Question about founding fathers

PainTrain

Member
Jun 22, 2003
170
2
0
Could the founding fathers have ever realized how powerful of a nation the US would become when they designed our governmen? It seems like for such an enourmously complex govement the element of democracy most throw a heck of a kink in the systemetizing of itself. Meaning, everyone has a different idea of the role this country should play globally, how much taxes we should pay as citzens, who's entitled to what, and what the composure of our military should be, it's really kind of psychotic in it's dynamic nature since we're voting in and out new agenda's two years. And yet, it works :)
 

heartsurgeon

Diamond Member
Aug 18, 2001
4,260
0
0
the beauty of the consitution is that is institutionalizes chaos!

the dynamic tension between the three branches of goverment, the right to bear arms of the citizenry, this was all designed to keep
any one or two elements of the goverment from dominating everyone.

it was designed to make it purposefully difficult for the goverment to do things.

on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.

politics is like sex, its messy, but its fun!
 

tweakmm

Lifer
May 28, 2001
18,436
4
0
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.
Except in this day and age, all but the extremes of either side have morphed into one special interest group $$$ loving monster.
 

XZeroII

Lifer
Jun 30, 2001
12,572
0
0
Originally posted by: tweakmm
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.
Except in this day and age, all but the extremes of either side have morphed into one special interest group $$$ loving monster.

 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,894
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
the beauty of the consitution is that is institutionalizes chaos!

the dynamic tension between the three branches of goverment, the right to bear arms of the citizenry, this was all designed to keep
any one or two elements of the goverment from dominating everyone.

it was designed to make it purposefully difficult for the goverment to do things.

on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.

politics is like sex, its messy, but its fun!

Originally posted by: tweakmm
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.
Except in this day and age, all but the extremes of either side have morphed into one special interest group $$$ loving monster.

Exactly Tweak, it's only fun if you are one of the Rich Puppeteers.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
Originally posted by: hagbard
Yes, they were all pedeophiles...oh...different question :D
The Subject is Founding Fathers not your Dad, the Fondling Father!
 

hagbard

Banned
Nov 30, 2000
2,775
0
0
Run a Google search on "founding fathers pornography", consider it your history lesson for the day.
 

zephyrprime

Diamond Member
Feb 18, 2001
7,512
2
81
I think that maybe they did have an inkling of how powerful the US could be. I believe (but don't quite recall precisely) George Washington himself talked about the possibility of the US becoming an empire if it didn't fall apart in the first 20 years of the union and avoided foreign entanglements for a century or so.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,530
3
0
Originally posted by: hagbard
Run a Google search on "founding fathers pornography", consider it your history lesson for the day.
I did and nothing came up. But when I ran a search for "Hagbard" I got this :
Hagbard
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
It questionable how democratic we are/ Less than 50% vote in major elections like presidential and far less in regional races and a miniscule percentage in city elections.


IMO the founders are rolling thier grave because the three essential ingredients for any healthy democratic republic are disappearing. And the laviathan is out of control.

1. government that respects the liberty and freedom of its citizenry.
2. government that speaks honestly to its citizenry so that it may make informed and reasonable decisions.
3. a government that abides by the rule of law.

"(we have) A republic, if you can keep it."- Ben Franklin



Haha Red:)
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: Zebo
It questionable how democratic we are/ Less than 50% vote in major elections like presidential and far less in regional races and a miniscule percentage in city elections.


IMO the founders are rolling thier grave because the three essential ingredients for any healthy democratic republic are disappearing. And the laviathan is out of control.

1. government that respects the liberty and freedom of its citizenry.
2. government that speaks honestly to its citizenry so that it may make informed and reasonable decisions.
3. a government that abides by the rule of law.

"(we have) A republic, if you can keep it."- Ben Franklin



Haha Red:)

all good points.
 

Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
Originally posted by: heartsurgeon
the beauty of the consitution is that is institutionalizes chaos!

the dynamic tension between the three branches of goverment, the right to bear arms of the citizenry, this was all designed to keep
any one or two elements of the goverment from dominating everyone.

it was designed to make it purposefully difficult for the goverment to do things.

on a more macro level, it is actually good that the republican and democrat parties exist, and disagree with each other.
if the democrats go to far left for the public, they get voted out. if the republicans go to far right, they lose at the next election.
the dynamic tension keeps BOTH parties in check.

politics is like sex, its messy, but its fun!

Guns don't mean crap without the other rights. Look at Iraq if you need more proof were widespead citizens owned machine guns and RPGs in thier homes and were totally controlled by a US supported dictictorial police state regime for decades. Guns don't insure freedoms, they're merely one of them.

And don't forget the "pro gun" NRA crowd, which I'm reluctantly one of, does'nt want most people armed. They just want the military, the police state, and themselves to be armed or to vote, like all true militants. Forget about "crimminals" which you can become one for sedition, organizing a tax revolt, and other political crimes, being allowed to have them too dangerous. Minors too.


 

hagbard

Banned
Nov 30, 2000
2,775
0
0
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Originally posted by: hagbard
Run a Google search on "founding fathers pornography", consider it your history lesson for the day.
I did and nothing came up. But when I ran a search for "Hagbard" I got this :
Hagbard

Crap...my cover's been blown :D
 

Shad0hawK

Banned
May 26, 2003
1,456
0
0
Originally posted by: Zebo

Guns don't mean crap without the other rights. Look at Iraq if you need more proof were widespead citizens owned machine guns and RPGs in thier homes and were totally controlled by a US supported dictictorial police state regime for decades. Guns don't insure freedoms, they're merely one of them.

And don't forget the "pro gun" NRA crowd, which I'm reluctantly one of, does'nt want most people armed. They just want the military, the police state, and themselves to be armed or to vote, like all true militants. Forget about "crimminals" which you can become one for sedition, organizing a tax revolt, and other political crimes, being allowed to have them too dangerous. Minors too.

guns sure help though, would a disarmed populace have been able to rebel in the 1700's? nope.

speaking of guns, i had a range trip today, i have an AK47, M44 and a ruger 10/22 mounted with a 3x9x42 scope(which is a very literal "tack driver") it took me four shots but i hit a 12Ga. shotgun shell @ 150 yards.

 

PainTrain

Member
Jun 22, 2003
170
2
0
That is one heck of a reach there shadow. Unless of course you know of some kind of planned hillbilly revolt that I don't ;) If you honestly think that guns are what is keeping our liberties intact then I am speechless.