Radeon 9700 Owners, be careful with the stock HSF!

[SFang]

I just purchased a Radeon 9700 Pro card (original ATI brand) retail box. Everything has been sweet, every game runs, 3dmark2001se scored 15850 at default speed.

Then, I got itchy after reading some thread of OCing the card. I download the latest PowerStrip 3.30 from Entechtaiwan.com. My overclocking has been very frustrating, the card is not even stable at OCed speed of 325/325 by powerstrip. So, I set the card back to its default speed using powerstrip, and uninstalled the powerstrip software...However, after this, the card has been very unstable no matter what I do. I uninstall Catalyst 3.0 driver, ATI control panel, manually removed the card from Hardware Manager, etc. none of these helps, the 9700 pro can not pass 3dmarks2001se even once. During the benchmarking, it either hangs or reboots the windows, and WinXP complains every time during booting that Radeon 9500/9700 has been the reason of the unstability of the system.

Something wierd must have been done to the Windows registry by the Powerstrip, and corrupted my video card. Finally, before I reinstall WindowsXP, I went to Rage3D.com website, download their Rage3D Tweak program to reset my Video card to its default speed again. Thank God, this time everything go back to normal. 3dmarks2001se completed without problem.

Be careful with PowerStrip, it is the first time and also the last time I ever use this program !!

UPDATE: Finally, it turned out that it is not the Powerstrip software, but the stock HSF that not doing its job well. After getting help from friends here, I removed the stock HSF thermal pad, and replace it with AS3, everything become much smoother now. Thanks.

 

[Noid]

I use PS rather than the rage3d, cuz rage3d had so many memory resident programs to deal with.

I like PS. Cuz, you can just shut it off after bootup.
(been using it for over 7 yrs, 1st time on my Voodoo5 5500... or was it my STB128 lol??? )

I've used it on everycard I've had.

No problems installing or uninstalling either.

 

[Jayczar]

I have seen the same thing but maybe it is just
with the cat 3.0's and DX9. Not really sure?

 

[SFang]

Noid,
I read several of your posts in this forum, knowing you had some good OCing with the Radeon 9700Pro. Currently, I have some problem with my card, with either PS or Rage3dTweak, I can not OC my card to any thing higher than stock. When OCed, it looks fine with Windows, but just won't pass 3dMarks2001se. I use DX9 + Cat3.0. What drivers are you using? Have you experienced similar problems? Thanks.

 

[Killrose]

Originally posted by: SFang
Noid,
I read several of your posts in this forum, knowing you had some good OCing with the Radeon 9700Pro. Currently, I have some problem with my card, with either PS or Rage3dTweak, I can not OC my card to any thing higher than stock. When OCed, it looks fine with Windows, but just won't pass 3dMarks2001se. I use DX9 + Cat3.0. What drivers are you using? Have you experienced similar problems? Thanks.

You might have a problem whereas the square shim is not allowing the h/s fan to make good contact with the GPU. I've heard of this happening and the cards become un-stable. It's a known fact that with thermal grease the shim will keep the h/s fan elevated above the GPU because it is thinner than thermal pad material. Are you using thermal grease? But even so this could be the problem.

 

[SFang]

No, I didn't do any change to the card yet. The Radeon 9700Pro is a rev 1.4 board (I think), I never uninstall the HSF from the GPU. What do you suggest me to do to apply the thermal grease? What thermal grease should I use? I currently have Arctic Silver III, but I don't think it gonna glue the HSF to the GPU. A little bit more details or a link, please? Thanks.

 

[Noid]

Hi...

My 9700 didnt oc much at all either, until I got e guts to pop the HSF unit off the GPU.
I only did this AFTER I saw pictures in a forum somewhere.
---- edit---- added link I saw that had pictures of the shim -----------

The HSF unit pops off easier than any other card I had.
(probably because the thermal pad was not stuck on properly)

Use some needle nose plyiers to squeeze the HSF unit pins on rear of the card first.
(the pins expand out behind the card)
They should remove easily from the front after that.
Then take some cereal box cardboard and a screwdriver to get the HSF unit off.
Place the cardboard on the circiut board under the screwdriver to prevent cracking.
Then place the screwdriver under the lower right hand corner (thats where i did it) of the HSF and TWIST gently ...(NOT pry)

The HSF unit should come loose enough now to remove by hand.

Use the artic silver 3 you have ... (I did too) AFTER removing the yellow thermal pad AND the square shim.
(make sure to remove all the goo and glue from thermal pad and Shim)

I'm assuming your going to re-use the HSF ... thats ok ... if you want to make it better ... lap the HS bottom unit until shiney smooth.

I replaced my HSF with a 8 dollar blue orb that I lapped for a old card I had.
(no shim)

Then I put Alpha fins on my DDR chips on front and rear. (using AS thermal adheasive) <--- not the same as AS3

MY overclock was greatly improved after.


There are lots of guides to prepare a VC for oc'ing. ... I cant remember the one I read, but, I used Google and searched on '9700 overclocking' I think.
-------------- EDIT --------------

9700 EXTREME oc ... lol
------------------------------------

AS for the DX9 drivers ... yuk .... as some say ... wait for the .1 (ie. DX9.1)

Im using 6218 (after benchmarking with DX9 and Cat 3.0 ... my scores dropped by almost 1000 on 3dM)

My instincts say those drivers were working my card to hard. (not optimally programmed or something)

 

[Killrose]

The problem with just using ASIII or other "grease" is it is too thin to make up for the clearance that may exsisit because the square shim is actually taller than the GPU. The thicker pad/ TIM material will normally handle this descrepency, but there have been many cases where even it can't make up.

About all you can do is remove the h/s fan and confirm that there was poor contact via the imprint left on the TIM material. Your h/s fan might be warped slightly causing it to not make good contact. Hard to say.
Some have said the shim is hard to remove, some say it was fairly easy to remove. Becareful.

 

[Noid]

oppps ... your right ... the shim was stubborn to get off ... but it wasnt that hard.

I used a knife on one corner, just slide it under until its snug (cuz it wont go farther)

Then

use a thin screwdriver or another knife to slide under the space created by the 1st knife.

gently twist ... it should pop the edge that your working on... then just move the knifes/screwdrivers to another corner.

Removing the glue from the GPU the shim had may not be nessesary
(just as long as its not interferring with replaceing the HSF)
(loose glue fragments)

 

[SFang]

Great! Thanks for the help. I will do it sometime this weekend. If everything run smooth afterwards, I will give the credit back to PowerStrip.

 

[Noid]

Kewl .. take your time ... make sure you have everything you need before you start...
(nothing like running out of sandpaper ... or thermal adhesive)

 

[SFang]

I guess you guys are right. I am pretty sure now it is the heat that make the Radeon 9700Pro unstable at the beginning.

Here is my story:

1. I removed the hsf as instructed. I didn't take off the shim since I am a little bit lazy and short of guts. Removed all the yellow thermal pad from the hsf bottom, cleared the surface and GPU surface using isopropyl alcohol. Applied the AS3 to the GPU surface. Remount the HSF.

Result: The 3dmarks2001se crashed as soon as I launch it.

2. I pop off the hsf again, found the AS3 hasn't been able to touch the HSF because of the shim is too thick. I removed the shim at last, reapplied the AS3, mounted the hsf.

Result: 3dmarks2001se completed successfully at stock speed, without the help of either Powerstrip or Rage3dTweak.

In both test, I finger touched the HSF, and found the HSF's temperature is much higher after I removed the shim, meaning better contact with the GPU. Also, I noticed that after 3dmark2001se running, the HSF and memory on the Video card become very hot. During normal operations, they are just lukewarm. So, I guess, if I can manage to cool down the GPU and Mem more efficiently, the Video card has a great potential of OCing. I hasn't lap the HSF since I run out of sandpaper. Will do some actual Ocing after I done that.

I changed my title and give the credit back to Powerstrip. Sorry for my ignorance at the beginning.

Do you guys know where I can get a good Video card Memory heatspreader? Thanks a lot.

 

[Noid]

Your VERY lucky you didnt fry your card...

You should have checked for the surface contact b4 you re-installed it into the computer!

(u missed Killroys post?)

Do a search for Alpha memory chipset coolers.

I bought 5 of 44mm x 44mm I think for 5 bucks a piece ... then u can cut them up with copping saw.
... then use a file on the edges.
(save ya some money)

I used one 44x44 for 8 sinks with a little leftover...

Or u can pay 20-25 bucks for 4 fancy copper ones...
(u need 8)

Do a google search.... buy by the block ... u can cut them up...

or u can buy them already cut up ...

Oh ... and u need thermal adhesive!
(dont forget to lapp them too !!!)

 

[SFang]

Thanks, Killrose and Noid.

How can I register PowerStrip if I decide to purchase the official version? I didn't see any register option in the PowerStrip menus.

 

[Noid]

ummm dunno offhand ... Im not using it at the moment : )

but... you can always go to the website ; )

Did you see my scores in the UT2003 FPS thread in here ?

Truely amazin .. heh

wait I'll get it for ya ...

FPS

 

[SFang]

Noid, something is wrong in your UT2003 FPS, check that thread again.