let's say that you've been the nicest person in the world (ie, you help others, volunteer, etc) but you don't have a religion or believe in god, so when you die, does that mean you're going to goto hell?
question about religion: If you didn't believe in god, will you still be let into heaven?
- Thread starter TranceNation
- Start date
let's say that you've been the nicest person in the world (ie, you help others, volunteer, etc) but you don't have a religion or believe in god, so when you die, does that mean you're going to goto hell?
That depends on a persons conception on God. If your god is a ass, then yes, you go to hell. If your god is all caring, all loving, all knowing, all compasionate, then you would not go to hell, but rather heaven. Hmmm, seems that christians see there god in the favorable, all compasionate light, but it seems that if you don't accept jeasus into your heart as your lord and savior, you don't go to heaven. Yet another example of hypocrasy in organized religion.
Best bet, don't worry about it. If you are a good person and don't belive in god, then you get to "heaven" and they don't let you in, then the place is simply overated and not where peeps you want to hang with are anyways.
Best bet, don't worry about it. If you are a good person and don't belive in god, then you get to "heaven" and they don't let you in, then the place is simply overated and not where peeps you want to hang with are anyways.Originally posted by: Twerpzilla
That depends on a persons conception on God. If your god is a ass, then yes, you go to hell. If your god is all caring, all loving, all knowing, all compasionate, then you would not go to hell, but rather heaven. Hmmm, seems that christians see there god in the favorable, all compasionate light, but it seems that if you don't accept jeasus into your heart as your lord and savior, you don't go to heaven. Yet another example of hypocrasy in organized religion.
agree.
Well, here's the Christian perspective. No amount of good works will get you into heaven. It is by faith that we are saved.
As for those people who say how can a loving God send people to hell, try thinking of God as your father. He loves you no matter what, but lays down rules for you to follow, and expects you to follow those rules, just like your father does, right? If you break the rules, your father expects you to ask for forgiveness. Sometimes even if you ask for forgiveness, he still punishes you, right? Well, in the Christian perspective, if you ask for forgiveness, you will get it, and Christ takes your punishment, and did so by dying on the cross as a sacrifice for you. All this time, though, God still loves you and cares for you. By asking for forgiveness and believeing that Christ took your punishment by dying for your sins, you can spend eternity in heaven with God. If you disobey and never ask to be forgiven, you take the punishment yourself, which is Hell.
The question comes up often that what happens if you've never heard this message, you never have the choice, how do you avoid going to hell. It's my opinion that God can still let you into heaven if he chooses to. I will never conciously put a limit on God and say that he can't let you in even if you've never repented and believed.
As for those people who say how can a loving God send people to hell, try thinking of God as your father. He loves you no matter what, but lays down rules for you to follow, and expects you to follow those rules, just like your father does, right? If you break the rules, your father expects you to ask for forgiveness. Sometimes even if you ask for forgiveness, he still punishes you, right? Well, in the Christian perspective, if you ask for forgiveness, you will get it, and Christ takes your punishment, and did so by dying on the cross as a sacrifice for you. All this time, though, God still loves you and cares for you. By asking for forgiveness and believeing that Christ took your punishment by dying for your sins, you can spend eternity in heaven with God. If you disobey and never ask to be forgiven, you take the punishment yourself, which is Hell.
The question comes up often that what happens if you've never heard this message, you never have the choice, how do you avoid going to hell. It's my opinion that God can still let you into heaven if he chooses to. I will never conciously put a limit on God and say that he can't let you in even if you've never repented and believed.
Pulled out of context, it can sound like that, yeah. The point of that passage is to say that faith and works belong together, that you need to have both. Faith wthout works is dead, says verse 17, but works without faith is also dead, useless, according to Ephesians 2:8-9 - "For it is by grace you are saved, through faith, and this is not of works, so that no one can boast."(paraphrased).
The passge you quoted says that you are NOT saved by your works, but by grace and faith. Yet that other passage says that you also need works. So what is it: Faith and works, or faith and grace alone?
i think he is getting at this point "i just died, oh crap, i'm wrong and there is a god but i've been a good boy. what now?" type of thing.
It's a long standing debate that has torn churches apart, and helped create all the different denomination you see today. I can only give you my perspective from my own Biblical studies. I did in fact take that Ephesians verse out of context - the next verse, verse 10, says, "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to good works, which God has before ordained that we should walk in them." So even in the verse that clearly states that faith is all we need, the context says we are created to do good works, thus implying that we can't just have faith without works. It's like good works become a part of our faith, as we're saved through God's grace.
blah blah blah
bollox bollox bollox
oprah oprah montel..
da good ol' US of A
little house on the prairie..
the Waltons..
bollox bollox bollox
blah blah blah
bible was inspired by god
of course it was
cos people like you say so
isn't death scary..
oh please let there be a god
please oprah, let there be a god.
if there is no god, who will punish Bin Laden?
Kadarin
Lifer
- Nov 23, 2001
- 44,296
- 16
- 81
If you don't have a religion or believe in God, why do you assume there's a heaven and hell to go to after you die?
Born-again Christian types, when we debate the subject, like to ask me things like "but what do you think will happen to you after you die? If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your savior, you won't go to heaven.." My answer is that what happens to me after I die isn't really all that important. I'm basically a good person, and if there is a God standing judgement over me who will deny me entry into heaven based on that criteria, then I want nothing to do with that God.
If you don't believe in God, then how could you believe in the Christian definitions of heaven and hell?
See BigJohnKC's responses for decent analysis of how you need to have faith and be a "good person." Not just one or the other.
If you would prefer a more secular analogy:
Let's say you're throwing a huge party and invite everyone to join you.
But when you ask this one guy if he's going to come, he says "I don't know you, I've never seen you, I don't even believe you exist!"
The night of the party comes, and this dude shows up at your door.
Would you let him in after what he said to you?
See BigJohnKC's responses for decent analysis of how you need to have faith and be a "good person." Not just one or the other.
If you would prefer a more secular analogy:
Let's say you're throwing a huge party and invite everyone to join you.
But when you ask this one guy if he's going to come, he says "I don't know you, I've never seen you, I don't even believe you exist!"
The night of the party comes, and this dude shows up at your door.
Would you let him in after what he said to you?
Demon-Xanth
Lifer
- Feb 15, 2000
- 20,551
- 2
- 81
Hypothetical situation:
A person is born and abandoned in an otherwise inhabited place on the earth. Noone is there to tell him there is a god. Is he doomed to hell? According to the ten commandments, yep. He didn't take heed of the sabbath day. He might have even had "false gods".
I have a hard time believing any religion that basically states "you must kiss his ass", especially "and he wants you to do it in this way". A person is made up of thier actions, not thier beliefs. If I believe in god and go around as a conman that shouldn't give me a ticket to the good afterlife.
A person is born and abandoned in an otherwise inhabited place on the earth. Noone is there to tell him there is a god. Is he doomed to hell? According to the ten commandments, yep. He didn't take heed of the sabbath day. He might have even had "false gods".
I have a hard time believing any religion that basically states "you must kiss his ass", especially "and he wants you to do it in this way". A person is made up of thier actions, not thier beliefs. If I believe in god and go around as a conman that shouldn't give me a ticket to the good afterlife.
I don't know and I don't care. I doubt that anybody will know for sure until they die.
I care about what I do while I am alive, and there are just too much to do for my current life for me to worry about my afterlife.
I'll deal with it then, I guess. I wonder if I can do good deeds and get "promoted" up to heaven even if I fall into hell.
I care about what I do while I am alive, and there are just too much to do for my current life for me to worry about my afterlife.
I'll deal with it then, I guess. I wonder if I can do good deeds and get "promoted" up to heaven even if I fall into hell.
This hypothetical situation is posed to a lot of Christians, usually along with the same type of statements you posted immediately after it. A lot of Christians will say you're right, that person will go to hell, and according to the rules laid out for us in the Bible, it's true. But that doesn't mean God can't allow that person into heaven. It annoys me when Christians put limits on what God can and can't do. I would say that if it is God's will that the person in question is to be in heaven, he can allow it.
I have faith that the Bible tells us what will happen, but you're right, we won't ever really know until we die. As for worrying about the afterlife, I don't worry about that either, I know where I'm going. And according to God's word, that kind of promotion will never happen, sorry.
I always get a kick out of these religious threads. There is always someone piping in to tell us what the bible says, and what it means. I have never cease to get a kick out how seriously people take a book that is written by a bunch of unknown authers with unknown intent. Of course, the response is to quote from said tome in defense of itself. Kind of self defeating, isnt it?
If the topic was to defend the Bible, it would be pointless to use it to defend itself. That's like defining a cow by saying it's very cow-like. That's not at all what I'm doing. The discussion topic here is destination of humans in the afterlife based on decisions and beliefs here in the present, and I was presenting the Christian perspective, which happens to be based on the Bible. We believe it is inspired by God, that's why we put a lot fo merit into it. It's not a self-defeating argument because the basis is the belief that the Bible is wholly true, which is a standard for arguing from a Christian perspective.
From another point of view, in Islam, you probably won't be let it. Unless if you die as a child, you're guaranteed entrance regardless of your original religion...
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