen how the non-K 13900 QS samples have performed INT wise, I can see stock 13900K getting very close or matching the 2,000 INT ST Score

Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd. Z690 GAMING X - Geekbench

Benchmark results for a Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd. Z690 GAMING X with an Intel Core i9-13900 processor.

browser.geekbench.com

Nobody cares about JEDEC speeds. Only OEM PCs will be running JEDEC RAM and timings. Besides officially Raptor Lake supports higher frequency memory than the competition, so it'll be faster anyway with JEDEC timings.

 

[nicalandia]

Nobody cares about JEDEC speeds. Only OEM PCs will be running JEDEC RAM and timings. Besides officially Raptor Lake supports higher frequency memory than the competition, so it'll be faster anyway with JEDEC timings.

Can't you just wait until NDA is lifted for Benchmarks?

 

[Zucker2k]

DDR6400 RAM says It's NOT stock.!

You had no such issues with AMD of all entities testing their unreleased chips at DDR5 6000 Mhz, the "sweet spot" for Zen4 by their own admission, instead of DDR5 5200 Mhz which Zen4 is going to run at at stock.

 

[Abwx]

You had no such issues with AMD of all entities testing their unreleased chips at DDR5 6000 Mhz, the "sweet spot" for Zen4 by their own admission, instead of DDR5 5200 Mhz which Zen4 is going to run at at stock.

Zen 4 used 6000 in the tests and has the IMC overclocked by 14.5%, but the tested 12900K was also granted the same frequency wich amount to 25% overclocking.

That being said competent reviewers will use stock settings for everything, including RAM of course since the IMC speed is manufacturers guaranted only on thoses conditions.

 

[lobz]

That might be the first time a CPU breaks 2000 int score at stock. Mighty impressive.

Stock 😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 with a kit which has a price tag of over $350. Can't wait for people to look at the 13400 non-K's performance in a $700 mobo and calling it stock.

But a boy's gotta say anything and everything for the brand, right? 😉

 

[tamz_msc]

Stock 😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 with a kit which has a price tag of over $350. Can't wait for people to look at the 13400 non-K's performance in a $700 mobo and calling it stock.

But a boy's gotta say anything and everything for the brand, right? 😉

I see that you have nothing to contribute except asinine comments, as usual.

 

[nicalandia]

Will PCI Gen 5 make a difference?

 

[FangBLade]

Will PCI Gen 5 make a difference?

View attachment 67198

Maybe, maybe not, with Unreal Engine 5 and DirectStorage it could make huge difference, we will see, but don't having gen5 m2 won't help them with sales.

 

[Exist50]

Will PCI Gen 5 make a difference?

View attachment 67198

In 2022, probably not too much, but it'll become a progressively bigger problem in 2023 and especially into 2024.

 

[Leeea]

Nobody cares about JEDEC speeds. Only OEM PCs will be running JEDEC RAM and timings. Besides officially Raptor Lake supports higher frequency memory than the competition, so it'll be faster anyway with JEDEC timings.

I also care.

I used to xmp everything, but I tend toward JEDEC these days for computers I am not personally using.

Xmp tends to have more issues as the years go by.

Fixed more then one by reducing the ram timings.

 

[nicalandia]

In 2022, probably not too much, but it'll become a progressively bigger problem in 2023 and especially into 2024.

Any news on SPR W7/W9 having PCI Gen 5 M2 Compatibility?

 

[Exist50]

Any news on SPR W7/W9 having PCI Gen 5 M2 Compatibility?

I can't imagine why it wouldn't. There's plenty of PCIe lanes to use. Probably will be a few Raptor Lake boards that bifurcate the main x16 lanes to feed M.2 slot(s) as well, and that should be a decent solution for now, but might get dicey with the highest end next or next-next gen GPUs.

 

[lobz]

I see that you have nothing to contribute except asinine comments, as usual.

Your argument is undeniably solid right there. So many people forget to bring up the actual topic when they answer! Not you, though. You choose not to.

 

[Carfax83]

Will PCI Gen 5 make a difference?

View attachment 67198

As someone that will likely do a full platform upgrade by the end of the year with either Zen 4 or Raptor Lake, it won't be a big factor. Pcie 4.0 is plenty fast enough for end users like me, especially the second generation Pcie 4.0 nvme drives like the Samsung 990 pro, which I will probably end up buying in the 2 TB variety.

I can see Pcie 5.0 x4 SSDs being a benefit to prosumers doing workstation like applications that involve heavy amounts of reads and writes to and from storage however.

But for gaming, which is the most system intensive application for consumers by far, it won't make much of a difference. The SSDs in the PS5 and XSX both use Pcie 4.0 so games won't be exceeding that limitation for a long time.

As for Direct Storage, by all indications it already flies on Pcie 4 drives. A Pcie 5 drive won't reduce loading much further due to diminishing returns.

 

[igor_kavinski]

Fixed more then one by reducing the ram timings.

I must have lucked out with the i5-12400+H610M I got for my friend. 16GBx2 Kingston Fury XMP Profile 2 at CL15 DDR4-3000. Zero issues experienced by me and zero issues reported by my friend so far.

 

[Just Benching]

Zen 4 used 6000 in the tests and has the IMC overclocked by 14.5%, but the tested 12900K was also granted the same frequency wich amount to 25% overclocking.

That being said competent reviewers will use stock settings for everything, including RAM of course since the IMC speed is manufacturers guaranted only on thoses conditions.

Yes but the 12900k can actually support 7000+ memory speeds, probably even 8k with the new hynix A dies.

 

[biostud]

As someone that will likely do a full platform upgrade by the end of the year with either Zen 4 or Raptor Lake, it won't be a big factor. Pcie 4.0 is plenty fast enough for end users like me, especially the second generation Pcie 4.0 nvme drives like the Samsung 990 pro, which I will probably end up buying in the 2 TB variety.

I can see Pcie 5.0 x4 SSDs being a benefit to prosumers doing workstation like applications that involve heavy amounts of reads and writes to and from storage however.

But for gaming, which is the most system intensive application for consumers by far, it won't make much of a difference. The SSDs in the PS5 and XSX both use Pcie 4.0 so games won't be exceeding that limitation for a long time.

As for Direct Storage, by all indications it already flies on Pcie 4 drives. A Pcie 5 drive won't reduce loading much further due to diminishing returns.

I completely agree.

When I bought my X99 platform in 2014 I wanted to be sure to have one with a PCI3.0 x4 nvme slot so it was future proof (many boards had PCIe 2.0 or x2 slots) 8 years later, and I never bothered to upgrade my sata SSD . So when I upgrade next time I will buy the fastest drive I can get my hands on (hoperfully a pcie5 drive), even though it is overkill, because I know I'm going to hold on to it until the computer is ready for a full upgrade. And if the AM5 platform will support three generations then I don't think I will regret getting a PCIe 5 drive, when also going zen4->"zen6".

 

[lobz]

Yes but the 12900k can actually support 7000+ memory speeds, probably even 8k with the new hynix A dies.

... but that wasn't the point of the post you're answering to, was it now? Trying to have a conversation with you in good faith is a colossal waste of prescious free time.

 

[Just Benching]

... but that wasn't the point of the post you're answering to, was it now? Trying to have a conversation with you in good faith is a colossal waste of prescious free time.

I dont know what his point was, my point is alderlake supports higher memory frequency than zen 4. Testing with jedec speeds is absolutely useless since noone actually runs their cpu like that.

And since he mentioned clocks, the 12900k supports ddr 3200. That translates to an imc freq of 1600mhz. Running ddr5 even at 6000 mhs is actually a downclock since the imc runs at 1500mhz in that case.

 

[itsmydamnation]

I dont know what his point was, my point is alderlake supports higher memory frequency than zen 4. Testing with jedec speeds is absolutely useless since noone actually runs their cpu like that.

Out of how many PC's in the world that are sold each year how many do you think run Jedec? my bet would be 98%

 

[Just Benching]

Out of how many PC's in the world that are sold each year how many do you think run Jedec? my bet would be 98%

We are talking about pcs with 12900ks and high end gpus? My guess is closer to 0.

 

[uzzi38]

I dont know what his point was, my point is alderlake supports higher memory frequency than zen 4. Testing with jedec speeds is absolutely useless since noone actually runs their cpu like that.

And since he mentioned clocks, the 12900k supports ddr 3200. That translates to an imc freq of 1600mhz. Running ddr5 even at 6000 mhs is actually a downclock since the imc runs at 1500mhz in that case.

That's actually factually incorrect.

The IMC (UCLK) on Zen 4 is capable of 3000MHz+ - it runs 1:1 with the actual memory frequency (MEMCLK). It's the FCLK that craps out past 2000MHz. We actually don't know how far Raphael's memory controller can go.

As an example, AMD's test rig for their launch day used DDR5-6000, which means:

- 2000MHz FCLK (IF frequency)

- 3000MHz UCLK (memory controller frequency)

- 3000MHz MEMCLK (memory frequency)