PS3: Inside and Out

VIAN

Diamond Member
Aug 22, 2003
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This article talks about the PS3 and its features. Here's what I think of them.

The pricing of the PS3 core and premium seems to suggest that Sony cares primarily about selling the PS3 core. It makes sense, since it is substantially cheaper. Those damn Japanese are the only ones who get special treatment. They get a "special" price of only $430, $70 cheaper than the rest of the world. And retailers will make their own prices for the premium system.

The differences between the PS3 core and the premium are: extra 40GB of space on HDD, Flash Memory Slots, Built-in Wifi, and chrome lining aesthetics. The premium console is overkill. Seriously, Flash Memory Slots?! The core PS3 is a bargain with a built-in HDD and Blu-ray for $500; only $100 extra compared to the 360 premium. If you're worried about only having 20GB of space in the core HDD, you can upgrade it later. Sony says it's as easy as buying a 2.5? SATA notebook HDD and replacing the old one. Simple and impressive!

If the heat gets really bad, the system can ramp up its fans to cool the PS3. However, it's generally as quiet as the PS2. I hate how some people exaggerated the quietness previously. People said that the PS3 is whisper quiet. I know the PS2 isn?t whisper quiet. What the hell does that mean anyway? I think it is too subjective. They would do well to compare it to something current like these guys.

The Blu-Ray optical drive is an interesting, but risky choice. It's nice that it's basically included in the PS3 for only $100, but it does contribute heavily to the overall price of the PS3 and it doesn't get good yields. Because of the yields, they gave the 360 a bigger head start. I don't think the Blu-Ray disc storage space is needed for games. What I do think is that this is just a way of Sony pushing Blu-Ray on the market. However, on the positive, games will finally be region-free. Let?s hope this is true. But movies will not be. But region A includes USA and Japan, which should fill enough people with glee. Also, your discs won't get scratched when in a vertical position.

Cell. Firstly, it?s one of the most expensive pieces that drove up the price of the PS3, with benefits to gamers being hazy. And second, it's super hard to program for. Programmers have a hard time programming for Dual-core chips, now imagine the 8 chips in the Cell. It may be a long time before the technology gets completely used, if ever. And I'm worried about cross-platform titles. Since I believe that the 360 will take the stage this time around and they'll be porting from the 360 to the PS3. Cross-platform titles will be difficult to program on the PS3. According to a quote that I've read from Square/Enix it would take only a few months to port a game to the 360, but 2 years to port that same game to the PS3. Does it mean that PS3 will have more expensive ports? I guess we'll see.

On a technical side note: Holy crap, the article states that programmers had to code for the PS2 in Assembly. Wow, I feel sorry for them. That language sucks BALLS. Well, at least it's not Binary. Sony will actually give programmers high-level language tools for the PS3 this time.

The RSX will power the PS3 and while its similar to what powers the 360 it's inferior at the same time. The 360 can do AA without a negligible performance hit due to its 10MB of on die memory. The RSX will not be able to do that; it will sustain a performance hit. This tells me that there will be more jaggies on PS3 games on then on 360 games. Meaning the graphics will be better on the 360. Who knows, maybe those 10mb can be used to do some crazy effects as well.

PS3 controller. Anyone know why it?s called SIXAXIS? The analog sticks placement still sucks. I hate pressure sensitive buttons, but I think that's just me. The new L2 and R2 buttons now function like triggers, but from what I've read in another article, their comfort is questionable. And the controller now communicates its position allowing you to control a game just by moving it. This reminds me of noobs when they first play games, they try to move Mario on the NES like it's a body experience. This feature might be interesting, but we'll have to wait and see. I think it'll be uncomfortable to move the controller and press buttons at the same time, so I think it?s a shot feature. It's like the DS and its stick - uncomfortable as hell after a long play time. Actually, 30 minutes isn?t that long. People, like the creator of the DS, have forgotten that the point of a controller is for an easy, comfortable interface. But people will buy it because it?s something new that is promised as a revolution.

Also the PS3 controllers? battery life is only 30 hours. That?s 10 times inferior to the 360 controller's. Why did PS3 need to go with Bluetooth? That is a significant difference. Once the battery dies, you'll have to buy a new controller for $50. This may not be as bad as it sound though. Li-ion batteries are supposed to be rechargeable up to 1000 times and that should last you for a long time, even if you recharge once a week. But you will have to recharge it more often than not, compared to a X360 controller - once a week, if you game a lot. Again, maybe it?s me, but I don't like wireless because of the battery hassles. Because, with the PS3, I'd have to recharge more often, it would bother me.
 

fliguy84

Senior member
Jan 31, 2005
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The premium console is overkill. Seriously, Flash Memory Slots?!

For uploading pictures to your PS3 or sharing saved game files with your friends?

It must need an elaborate cooling system because the PS3 is the heaviest console I've ever heard of. At a hefty 11 pounds, that's heavier than the original XBOX by 2.5 pounds and the current 360 by 3.3 pounds.

The PS3 has a built-in PSU. If you add the total weight of the 360's 'brick' PSU and the console itself, both the PS3 and the 360 should weigh the same.

Why did PS3 need to go with Bluetooth?

So that all your present bluetooth accessories can work with your ps3.

Once the battery dies, you'll have to buy a new controller for $50

http://ps3.qj.net/PS3-controller-battery-update/pg/49/aid/70028

"This is a purely speculative story and is largely untrue. The latest generation of Lithium Polymer batteries hardly suffer any memory effect at all, so it'll be many years before there's any degradation in terms of battery performance. When and if this happens, then of course we will be providing a service to exchange these items."

Wrong. Sony will replace the battery for some cost. AND even if you don't want to get the battery replaced, you can still use the USB cable to make it a 'wired' controller.
 

Regs

Lifer
Aug 9, 2002
16,665
21
81
For consoles it's all about the games. So hopefully PS3 will come out strong with better programmability. As for jaggies - who knows until it comes but it does raise an eyebrow.
 

Dainas

Senior member
Aug 5, 2005
299
0
0
Well excessive Jaggies are practically a PlayStation trademark at this point, remember the PS2 interlaced 480?.........that was almost eye stabbing bad.
 

morgash

Golden Member
Nov 24, 2005
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also the cell has 9 cores, 1 powerPC core that is pretty much an exact copy of one of the xbox 360's 3 cores, and 8 "cells" that are low level simple instruction cores that can be used for sound processing, physics, and possibly some graphics functions though most people doubt this because the link between the cell, the rsx, and the system memory is already small enough. according to Sony the PS3 is actually EASIER to code for than the ps2 because it no longer uses Assembly. PLUS coding for multiple cores will become the standard as desktop computers, xbox 360, and ps3 ALL have dual cores or better at this point (well its becoming the standard on pc anyway). add in the fact that dead rising is the only game out for the 360 that actually USES more than the one core and you have the fact that at this point it really doesnt matter.

one thing i don't understand is why sony didnt disable 4 pipes on the RSX and make it 256 bit instead. the increased memory bandwidth would far outwiegh the small performance loss from the four pipeline cut and four less pipes would greatly improve the yeilds on chips because defective quads could just be disabled. the 256 bit memory interface would also greatly decrease the performance hit from enabling AA. the 360 could get away with 128bit because of its onboard eDRAM but the PS3 cannot, especially pushing 1080p. just my .02

morgash

*EDIT* almost forgot. they disable one of the cell cores to improve yeilds. this means that it will have the one powerpc core and only 7 cell procs, OH NO! lol
 

VIAN

Diamond Member
Aug 22, 2003
6,575
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Originally posted by: fliguy84
The PS3 has a built-in PSU. If you add the total weight of the 360's 'brick' PSU and the console itself, both the PS3 and the 360 should weigh the same.
I was unaware of that the PS3 didn't have a power brick. I deleted that paragraph.

Originally posted by: morgash
PLUS coding for multiple cores will become the standard as desktop computers, xbox 360, and ps3 ALL have dual cores or better at this point (well its becoming the standard on pc anyway). add in the fact that dead rising is the only game out for the 360 that actually USES more than the one core and you have the fact that at this point it really doesnt matter.
What I was getting at in my Cell paragraph is that the idea that the more cores you have, the more complex it is to code since there will be more threads processed at once.
 

hans030390

Diamond Member
Feb 3, 2005
7,326
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Didn't the premium model come with an HDMI slot? Or has that changed somehow?

AA isn't really a problem with me. I've never used it on the computer, and don't really notice jaggies too much.
 

fliguy84

Senior member
Jan 31, 2005
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Originally posted by: hans030390
Didn't the premium model come with an HDMI slot? Or has that changed somehow?

AA isn't really a problem with me. I've never used it on the computer, and don't really notice jaggies too much.

Both models have HDMI output. It's just Sony doesn't include HDMI cable in both package :/
 

Cookie Monster

Diamond Member
May 7, 2005
5,161
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I heard that PS3 made another contract with nVIDIA for the RSX. This second contract had more money involved. Since the delay of PS3 and the release of G80 could potentially mean that the RSX could use the G8x variant in the near future?

Cant find the link though..
 

morgash

Golden Member
Nov 24, 2005
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if the PS3 used the g80 it would be AMAZINGLY expensive. not to mention micrsoft would ****** a brick if it was able to run dx10 while the 360 cant. this would also put the ps3 lightyears ahead of the 360 in sheer horsepower and the 600 dollar pricetag would be NOTHING to get a 8 core g80 beast. MAYBE they upped it to the more recent, smaller, and higher yield g71(over the older, slower, and hotter g70) but i cannot see the g80 happening in any way shape or form.

morgash

*EDIT* HERE is the link to that article BTW
 

Cookie Monster

Diamond Member
May 7, 2005
5,161
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Originally posted by: morgash
if the PS3 used the g80 it would be AMAZINGLY expensive. not to mention micrsoft would ****** a brick if it was able to run dx10 while the 360 cant. this would also put the ps3 lightyears ahead of the 360 in sheer horsepower and the 600 dollar pricetag would be NOTHING to get a 8 core g80 beast. MAYBE they upped it to the more recent, smaller, and higher yield g71(over the older, slower, and hotter g70) but i cannot see the g80 happening in any way shape or form.

morgash

*EDIT* HERE is the link to that article BTW

Not G80. I mean like a mid range G8x. G80 will be a no no.
 

morgash

Golden Member
Nov 24, 2005
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i got ya. it would still mean the ps3 could run dx10. considering Crytek seems to think no next gen console can do this i would tend to believe them. not to mention the fact that everyone that got the ps3 now would be supremely pissed if they later came out with a faster more capable version for the same price 4-6 mths down the road.

morgash
 

jiffylube1024

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
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I think the PS3 looks to be an interesting piece of hardware. For $500-600, it's actually a pretty good deal (currently) on a BlueRay player, and oh yeah, it will play PS2 and PS3 games. And it looks cool. Still quite expensive though.

My main beef with the PS3 is that 1st gen Sony hardware is always crap. The PS1 had skipping issues and needed to be flipped upside down. PS2 stopped reading certain types of disks entirely.

If anyone says the PS3, with an entirely new optical disc format, will be problem free, they're kidding everyone. I hate to recommend those extended warranties from Best Buy, but if I were to get one, I'd get warranty for 3-5 years. Launch day PS3's will die en mass, the only question is how. I'm not too confident that the cooling solution will be so hot either. Chances are this "fan that ramps up if it gets hot" will turn it from quiet to a lawnmower (but we'lll see). They were overheating left and right at E3, but hey apparently thats because it's in an "enclosed space" (I thought consoles were supposed to run in all kinds of situations; silly me!).


Originally posted by: VIAN

The pricing of the PS3 core and premium seems to suggest that Sony cares primarily about selling the PS3 core. It makes sense, since it is substantially cheaper. Those damn Japanese are the only ones who get special treatment. They get a "special" price of only $430, $70 cheaper than the rest of the world. And retailers will make their own prices for the premium system.

Nah - if people will pay $430 they'll pay $600, especially considering they'll be $1000 by Christmas and sold out everywhere.


If the heat gets really bad, the system can ramp up its fans to cool the PS3. However, it's generally as quiet as the PS2. I hate how some people exaggerated the quietness previously. People said that the PS3 is whisper quiet. I know the PS2 isn?t whisper quiet. What the hell does that mean anyway? I think it is too subjective. They would do well to compare it to something current like these guys.

Yeah PS2 was on the noisy side. Though the slim PS2 (SCPH7xxxx model) is nice and quiet :) .


The Blu-Ray optical drive is an interesting, but risky choice. It's nice that it's basically included in the PS3 for only $100, but it does contribute heavily to the overall price of the PS3 and it doesn't get good yields.

Microsoft will be kicking themselves in 2 years IMO. DVD for a next gen console that's supposed to last 5 years... That HD-DVD "add-on" drive may become more than just a luxury feature.

Cell. Firstly, it?s one of the most expensive pieces that drove up the price of the PS3, with benefits to gamers being hazy.

Cell is Sony in a nutshell. Break all current trends and try to tell the market exactly what they wants. Highly ambitious, high risk, high reward. I still think they should have just gone with something like the 3-CPU layout of the Xbox360, but hey, Japanese Developers seem to get it done, no matter how difficult the hardware. American Developers are catching on too (Naughty Dog, the guys who made God of War, etc.)

And second, it's super hard to program for.

Same was said about the PS2 hardware, especially it's graphics processor. Look at the latest PS2 games - pretty good visuals out of such antiquated hardware.

The RSX will power the PS3 and while its similar to what powers the 360 it's inferior at the same time. The 360 can do AA without a negligible performance hit due to its 10MB of on die memory. The RSX will not be able to do that; it will sustain a performance hit. This tells me that there will be more jaggies on PS3 games on then on 360 games. Meaning the graphics will be better on the 360. Who knows, maybe those 10mb can be used to do some crazy effects as well.

Nintendo used on-die cache memory to great effect in the Gamecube too. Sony is lucky they have ubertalented developers like Square and Konami already onboard, because Xbox360 hardware looks like it could be just as capable.

PS3 controller. Anyone know why it?s called SIXAXIS? The analog sticks placement still sucks

If it ain't broke don't fix it. #1 selling controller in the world. It still gets the job done.