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R5XX info by Beyond 3D

M

McArra

Diamond Member
Following the release of the Mercury Market share figures, ATI held an Analyst conference last week in which numerous point of ATI's business were discussed. Reports indicate that following the meeting Goldman Sachs have come back with numerous impressions of ATI's R5xx series, some of which are inline with elements that we've discussed before.

The reports state that ATI have confirmed they are due to launch their new architecture, the basis of the R5xx series, in the first half of 2005. Goldman also believes the architecture to be based on Shader 3.0 and be very focused on the memory interface and bus. The expectation is that GDDR4 memory technology will ramp in production in late 2005 and the memory interface will be compatible with it and be designed to scale to speeds of 1.2GHz (2.4GHz effective) over its lifetime.

Goldman also state that checks indicate that ATI have already taped out the products on TSMC's 90nm node. This goes against ATI's previous public statements that they were loath to transition to a new architecture at the same time as moving to a new process, especially as there appear to be no other products yet produced at 90nm from ATI - reports suggest that the high end product refreshes for R480 and R430 will utilise 130nm low-k and 110nm respectively. However, this is inline with ATI's CEO, Dave Orton's comments that they weren't sure how producible their Shader 3.0 architecture would be on 130nm and that they were looking to 90nm for it.

Interestingly Goldman also suggests that the first part may have a "relatively smaller die size" - presumably this is in comparison to R420. Moving from 130nm to 90nm can reduce die size by about 50% for a similar architecture, however ATI have previously suggested that the move from FP24 to FP32, as dictated for by Shader Model 3.0 for full precision in the Fragment Pipeline, would result in a 25% increase in transistors alone for the fragment shader ALU?s. Seeing as the fragment shaders are part of the largest element of the die, and the extra features for SM3.0, such as vertex texturing, will require many more transistors, it will be interesting to see what the performance composition will be like when it is ultimately announced. Should 90nm yields be favourable, though, a smaller die size could result in greater availability - an issue that has evidently plagued all high end parts based on 130nm in the current cycle.
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Did they promise to ship boards in volume within a year of the release date? :roll:

This whole paper launch thing is ridiculous. A person should be able to buy his card of choice at MSRP or less within a month of launch, the way it used to be.

The V5/5800U/6800U/X800XT have all set depressing precedents for teaching us the meaning of the old adage "When bananas grow late, apes grow angry." and "price gouging".

Computer parts shouldn't be marketed like black market cocaine.
 
Hell, even the more mainstream X800 Pro is hard to find in stock all these months later. Best Buy? Nope. NewEgg? Nope. ATI? Nope. wtf?
 
Guess the Inq was right after all. 😛

PL of r520 1st H '05.

Should be some xt-PEs available by then (for CHEAP). 😉

A "SLI'd" r520 setup should be pretty nice (if ATI can get the drivers right - this time)
:roll:
 
Originally posted by: Megatomic
Hell, even the more mainstream X800 Pro is hard to find in stock all these months later. Best Buy? Nope. NewEgg? Nope. ATI? Nope. wtf?
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I wonder when the paper launch will actually begin to have a real negative impact on their business. How many people are going to forgo even trying to find one of the rare X800 XT-PE's or bother picking up a relatively easy to find X800 Pro with the promise of R5xx around the corner? They are creating their own "wait-and-see" phenomenon by not allowing their current products to actually come to market before they begin talking about the future chips.

 
Originally posted by: nitromullet
Originally posted by: Megatomic
Hell, even the more mainstream X800 Pro is hard to find in stock all these months later. Best Buy? Nope. NewEgg? Nope. ATI? Nope. wtf?
Click to expand...
I wonder when the paper launch will actually begin to have a real negative impact on their business. How many people are going to forgo even trying to find one of the rare X800 XT-PE's or bother picking up a relatively easy to find X800 Pro with the promise of R5xx around the corner? They are creating their own "wait-and-see" phenomenon by not allowing their current products to actually come to market before they begin talking about the future chips.
Click to expand...

i think ati tried to launch r420 on the "cheap" . . . . it's an interim solution . . . . i think they were blindsided by nv40 . . . . 😉

i certainly am skipping THIS generation of videocards (maybe until they are cheap) . . . . but who really wants to upgrade NOW (unless you have to - i.e. GF4/Radeon 8500) - especially with SLI around the corner, anyway?
 
Originally posted by: nitromullet
Originally posted by: Megatomic
Hell, even the more mainstream X800 Pro is hard to find in stock all these months later. Best Buy? Nope. NewEgg? Nope. ATI? Nope. wtf?
Click to expand...
I wonder when the paper launch will actually begin to have a real negative impact on their business. How many people are going to forgo even trying to find one of the rare X800 XT-PE's or bother picking up a relatively easy to find X800 Pro with the promise of R5xx around the corner? They are creating their own "wait-and-see" phenomenon by not allowing their current products to actually come to market before they begin talking about the future chips.
Click to expand...

I agree that it's a bit hasty to be talking about next gen parts already, since they won't be out for another 6 months (on paper) and god knows when in actual volume.

Originally posted by: apoppin
i certainly am skipping THIS generation of videocards (maybe until they are cheap) . . . . but who really wants to upgrade NOW (unless you have to - i.e. GF4/Radeon 8500) - especially with SLI around the corner, anyway?
Click to expand...

I waited a bit but my 9800 Pro just wasn't cutting it for me. I upgraded to an X800 Pro (was gunning for a 6800GT but alas, ATI cards are available for a bit cheaper here in Canada), and the difference blows me away. I can run every game at my LCD's native resolution at great framerates; the 9800 Pro was a much better 1024 card than a 1280 card, while the X800 doesn't really drop off much at all.
 
Goldman also state that checks indicate that ATI have already taped out the products on TSMC's 90nm node.
Click to expand...
This is pretty promising. They've already taped out cores for cards due out in half a year. By then, GDDR3 supplies should be better, too.

I think X300 is 110nm. The smallest current GPU process is 110nm.
 
Over here in the UK we have tons of X800 Pros

We have a good stock of XTs

And in 2 weeks we will have every major brand of X800 XT-PEs in stock

And in a couple of days we will have in stock 6800 U as well.
 
Originally posted by: jiffylube1024I waited a bit but my 9800 Pro just wasn't cutting it for me. I upgraded to an X800 Pro (was gunning for a 6800GT but alas, ATI cards are available for a bit cheaper here in Canada), and the difference blows me away. I can run every game at my LCD's native resolution at great framerates; the 9800 Pro was a much better 1024 card than a 1280 card, while the X800 doesn't really drop off much at all.
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I waited a bit too (hoping my 9800 Pro would last) but last Friday I bought a 6800 OC. I returned it last night, the broken PVP thing just ticked me off after the FX fiasco last year. Now I'm hoping to get an X800 Pro from a guy in FS/FT at a killer price. I hope it goes through, I need more horsies than my 9800 Pro can give me. 🙂
 
Originally posted by: Megatomic
Originally posted by: jiffylube1024I waited a bit but my 9800 Pro just wasn't cutting it for me. I upgraded to an X800 Pro (was gunning for a 6800GT but alas, ATI cards are available for a bit cheaper here in Canada), and the difference blows me away. I can run every game at my LCD's native resolution at great framerates; the 9800 Pro was a much better 1024 card than a 1280 card, while the X800 doesn't really drop off much at all.
Click to expand...
I waited a bit too (hoping my 9800 Pro would last) but last Friday I bought a 6800 OC. I returned it last night, the broken PVP thing just ticked me off after the FX fiasco last year. Now I'm hoping to get an X800 Pro from a guy in FS/FT at a killer price. I hope it goes through, I need more horsies than my 9800 Pro can give me. 🙂
Click to expand...

I almost got a 6800nu also, but I'm very happy I got the X800Pro, which is considerably faster.

One thing which everyone forgets about the X800 Pro (non VIVO) is that it, too, is a great overclocker (especially on the memory). ATI runs 2.0ns RAM on their X800 Pro's at 900 Mhz only, and this RAM generally goes to 1050 MHz + (and if you get 1.6ns RAM on your X800 Pro, it's even better).

If you overclock it, the X800 Pro is a very solid card, and is essentially the same speed as a 6800GT (but remember, the GT will o/c to Ultra 90% of the time as well, so the X800 Pro is always going to be a bit slower than the GT).

The 6800nu is handicapped by having half of the memory and not the faster GDDR3, so it's not quite in the same league as the X800 Pro or 6800GT (except in Doom3).
 
And in 2 weeks we will have every major brand of X800 XT-PEs in stock

And in a couple of days we will have in stock 6800 U as well.
Click to expand...

LOL, that's what's been said here for months.
 
Originally posted by: Rollo
Did they promise to ship boards in volume within a year of the release date? :roll:

This whole paper launch thing is ridiculous. A person should be able to buy his card of choice at MSRP or less within a month of launch, the way it used to be.

The V5/5800U/6800U/X800XT have all set depressing precedents for teaching us the meaning of the old adage "When bananas grow late, apes grow angry." and "price gouging".

Computer parts shouldn't be marketed like black market cocaine.
Click to expand...

Yes I fully agree. With the abundant paper here in Canada I'm predicting yet another paper launch. A paper launch on top of another paper launch as one might say. 😕
 
Originally posted by: Pete
Goldman also state that checks indicate that ATI have already taped out the products on TSMC's 90nm node.
Click to expand...
This is pretty promising. They've already taped out cores for cards due out in half a year. By then, GDDR3 supplies should be better, too.

I think X300 is 110nm. The smallest current GPU process is 110nm.
Click to expand...


I hope ATi will ask AMD how to make 90nn and not intel. Imagine a prescHott gpu. Frightening 😀
(even worse imagine a prescHott gpu and a prescHott cpu, killer combo 😉 )
 
Originally posted by: SickBeast
Originally posted by: Rollo
Did they promise to ship boards in volume within a year of the release date? :roll:

This whole paper launch thing is ridiculous. A person should be able to buy his card of choice at MSRP or less within a month of launch, the way it used to be.

The V5/5800U/6800U/X800XT have all set depressing precedents for teaching us the meaning of the old adage "When bananas grow late, apes grow angry." and "price gouging".

Computer parts shouldn't be marketed like black market cocaine.
Click to expand...

Yes I fully agree. With the abundant paper here in Canada I'm predicting yet another paper launch. A paper launch on top of another paper launch as one might say. 😕
Click to expand...


I really hope they don't pull that sh!t again.

I still do not know of a single place in Canada that has X800XT PEs in stock, & in western Canada, i haven't seen the 6800Us in stock anywhere either.

And it's half a year later :|
 
R520 is already taped out so it cant be called a a paper release. Looks like ATi is going for the jugular with this chip, its supposed to be all that and a bag of chips.
 
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