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Questions that came up while watching "Top Gun" on cable today...

xboxist

Diamond Member
1) Is Top Gun a fictional flight school, or real?

2) What does the co-pilot do in those fighters? Do they have controls that they're responsible for, or do they just act as the pilot's eyes, looking for the enemy (that's all the movie seems to convey)? Both?

3) In the mission at the end of the movie, what exactly was the situation? It's almost like it was a preordained dogfight. Seems odd that both sides just seemed to meet up and battle it out. Anyone care to shed some light on this, may it be completely fake or not...?

Thanks.
 
Originally posted by: xboxist
1) Is Top Gun a fictional flight school, or real?

2) What does the co-pilot do in those fighters? Do they have controls that they're responsible for, or do they just act as the pilot's eyes, looking for the enemy (that's all the movie seems to convey)? Both?

3) In the mission at the end of the movie, what exactly was the situation? It's almost like it was a preordained dogfight. Seems odd that both sides just seemed to meet up and battle it out. Anyone care to shed some light on this, may it be completely fake or not...?

Thanks.

#1 Real
#2 Navigator
#3 Makes the movie worth watching. 😉 Sorta
 
#2 Navigator or Naval Flight Officer

Keeps the pilot out of trouble link

I wonder if they'll ever come out with a sim that will let people play together as pilot and navigator.
 
3) A ship was marooned in the Indian Ocean (I think it was the Indian) and the Russian MIG fighters were patrolling the area and keeping any American rescue efforts away. The mission that Maverick and Iceman and the rest of the crew had was to get the MIGs out of there so rescue efforts could take place.

Ask me anything about that movie...it's my favorite. 🙂
 
1) Top Gun was a real flight school. I think NAS Miramar has gone back from Top Gun to normal flight operations, since in the last 10 years or so the importance of the aerial dogfight has diminished. We pretty own the sky in any conflict now, but it's due to long-range missiles controlled from AWACS, etc. rather than actual close combat.
 
Originally posted by: DingDingDao
1) Top Gun was a real flight school. I think NAS Miramar has gone back from Top Gun to normal flight operations, since in the last 10 years or so the importance of the aerial dogfight has diminished. We pretty own the sky in any conflict now, but it's due to long-range missiles controlled from AWACS, etc. rather than actual close combat.

The Top Gun flight school is now in Fallon NV.
 
as far as i know top gun is still a real flight school... it was created becasue the f-14 ( i believe it was the phantom ) had no guns on it, only missles so the pilots had forgotten how to use methods other than heat seaking missles to fight

the navagator or naval flight officer is correct... he basically watches the sky's.. keeps track of who you are fighting and if something would happen to you as the pilot he has controls and can take over
 
Yes, it's a real school

The guy in back is in charge of the radar and targetting and navigation and stuff.

It's a movie.
 
Originally posted by: xboxist
1) Is Top Gun a fictional flight school, or real?

2) What does the co-pilot do in those fighters? Do they have controls that they're responsible for, or do they just act as the pilot's eyes, looking for the enemy (that's all the movie seems to convey)? Both?

3) In the mission at the end of the movie, what exactly was the situation? It's almost like it was a preordained dogfight. Seems odd that both sides just seemed to meet up and battle it out. Anyone care to shed some light on this, may it be completely fake or not...?

#1 As others have said, yes real.
#2 WSO (weapons systems operator). Radar, attack planning, etc
#3 Loooooosely based on the fun we had with the Libyans in the 80's (They think their territorial waters extend further than we say they do, they liked to send fighters up to challenge the fleet. Never ended well for them, I believe the total was 4:0 over the course of a year).

Bill
 
Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82
as far as i know top gun is still a real flight school... it was created becasue the f-14 ( i believe it was the phantom ) had no guns on it, only missles so the pilots had forgotten how to use methods other than heat seaking missles to fight

the navagator or naval flight officer is correct... he basically watches the sky's.. keeps track of who you are fighting and if something would happen to you as the pilot he has controls and can take over


It was the F-4 in Vietnam, not the F-14. The Tomcat does have a 30mm cannon in addition to its missles. In different planes the rear seater is called different thing. It's WSO (Weapons System Operator) pronounced "Whizzo" in the F-111 and some other Air Force jets. In the F-14's used in Top Gun the guy in the back is technically called a RIO, short for Radar-Intercept Officer. He handles the planes electronics systems, radar, navigation and acts as a second set of eyes. He also cannot "take over". RIO's are not trained pilots nor do they have flight controls. They can't fly the airplane or land it safely if something happens to the pilot. The best they can do is eject if the pilot is incapacitated.
 
Originally posted by: EMPshockwave82

the navagator or naval flight officer is correct... he basically watches the sky's.. keeps track of who you are fighting and if something would happen to you as the pilot he has controls and can take over

The backseat of the F-14 has no flight controls so if the pilot becomes unable to fly the plane the only option for the backseater is to eject. I worked as a electrician on F-14s at Miramar for 3 years and thats how I know.
 
Originally posted by: GagHalfrunt
It was the F-4 in Vietnam, not the F-14. The Tomcat does have a 30mm cannon in addition to its missles. In different planes the rear seater is called different thing. It's WSO (Weapons System Operator) pronounced "Whizzo" in the F-111 and some other Air Force jets. In the F-14's used in Top Gun the guy in the back is technically called a RIO, short for Radar-Intercept Officer. He handles the planes electronics systems, radar, navigation and acts as a second set of eyes.

But in all cases he'll be an NFO - 'Non-flight officer'. They don't give that seat to qualified pilots (too rare, by design), nor do they give it to enlisted personnel. Still, you CAN occupy that seat with '20/20 corrected vision' (IE., contacts/laser surgery/etc), which you cannot as a pilot.

I wonder if they'll ever come out with a sim that will let people play together as pilot and navigator

In F-15 Strike Eagle III (Microprose, it's quite a bit older) you can fly an F-15E Strike Eagle as pilot/weapons officer.

In Jane's Longbow 2 (Jane's Combat Simulations, not THAT old, but it's got a few years on it) two players can play as a pilot and commander/gunner (the equiv. of that role in helicopters).

In Jane's F-15, you can play either seat - but not two player. You can just jump back and forth between them.

In Gunship! (Microprose again, newer) two players can fly the Apache Longbow, Russian Mil-28 Havok, or Eurocopter Tiger as a pilot or gunner. This game has the unique distinction of having an AI pilot take over when you play as the gunner/commander. You simply tell the pilot what you want to do ('find cover', 'hover', 'move left', etc) and he does it, leaving you free to work the weapons systems.
----
Helicopters handle the second role differently than aircraft do. Flying a helicopter is really, REALLY difficult. MUCH harder than flying an airplane, by an order of magnitude! So, the one person just flies the bird. The other handles the radar, target acquisition, and firing.

In aircraft, the 'environment' is MUCH more dynamic, while flying is much easier. Essentially, if you stop working the controls on a helicopter, you immediately crash. While, in an aircraft, you can take your hands completely away from the stick with no problem at all - it keeps on flying straight were you last pointed it. So, the pilot can do more than just fly, he controls the weapons firing, as well.

As to the environment - a helicopter only has air-to-ground radar. Some come equipped with Stingers (VERY basic air-to-air weapon) for self defense, but they are mostly only interested in ground targets. Which, of course, obligingly move along only 2 dimensions!

Aircraft (like the F-14 in 'Top Gun') are equipped with substantially more air-to-air weapons, since that is their primary role (for many, not all, of them). And the air environment is MUCH more interesting - targets above, below, around you....keeps a radar VERY busy tracking all that. So, many aircraft (particularly those tasked with standoff attacks or complicated air and ground delivery missions - the F-4 Phantom, F-14 Tomcat, F-15E Strike Eagle, F-111 Aardvark, etc) have a second seat for a person to sit and handle the rader. Finding targets, prioritizing them, planning the ingress/egress from the target, etc.

If YOU are interested in seeing a small glimpse of the workload involved, try picking up a copy of 'Lock On: Modern Air Combat'. It does a pretty good job of simply modelling the controls of several modern single-seater fighters. Saying that Top Gun 'oversimplified' a LOT of aspects of air combat is....an understatement! This is a new game, and should be pretty easy to find.

For more hardcore avionics (radar, flight controls, weapons deployment), try Jane's F-15, Jane's F/A-18, or Falcon 4.0
 
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