Questions/Advice on PC build

[rashire]

Info Asked for from sticky
1. PC will be used for a combination of tasks. I am a windows software developer, but also a gamer, i also use the machine as my primary tv. I am not a heavy gamer but i am aiming at having something to comfortably run ffxiv when it's released.

2. I am keeping the cost under $2k the more i can reduce it the better, but I am confortable spending that much. (but will not go over)

3. I live in the states (I prefeer newegg for service and delivery)

4. I'm actually a AMD/ATI fanboy, but preformance is king. (Plus I hate CCC)

5. I will resuse my monitors (2x samsung syncmasters 226bw 22" 1680x1050) and my mouse

6. I haven't looked at other threads because my system is more or less complete and am looking for suggestions based on my build

7. System will run at stock speeds mostly, I may overclock later if the system becomes slow.

8. games will be played at native screen resolution (1680x1050) with potential to buy up to 4 ????x1200 screens later.

9. I plan to build in the next month or so.

Additional notes: I multi-task alot, it not uncommon for me to be using multiple office applications, visual studios, 2-3 web browsers, 2-3 chat clients, anti-virus, and playing a game (atm typically tf2) on top of that. I plan to use windows 7 x64 (already have a copy from msdn subscription). Also depending on if i can find a higher paying job I plan to eventually upgrade the system with a second gfx card and 4 higher res monitors but thats probably a year away.

Anyways the lists and links of hardware I have picked so far, as well as comments / questions below them.

Note on i7: atm i'm waiting for i5 release and full reviews to determine to stay with i7 or move to i5 so the current build is based on i7.

Case:
Antec Twelve Hundred Black Steel ATX Full Tower Computer Case - Retail $169.99
Loved the 900, this ones bigger.

MotherBoard:
EVGA E758-TR 3-Way SLI (x16/x16/x8) LGA 1366 Intel X58 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail $260
Seems to have feature set I'm looking for.

Video Card:
EVGA 896-P3-1171-AR GeForce GTX 275 Superclocked Edition 896MB 448-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported ... - Retail $260
Was only $10 over non'superclocked' version from evga, but willing to consider alternates.

PSU:
CORSAIR CMPSU-850TX 850W ATX12V 2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready Active PFC Power Supply - Retail $140
Estimated computer will draw (idle)350-600(load) watts of power. Is 850 too much buffer? Can I go lower and still be scaleable to 2 cards(not sli)?

CPU:
Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80601920 - Retail $280
High preformance, highly recommended, little pricy but falls withing fincial restraints. May consider i5 2.8 ghz version as alternate based on review.

HDD (C:\):
Intel X25-M Mainstream SSDSA2MH080G2C1 2.5" 80GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid state disk (SSD) - OEM $260 ($500 current :-( )
Descision based on newest anand article. I hate program load times. Will not buy this unless its back down to normal price. Alternate would be ocz vertex series, (or whichever supports TRIM) Is it worth it to get 2 30gb vertex's and raid 0 them or just get a 60 gb version?

Memory:
OCZ XMP Ready Series 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Voltage Desktop Memory Model OCZ3X1600LV6GK - Retail x 2 (12gb total) $280
With tripple channel I seem to only have 2 options, 6 Gb or 12 Gb, is 12gb Overkill? If I go to i5 series I will use 8gb. Also will this work with the selected motherboard?
Alternate: CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model TR3X6G1333C7 G - Retail $280
Not sure if lower cas latency is better or higher frequency is better.

HDD (D:\):
Western Digital Caviar Black WD1001FALS 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drives - OEM x2 $190
2 1TB drives in raid 1 (I tend to be hard on hdd's) Willing to consider alternatives in same price/size range but only from WD or Seagate.

Keyboard:
Logitech G15 USB Wired Standard Gaming Keyboard - Retail $90
More money then I want to spend on a keyboard but its the most appealing option I saw under $100

DVD:
SAMSUNG DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S223L LightScribe Support - OEM $30
Nothing really to note here, need a drive to stick discs in.

CPU Fan
ZALMAN CNPS 9700 NT 110mm 2 Ball Ultra Quiet CPU Cooler - Retail $55
Had nice numbers from ambient.


I have artic silver already, and I think I covered all bases. Thanks for taking the time to read, and appologies in advance for spelling/grammer.

 

[Maverick2002]

For the i7 try to get a D0 stepping.

I realize your TB drives are data, but I'd still recommend WD Black vs. Green. The power savings is nominal and the performance difference is noticeable. Personal preference really.

X25-M ... try to hold out an get a G2 when it finally hits shelves (and isn't sold out instantly). It'll support TRIM which is huge. Until other drives are competitive with this SSD I personally would have a hard time recommending anything else. By and far historically the slowest component of any computer - yet most people skimp on getting the fastest possible HDD they can afford. Boggles me.

 

[rashire]

Hmm I was under the impression the x25-m I select was the g2 with TRIM support?

And thnx for pointers on the TB drives, wasn't aware they where slower, black is only a extra $10 each, so I'll switch to that.

As for the stepping on the cpu I guess I'll just be stuck with what I get, not really too motivated to spend even more on the cpu. w/e newegg sells I'll use, but I'll definitly check what I got when it arrives.

As for disc speed I agree, originaly I had 2 velociraptors in the cart planning to raid 0 them for speed, till i read all the ssd articles here and realized 1 ssd is faster then the 2 raptors for just under the same price (although lots of lost capacity)

Thats also why I was curious how well 2 30gb ssd's in raid 0 would preform. If the preformance is increased the price is very simular to 60/80 gb ssd's so it might be worth it to do that. (Although I heard trim support for raid is even further out)

 

[Loki427]

I second the WD Black suggestion, also because of the extra 2 year warranty. For the cooler, this one has kept my 920 OC'd @ 3.8 under 58C Load
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16835233003
/w adapter for i7 http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16835233027

For the Mobo, I have used Gigabyte on the majority of my budget builds for customers and friends, and Asus on one occasion, but if you are considering Asus you should look at Asrock--their sister company-- for its "instant boot"-- booting in ~7 seconds is a plus!
Truly though, I would STRONGLY suggest you purchase an EVGA board, as this is the only board I consider for high end builds because of their LIFETIME warranty. I'm sure you're aware your graphics pick from them has this warranty also. Here's one:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/...x?Item=N82E16813188046

 

[jdjbuffalo]

The one you picked is the one with TRIM support. It is currently deactivated on NewEgg's website. I wouldn't even think about doing SSDs in RAID right now. Just go with the 80GB Intel and wait for prices to come down and TRIM support in RAID to be added (a while down the road).

I would wait for a few weeks and see what happens with the new video cards coming out. They could change the landscape.

 

[rashire]

@Loki427: you've convinced me. Dunno much about evga mobo but the names good on video cards so with a recommendation i'll change that to the motherboard. Also that heatsink is massive, and according to quick charts I googled only about 3 degrees cooler in ambient. I'll have to think that one over.

@jdjbuffalo: Ya I realize prehaps that I picked the wrong time of year to do this. Everything seems to be getting released in september. It's hard to wait though once you've decided to upgrade.

 

[rashire]

Updated list in OP with changes.

Still curious about psu size and ram amount.

With idle power around 350 and load around 600. Load should be in the efficient range but idle seems like it will be wasting some power.

And for ram, i know the more ram you have the more the OS uses and the more responsive things are, but is 12gb just too much? At $140 for 6gb i don't mind spending it to make it run better but if it wont make a difference i may as well save some cash.

 

[philosofool]

Here's my graphics recommendation: get a single Radeon 4850 right now. It will game fine at your current resolution resolution if you can live with AA (or just 2x AA, depending on the game.) Then in two months when the Radeon 5000 series hits the shelves, toss down another $200 for a card that will be better than anything at that price now and will offer DX 11 support. You can move the Radeon over to another slot for 4 monitor support when you get excited about that. I understand that patience is hard, but it is also a virtue.

 

[rashire]

As nice as the Radeons are, I just find it painful to use CCC, granted i haven't used it since my x850. Kinda stuck on nvidia options simply out of Driver quality.

Also always something new coming out, I don't want to wait this out too long. My current rig is depressingly slow. Although, DX 11 is a valid point. I've done no research on that's release date. Hardware should drop end of October for that?

 

[ScorcherDarkly]

The media announcement for ATI's DX 11 cards is supposed to be a week from today with cards hitting retail in October. Waiting a week will at least let you get more information about what's coming.

 

[rashire]

Originally posted by: ScorcherDarkly
The media announcement for ATI's DX 11 cards is supposed to be a week from today with cards hitting retail in October. Waiting a week will at least let you get more information about what's coming.

Thanks for the Heads up. I'd actually been looking around earlier today on the topic of dx11 and couldn't find any major information on it. Word was ATI/NVIDIA are both announcing things on the 10th. Rumor being the ATI cards might drop before Win 7 official release. And with the other Rumor being NVIDIA is 3+months behind on dx11 cards, if ATI comes out with em first it looks like thats the path I'm going.

Intel also has a announcment on the 9th, I never saw a description what for, but I'd be supprised if it was anything besides the i5 series.

With intel ssd's sold out and all these announcments next week I garuntee I can hold off on buying anything. I'd wait it out till december if I wouldnt throw my old computer out a window first.

Anyone know any articles with solid details on DX11?

 

[elconejito]

Just curious where you are getting the 300-600w numbers from? Not questioning them, just wondering if you calculated it or saw someone else with similar system.

Personally, I'd go for the 12GB of RAM. You seem to have lots of windows/apps open at the same time and RAM will help a lot switching between them. Also, there isn't too much difference between 1333 & 1600 RAM so you could save a few $$$ there.

I'm pretty sure the ATI 4890 is in the same ballpark as far as performance, but it can be had for maybe $50 cheaper. If you're set on EVGA then don't worry about that.

I'd shy away from the Zalman 9700. It could not keep up with the Q9650 in my sig (did just fine with a Q6600). Their older design just hasn't kept pace with the newer chips. The most effective coolers now are based on HDT (Heatpipe Direct Touch). If you are set on Zalman, have a look at the newest one which is for i7, I think the model number is 9900. Otherwise, go for the Megahalems, TRUE, the other Thermalright which the name escapes me ATM..., or Xigmatek.

And finally, if you have a Microcenter or Fry's near you check the prices there. For example, the i7 can be had for $199 at Microcenter.

 

[rashire]

Originally posted by: elconejito
Just curious where you are getting the 300-600w numbers from? Not questioning them, just wondering if you calculated it or saw someone else with similar system.

Personally, I'd go for the 12GB of RAM. You seem to have lots of windows/apps open at the same time and RAM will help a lot switching between them. Also, there isn't too much difference between 1333 & 1600 RAM so you could save a few $$$ there.

I'm pretty sure the ATI 4890 is in the same ballpark as far as performance, but it can be had for maybe $50 cheaper. If you're set on EVGA then don't worry about that.

I'd shy away from the Zalman 9700. It could not keep up with the Q9650 in my sig (did just fine with a Q6600). Their older design just hasn't kept pace with the newer chips. The most effective coolers now are based on HDT (Heatpipe Direct Touch). If you are set on Zalman, have a look at the newest one which is for i7, I think the model number is 9900. Otherwise, go for the Megahalems, TRUE, the other Thermalright which the name escapes me ATM..., or Xigmatek.

And finally, if you have a Microcenter or Fry's near you check the prices there. For example, the i7 can be had for $199 at Microcenter.

Did some rounding math on idle and load draw of cpu and gpu, adding averages for things like ram and hard discs. I'm sure I could get exact numbers but i assumed a estimation within 50 watts was ok.

The prices between 1333 and 1600 aren't too much diffrent. I think if i go to the lower clock i might pick a lower cas latency model (might) But i'll look into it if the prefomance increase isnt sigificant.

I'm still very anti ATI (despite being a fanboy of theirs) simply due to Catalyst Control Center. But since it's lining up to be AMD controlling the dx11 market with the 5xxx series, it looks like i'll be going with their sub $300 solution.

I wasn't aware their had been that much of a change in cpu cooling solutions. I suppose I'm old fashion in that area, I'll have to research the topic some more and see what makes the most sense.

Theirs a microcenter 45 minutes from me so I'll look into that as a option, but frys doesn't have a store in my state. I do have friends in cali though.

 

[elconejito]

Oh, man you are in such luck then Get your i7 from there, it's $199. And you can take a look at the CPU before you walk out of the store and make sure it's a D0. I'd certainly drive 45mins to save $80.

Yeah, I really loved that Zalman 9700. It was cool, quiet and looked good. It just can't perform though when compared next to today's coolers. Have a look at the 9900, or the others I mentioned. The 1200 case will fit darn near anything.

 

[rashire]

Originally posted by: elconejito
Oh, man you are in such luck then Get your i7 from there, it's $199. And you can take a look at the CPU before you walk out of the store and make sure it's a D0. I'd certainly drive 45mins to save $80.

Yeah, I really loved that Zalman 9700. It was cool, quiet and looked good. It just can't perform though when compared next to today's coolers. Have a look at the 9900, or the others I mentioned. The 1200 case will fit darn near anything.

Mind linking me to the price on the 920? I can't seem to find it on thier site. Would love ability to check for the stepping before buying too.

And yea, thats why I want the 1200, its huge.

Should get out of work soon, will have to do some major cooler research when i get home.

 

[rashire]

So the the press release on new lynnfield cpu's it pretty much sold me for what I was already planning.

Switching Processor to Intel Core i7 860 Lynnfield 2.8GHz LGA 1156 95W Quad-Core Processor Model BX80605I7860 - Retail $299

Changing memory to CORSAIR DOMINATOR 8GB (4 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMD8GX3M4A1600C8 - Retail $250

And for the mean time I have this motherboard selected ASUS P7P55D EVO LGA 1156 Intel P55 Intel Motherboard - Retail $190

But I'll probbly change up motherboard as soon as newegg adds the socket to search filters and i have more options.

Looks like i save a bit over $100 with this, and get higher preformance. Not too upset over moving from 12 gb to 8gb, 8gb will suit me fine. Mostly I'm just wary of a brand new motherboard now.

Also still waiting for press release from AMD/NVIDIA tommorow to finalize my gfx option and purchase date.

Oh and intel g2 ssd is still over-priced, gotta wait for that to drop.

 

[elconejito]

Sorry I missed your earlier post. Here is a link to microcenter, they have the i7 860 for $230 !!!!!

http://www.microcenter.com/sin...tml?product_id=0317378

You're going to spend a ton of time looking through all these reviews

 

[rashire]

np about that, and wow on the 860 price. Guess I'm driving up there with a newegg wish list and seeing what parts I can buy cheaper.

Thanks for the link.