Didn't someone else make the comparison of how much the US spends on education (per student) in comparison to other countries? Nice of you to gloss that over and instead focus on comparisons to.....the military.
How about comparing the amount spent and the return on said investment in each of the developed countries? How do students compare?
MadRat
Lifer
- Oct 14, 1999
- 11,910
- 238
- 106
3% of the population takes up over 20% of most school budgets. It's all in the name of satisfying guidelines for the special needs of special students.
Quite frankly kids that have zero possibility to grow into normal (or higher) functioning working adults (and normal in education is an IQ of 80 - 120) have zero business in the mainstream educational system. Every time the state & local taxpayer fights these special interest groups that suck up to this 3% population they get bitch slapped by a federal court. Think about it, why should a school system have to pay for the diapers of a child born with spina bifida that also suffers from nearly zero mental function above the pre-cortex? Every school system pays tens of thousands of dollars on each one of these types of situations and they are perhaps the biggest distortion on the per pupil costs. You take away needless spending on the lowest level special ed kids and you save several percentage points of a school's budget alone. Special education programs could get cut by 80% if they simply were allowed to cast out that 20% of the population they serve for little to zero purpose. As you start to unravel some of the other costs associated with special education you'll begin to see how schools justify their ridiculous budgets.
Quite frankly kids that have zero possibility to grow into normal (or higher) functioning working adults (and normal in education is an IQ of 80 - 120) have zero business in the mainstream educational system. Every time the state & local taxpayer fights these special interest groups that suck up to this 3% population they get bitch slapped by a federal court. Think about it, why should a school system have to pay for the diapers of a child born with spina bifida that also suffers from nearly zero mental function above the pre-cortex? Every school system pays tens of thousands of dollars on each one of these types of situations and they are perhaps the biggest distortion on the per pupil costs. You take away needless spending on the lowest level special ed kids and you save several percentage points of a school's budget alone. Special education programs could get cut by 80% if they simply were allowed to cast out that 20% of the population they serve for little to zero purpose. As you start to unravel some of the other costs associated with special education you'll begin to see how schools justify their ridiculous budgets.
BoomerD
No Lifer
- Feb 26, 2006
- 62,887
- 11,283
- 136
Originally posted by: palehorse74
Originally posted by: Lothar
I hope you're a Native American because if not you should be sent home since your Great great great grand parents didn't come to the US legally.
That's basically what you're saying, right?
umm, no, I dont think that's what he's saying at all.
The children of legal immigrants, including those whose families immigrated to the U.S. prior to the implementation of our current immigration laws, have every right to be here. (a true "Grandfather Clause" if you will)
Those who are here illegally simply need to go back out and re-enter through established legal channels. If that means that they have to wait in a long line, then tough shit.
Thanks...Lothar, many of my relatives ARE Native Americans and still live on the Reservations in South Dakota. Wanna talk about illegal immigration? I think THEY definitely have room to bitch! No one invited the white man to come in and kill the "Indians" by the hundreds of thousands so they could take over their land either...BUT, this is a diffferent subject, and one that is actually governed by laws. (remember, the Native Americans didn't have any kind of immigration policy, nor against the firepower they faced, would one have done much good anyway.)
The NON_"Indian" members of my ancestry all came over during the 1800's when there was no formal immigration policy, and all newcomers were welcome. The wild frontier needed people, and folks from everywhere were welcome as long as they assimilated into the local culture and became Americans. (well, except perhaps Chinese and Japanese ...many of whom still did very well here)
Sure, there have always been Nativists like me, railing against one immigrant group or another, and their will always be. My complaints (and those of most others in this fight) are NOT against immigration, but against uncontrolled ILLEGAL immigration.
We, as a soverign nation, have the right and responsibility to OUR people to control the borders, to be able to pick & choose who gets to come here. We NEED a steady stream of new people, new ideas, new blood, but we have the right to be able to decide what skills the new people should bring with them, what education they have to have to gain entry, and what health problems should disqualify them from entrance.
MadRat
Lifer
- Oct 14, 1999
- 11,910
- 238
- 106
BoomerD-
Before you go off on white man's intrusion on red man's homeland, consider the fair trade they exchanged; disease. The red man suffered more from white man disease then he ever suffered from white man's gun. The European continent took two hundred years to finally recover from red man's diseases. The latter diseases inflected an equally harsh toll on the white man. Perhaps if the so called "natives" would get off their arses they'd better their lives and leave their grievances in the past where they belong.
I don't really have a problem with illegal immigrants other than the idea that they are being indentured relative speaking as slaves by their legal brethren. It is bad enough we have to compete against those lower wages when they are being used against us across the border. But the hell if I'll stand by and watch it happen around me so that my people have to suffer because their too chicken shit to stand up for themselves at home. At least when the indentured servants are at home we have reason to believe we can compete against them in this screwed up day and age. Their relatively cheaper wages are draining the lifeblood out of our society from the inside out. And allowing these chicken shits success here just brings more where they came from.
Before you go off on white man's intrusion on red man's homeland, consider the fair trade they exchanged; disease. The red man suffered more from white man disease then he ever suffered from white man's gun. The European continent took two hundred years to finally recover from red man's diseases. The latter diseases inflected an equally harsh toll on the white man. Perhaps if the so called "natives" would get off their arses they'd better their lives and leave their grievances in the past where they belong.
I don't really have a problem with illegal immigrants other than the idea that they are being indentured relative speaking as slaves by their legal brethren. It is bad enough we have to compete against those lower wages when they are being used against us across the border. But the hell if I'll stand by and watch it happen around me so that my people have to suffer because their too chicken shit to stand up for themselves at home. At least when the indentured servants are at home we have reason to believe we can compete against them in this screwed up day and age. Their relatively cheaper wages are draining the lifeblood out of our society from the inside out. And allowing these chicken shits success here just brings more where they came from.
Congratulations on finding what may or may not be the first mistake I've made in over 4500 posts.
Of course, you are nice enough to immediately make your own in that very post, illogically arguing that I proved something is done 'consistently' with one incident.
In fact, that you yet again made a mistake on that side, after I'd mentions your consistent bias, would add yet another data point to the accuracy of my own claim about you.
Why do you hate America? There's a reason we have public education, and the last thing we need are more kids not getting one because of your misguided view on tuition.
And there's your second error, topping my one.
If my responding tonight after your PM makes you wrong about 'hit and run' here, that's your second mistake, but even if you were to count it, it's quite false to say it's 'standard operating procedure', making that either your second or third mistake, but yet another example of the bias you display consistently, as I said. Why don't you prove your point with the actual list of examples of hit and run showing a 'standard operating procedure'? Because you don't use facts, much, in your posts, and since they don't exist as well...
You are really grasping desperately.
Originally posted by: Craig234
Congratulations on finding what may or may not be the first mistake I've made in over 4500 posts.
Its not your first mistake, just the first one you are willing to admit.
See below.
Originally posted by: Craig234
In fact, that you yet again made a mistake on that side, after I'd mentions your consistent bias, would add yet another data point to the accuracy of my own claim about you.
We all know who the consistently biased one is here. YOU! we all know everytime there is some new story about some scum of the earth liberal doing something horrendous, Craig is right there to defend them. But I guess you would need me to make a list for that too, otherwise, its not true.
I can think of at least 2 threads you have done this to in the past. First was a year or so ago and you were criticizing certain Church particulars you knew nothing about. I kept asking you when you were last in a church, and you continued to ignore it.
The second, would have been a few months back when you were defending that scum radio show host who was busted distributing child pornography to a dominatrix via the internet.
This would be the third.
This adds to my "consistently wrong" statement. Anyone who believes public school is free should not be in a debate about it. Nevermind that fact that you want us to pay even more for a failed school system.
Well, here is one site putting the figure at $521 billion for the federal portion; the figures aren't entirely clear, as they may not include a lot of other defense expenses such as some care for veterans, and they dont included the 'total' taxpayer costs, such as state budgets for national guard units that are part of the cost of the wars, and the figure is adjusted slightly for inflation.
I'll re-iterate the pointlessness of comparing the two budgets, though.
Originally posted by: Corbett
Originally posted by: Craig234
Congratulations on finding what may or may not be the first mistake I've made in over 4500 posts.
Its not your first mistake, just the first one you are willing to admit.
Let's see you list some others. Chirp, chirp, chirp, the silence I expect from you to 'hit and run' on this.
[/quote]
See below.
Originally posted by: Craig234
In fact, that you yet again made a mistake on that side, after I'd mentions your consistent bias, would add yet another data point to the accuracy of my own claim about you.
We all know who the consistently biased one is here. YOU! we all know everytime there is some new story about some scum of the earth liberal doing something horrendous, Craig is right there to defend them. But I guess you would need me to make a list for that too, otherwise, its not true.
I can think of at least 2 threads you have done this to in the past. First was a year or so ago and you were criticizing certain Church particulars you knew nothing about. I kept asking you when you were last in a church, and you continued to ignore it.
The second, would have been a few months back when you were defending that scum radio show host who was busted distributing child pornography to a dominatrix via the internet.
This would be the third.
The phrase you used is "standard operating procedure".
The evidence you offer is a list of three threads in which I did not answer a post, our of the thousands I've made in the last year.
I think you just made a fool of yourself, and proved your own claim wrong. 3 of thousands cannot be called a "standard operating procedure".
As for the three: well, this one is kind of hard to count, now, isn't it, given my response.
On the Church thread a year ago - you might need to know that I don't respond to every post by choice, and that's not a 'hit and run'. There are times when I think a post should not be responded to, usually for excessive rudeness (if it begins 'hey asshole, why don't you answer this'), but on occasion if a post has other flaws like such an extremely weak argument, or asking an inappropriate question, I might not respond.
Why don't you explain, here and now, how the last time I went to Church has relevance to whatever the post I made was, to the correctness of its argument, and we'll talk.
I recall the thread. Your question was inappropriate. Instead of discussing the topic, you were trying to go off on some personal ad hominem tangent about my church schedule.
As I recall, it's you who never did answer the relevance of your ad hominem line of discussion. Why don't you do it now, if you can?
Until you do, I think my proper response was a non-response. That doesn't make it a 'hit and run'.
Let's review what 'hit and run' means. Hit and run means not taking accountability for your posts - posting something where it's claimed you did wrong, and running instead of answering. Not responding to your *new* question about my personal religious habits is not a 'hit and run'. I was not evading any accountability for my posts, I was apparently for good reason choosing not to engage you in a discussion for whatever reason, in this case your asking an irrelevant question towards an ad hominem direction.
That leaves you with one example to look at for your 'standard operating procedure', the radio host Bernie Ward.
I don't recall the post you think I did not respond to so I can't say why I did not respond. To determine whether it was a 'hit and run', we need to look at the reason why I didn't respond. I do recall posting at length on the topic, and answering everything relevant that I saw, so you will need to provide a bit more evidence than simply mentioning the topic.
Can you say what the post said that I did not respond to, what is it you want to know about my posts on that topic now? Say, and I'll respond to you here.
We'll see whether you have one case of 'hit and run' or zero, I suspect the latter.
But regardless, your claim of 'standard operating procedure' lies in ashes, destroyed.
I think my previous post's closing line that you are grasping desperately is shown correct, and apt again. Thank you for the help proving my points about your posts.
BoomerD
No Lifer
- Feb 26, 2006
- 62,887
- 11,283
- 136
By this standard, I don't have minor children who are enrolled in the public school system. I should be able to opt out of all related taxes then, right? After all, I'm getting no personal benefit out of the taxes I'm paying to support the state and local school districts.
I really can't argue much about the disease issue. The white man spread their diseases, often intentionally, among the tribes as a means of thinning them out and in some cases, killing them off entirely.
In spite of any "red man diseases" the whites contracted, it doesn't begin to make up for the hundreds of thousands of red men, women, and children slaughtered and massacred by the white soldiers and vigilantes. FAR too often, the tribal leaders were called to a meeting with the US troops under the guise of a cease fire/treaty meeting, then slaughtered under a white flag of truce.
Your last line however, I agree with 100%. My relatives who are still alive on the res aren't exactly "productive citizens." Many of them are or were in prisons around the states for various crimes, most of them live on government handouts, (haven't visited in almost 40 years, so I do NOT know how the casino rackets may have improved their lots in life) and very few of them have any education past about the 8th grade.
Reservation life is bad. It's spirit-breaking. The folks who remain there often have nothing in their lives outside the meager few belongings they have in the shanty they live in, nor any hope of ever having more.
IMO, the ONLY way for them to improve their lives is to leave the res, get an education (or at least learn a trade) and work/live in the white man's world.
Here we agree it seems. Immigrants are mostly good people who want to improve their lifes. I can't fault them for that, HOWEVER, we do have immigration laws for reasons. they control the numbers of people who immigrate here from various countries. my neighbor's wife is Filipino. Nice lady, US citizen now. His twin brother is also married to a Filipino native who has become a citizen. BOTH families are staunch "anti-illegal immigrationists." They look at what they had to go through to get their wives here, to get their green cards, and to get them to citizenship. It pisses them off to see the Mexicans ignore the laws and immigrate here illegally without going through the procedures.
Another area that doesn't get enough press IMO, is the diseases that the illegals bring here. Since they don't have to undergo medical screening like legal immigrants here, they bring lots of highly contagious diseases with them.
http://www.jpands.org/vol10no1/cosman.pdf
"By default, we grant health passes to illegal aliens. Yet many
illegal aliens harbor fatal diseases that American medicine fought
and vanquished long ago, such as drug-resistant tuberculosis,
malaria, leprosy, plague, polio, dengue, and Chagas disease."
"Many illegals who cross our borders have tuberculosis. That disease
had largely disappeared from America, thanks to excellent hygiene
and powerful modern drugs such as isoniazid and rifampin.
TB?s swift, deadly return now is lethal for about 60 percent of those
infected because of new Multi-Drug Resistant Tuberculosis (MDRTB).
Until recently MDR-TB was endemic to Mexico. This
M is resistant to at least two major
antitubercular drugs. Ordinary TB usually is cured in six months with
four drugs that cost about $2,000. MDR-TB takes 24 months with
many expensive drugs that cost around $250,000,with toxic side
effects. Each illegal with MDR-TB coughs and infects 10 to 30
people, who will not show symptoms immediately. Latent disease
explodes later.
TB was virtually absent inVirginia until in 2002, when it spiked
a 17 percent increase, but Prince William County, just south of
Washington, D.C., had a much larger rise of 188 percent. Public
health officials blamed immigrants. In 2001 the Indiana School of
Medicine studied an outbreak of MDR-TB, and traced it to
Mexican illegal aliens. The Queens, New York, health department
attributed 81 percent of new TB cases in 2001 to immigrants. The
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention ascribed 42 percent of
all new TB cases to ?foreign born? people who have up to eight
times higher incidence. Apparently, 66 percent of all TB cases
coming to America originate in Mexico, the Philippines, and
Vietnam. Virulent TB outbreaks afflicted schoolteachers and
children in Michigan, adults and children in Texas, and
policemen in Minnesota. Recently TB erupted in Portland, Maine,
and Del Rey Beach, Florida.
Something has to be done to stop the illegal invasion of our country.
I'm not sure if you're answering my post or IGBT's, but of course the theory is that society benefits from its children receiving education, and just as society is required to invest in other areas that benefit society, society - not just parents - invests in the education of the children. When a new interstate is built for the good of society, both people who benefit hugely and those who benefit little are taxed for the cost. Everyone pays for the FBI, not only those who have cases investigated by it. And so on.
How predictable. You ask for examples, then claim those aren't enough to justify my claim.
You should have continued in the thread if you wanted to have that discussion, inestead, a year ago, you chose to consistently ignore it. At the time, it had everything to do with what you were talking about, and you knew it. That is why you chose to ignore it, because it would destroy your entir argument.
Unlike your attack in this thread on me, which was completely wrong and shows just hwo "biased" you actually are, my asking you your status as a church goer has EVERYTHING to do with the discussion.
And you would know this how? You completely ignored it, so why would I go on and explain it. If you want to, bring the thread back up.
Excuses, excuses. Still doesnt exlain why you DID do a hit and run on this thread.
This was after I posted in another thread that you were ignoring the Ward thread. Only then did you come in and start posting agin. Just like you did in this thread. I actually had to PM you to respond. You were so passionate in these threads up until someone challenged you on your idiotic responces.
Perhaps in the strange world you live in, where socially distorted people like Ward are "good" human beings, then yes, you've destroyed my argument. However; most of us here are able no matter which political view we have, to differ right from wrong. Meaning, we aren't biased. You however, defend some of the most vile creatures on the planet and then have the audacity to claim that others are "consistently biased", when you in fact are as predictable as snow in January.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Discussion Intel current and future Lakes & Rapids thread- Started by TheF34RChannel
- Replies: 23K
-
Discussion Zen 5 Speculation (EPYC Turin and Strix Point/Granite Ridge - Ryzen 9000)- Started by DisEnchantment
- Replies: 10K
-
Discussion Intel Meteor, Arrow, Lunar & Panther Lakes Discussion Threads
- Started by Tigerick
- Replies: 7K
-
-
Facebook
Twitter