Question PSA: Do NOT use liquid metal on a 3090.

[VirtualLarry]

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esquared
Anandtech Forum Director

 

[Leeea]

PSA:
Do not use liquid metal on anything.

It always escapes eventually.

 

[Ajay]

PSA:
Do not use liquid metal on anything.

It always escapes eventually.

Then you need to lure it into a metal smelting factory and toss it into molten iron to kill it

 

[DeathReborn]

Also known as don't use Liquid Metal like an absolute amateur.

 

[DaaQ]

More money than brains.

 

[KentState]

I don't think it being an 3090 has anything to do with it, more like the application.

 

[Leeea]

Then you need to lure it into a metal smelting factory and toss it into molten iron to kill it

The really cool thing is you get to watch it go through all its prior shapes as it melts in the pot.

 

[ultimatebob]

The really cool thing is you get to watch it go through all its prior shapes as it melts in the pot.

I'll bet that batch of steel was extra high quality, because it had Terminator metal in it. They probably made the million mile Lexus out of that metal

 

[Pohemi]

Only used liquid metal TIM (Conductonaut) once, to re-lid an i7 7700K. It worked even better than I hoped for.

I was pretty conservative when applying it, but yeah...it was a very thin consistency/viscosity, and I could see it being easy to overapply. I think that 3090 just got exposed to noobsauce.

 

[Leeea]

Only used liquid metal TIM (Conductonaut) once, to re-lid an i7 7700K. It worked even better than I hoped for.

It works extremely well, at first.

But as the years go by, it seems to always escape. Usually just results in poor cooling, but once in a while it shorts something out.

We see both Sony and Asus using special insulating sheets, cutouts, and press fit mounting in attempts to corral the liquid metal from escaping. Almost never see that used in the DIY space.

 

[Hail The Brain Slug]

It works extremely well, at first.

But as the years go by, it seems to always escape. Usually just results in poor cooling, but once in a while it shorts something out.

We see both Sony and Asus using special insulating sheets, cutouts, and press fit mounting in attempts to corral the liquid metal from escaping. Almost never see that used in the DIY space.

A proper delid/relid with silicone to hold the heat spreader in place will last indefinitely. On devices where the heatsink is much larger physically, the coldplate will shift considerably during heating/cooling cycles helping pump out the liquid metal.

A small nickel heat spreader held in place with silicone does not shift like this, and the liquid metal lasts practically indefinitely. Silicon lottery has stated they have never, in the life of the business, had a CPU where cooling performance degraded measurably or the liquid metal migrated, causing issues. I've delidded and relidded several CPUs and they all perform like they did when I first performed the procedure, even 5/6/7 years later. (The oldest is a 4770k in 2014).

Graphics cards, laptops, etc with much more elaborate coldplate/heatsink designs will not work like this. Also if you are an amateur and apply far too much liquid metal, it will migrate almost immediately and begin causing issues in short order.

 

[Pohemi]

But as the years go by, it seems to always escape.

A proper delid/relid with silicone to hold the heat spreader in place will last indefinitely...
...A small nickel heat spreader held in place with silicone does not shift like this, and the liquid metal lasts practically indefinitely.

Graphics cards, laptops, etc with much more elaborate coldplate/heatsink designs will not work like this.

Yeah, that's precisely why I only used the Conductonaut on the bare die (it got bordered/enclosed with silicone), and used a more common paste between the CPU and it's cooler.

I considered using the liquid metal for mounting the CPU cooler, since I still had plenty left after doing the relid. The thought of a possible application mess, and the worry of pump-out and lifespan made me stick with MX-4.

 

[aigomorla]

Also known as don't use Liquid Metal like an absolute amateur.

i was going to say the same thing....

People do not understand its liquid at higher temps.. which means it will SEEP out.
This is why when you delided and applied Liquid Metal, you always used clear nail polish on the tiny resistors in the event the liquid metal seeped out, potentially killing that cpu.

Sometimes i question if idiots do it so they can feed trolls and get youtube monetization or if they are just that stupid.

 

[Stuka87]

Because the "liquid" part in the name is not nearly obvious enough

 

[keithftw]

So what should we use?

 

[Leeea]

So what should we use?

For a normal heatsink just use heat sink paste or pad. Pads usually work better on GPUs. Paste is usually better for CPUs.


Delidding is another subject I know nothing about, and as far as I know it is almost never done these days. Back in the day Intel used some very inferior materials under the lid, but these days they solder the lids down, so not much to be gained.

 

[Furious_Styles]

I always advise against using LM on GPUs. Small gains are not worth it and the risk of damage to other components is too high. Was a great mod on 3rd/4th/6th/7th gen intel CPUs though. I still do those CPUs when I get one in.

 

[aigomorla]

Delidding is another subject I know nothing about, and as far as I know it is almost never done these days.

thats because they went back to solder.
There's a lot of mixed opinions about using paste over solder.

If your an overclocker, it makes delidding a LOT easier which means bare die cooling far more accessible. Bare die cooling is vastly superior PERIOD, but it comes with a lot of risk, which normal end users are too excuse my pun... "uneducated" to handle. Like putting too much weight on the DIE, and cracking it without proper shims.

However the solder has its own advantages as in it keeps the ihs firmly planted on the die, and allows better surface area contact with lesser resistance, hence you get better cooling overall if your not delidding it. But the Solder has its own issues with thermal expansion over time, as the cpu heats up and cools, then heats up and cools, which some intel engineer thats way smarter then me stated over time can damage the silicon.
(shrug but who keeps their cpu's for more then 10+ yrs now under constant thermal expansion like that... were talking about 100,000's cycles here.)

As for me, i prefer the delidded approach when i was a heavy overclocker.
My prime load temps on water would be people's idle temps which made people cry.
Now i do exactly that just by throwing RGB into my builds... so i guess i still make people cry.

 

[Leeea]

Now i do exactly that just by throwing RGB into my builds

RGB makes a computer faster, but only if you can see it.

 

[Ajay]

i was going to say the same thing....

People do not understand its liquid at higher temps.. which means it will SEEP out.
This is why when you delided and applied Liquid Metal, you always used clear nail polish on the tiny resistors in the event the liquid metal seeped out, potentially killing that cpu.

Sometimes i question if idiots do it so they can feed trolls and get youtube monetization or if they are just that stupid.

Do you remember the stuff from years ago that you had to put through a particular heat cycle and cooling period and then the LM would become solid (almost like soldiering it).

 

[aigomorla]

Do you remember the stuff from years ago that you had to put through a particular heat cycle and cooling period and then the LM would become solid (almost like soldiering it).

i think this is what you were looking for.

Indigo Xtreme | Indigo Xtreme ETI | Page 1 | Sort By: Product Title A-Z - FrozenCPU.com

single application only... would turn solid and stay solid, but the moment you undid that cpu sink you had to buy another 10+ dollar kit.
But they were never available for GPU's.

 

[Ajay]

i think this is what you were looking for.

Indigo Xtreme | Indigo Xtreme ETI | Page 1 | Sort By: Product Title A-Z - FrozenCPU.com

single application only... would turn solid and stay solid, but the moment you undid that cpu sink you had to buy another 10+ dollar kit.
But they were never available for GPU's.

Great memory! Yeah, stuff would have been ideal for GPU. No joy.