Problems with PC rebooting, many things checked already

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#1
SOLVED: PC case caused some grounding/shorting, breadboarding solved the issue.

Hello.



Since few weeks I have a problem with constantly rebooting PC. I am writing the post, because I feel like I already checked almost everything that can be checked to troubleshoot this.



First things first: Reboots happen very randomly (sometimes 5 within an hour, sometimes 1 every 5 hours). I dont have BSOD, in windows logs i only have errors 41 (unexpected closure of system).



Thing I already checked:



  • PSU is fine i replaced old one with new one, reboots still happen
  • Ram should be fine, I had some reboots during memtest86 but they felt like the ones I am having all the time, when I finally managed to get pc going for a little longer, memory passed all tests few times.
  • GPU is not the cause I think, I did the memtest with GPU removed, there were still reboots, I also stress tested it with furmark, went fine for 30 minutes, and then i finished the test myself.
  • Motherboard is not the issue as well I recently managed to buy new one, exact same one, the system still reboots randomly.
  • I swapped and/or removed HDD and SSD’s, reboots still happened.
  • All temps are FINE (AC’d room, reboots happen both at idle, and on full stress)
So the last thing i suspect might be the CPU? How can i Troubleshoot this, It’s the only part I cannot swap at the moment.

I was reading a lot of forums and threads, but I feel like i did everything already and the reboots still happen. The system is old, sure, but it worked fine for a lot of time, this only started happening recently.


Specs:

Windows 10 Edu

mobo: asus p8h61-m le (bios v4601, latest)

cpu: i7 2600 @ 3,4Ghz

ram: 2x 4GB Goodram DDR3 1333Mhz

psu: Seasonic Focus Gold Plus 80 450W


I am running out of options here.


Thanks
 
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coercitiv

Diamond Member
Jan 24, 2014
3,323
825
136
#2
Any other electronics or lights misbehaving around the house?
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#3
Any other electronics or lights misbehaving around the house?
Not at all. All other electronics and everything works fine. No power outages, or anything like this. As a side note: i was trying other outlet, problem remained.
 

Tricur

Junior Member
Jun 1, 2017
2
0
36
#4
Does your case have a reset button? If so, try disconnecting the "reset" front panel connector from the motherboard header. It's possible that the button is intermittently shorting.
 

coercitiv

Diamond Member
Jan 24, 2014
3,323
825
136
#5
Aside from external factors (bad power cables or power delivery) my next move would be to increase voltages on both CPU and RAM.
  • For RAM if stock voltage is 1.5V I would go for something like 1.6-1.65V.
  • For the CPU I would go 30-50mV higher through an offset. (hence a VID of 1.2V would translate into a Vcore of ~1.25V)
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#6
Does your case have a reset button? If so, try disconnecting the "reset" front panel connector from the motherboard header. It's possible that the button is intermittently shorting.
I did that before indeed, no result. I also treid another power switch.


As for the voltages, I will check that and see the result. The cables and power delivery should be fine, as the PSU and cables is brand new (that was my first guess, so I purchased new one 2 weeks ago).
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#7
Aside from external factors (bad power cables or power delivery) my next move would be to increase voltages on both CPU and RAM.
  • For RAM if stock voltage is 1.5V I would go for something like 1.6-1.65V.
  • For the CPU I would go 30-50mV higher through an offset. (hence a VID of 1.2V would translate into a Vcore of ~1.25V)
Did that, did not help, reboots still ocuur.
 

Shmee

Memory and Storage, Graphics Cards
Super Moderator
Sep 13, 2008
3,850
59
126
#8
Try a CPU stress test like prime 95 and see what happens. If it reboots right away, that tells us its possibly a CPU issue.
 
Oct 14, 2003
6,217
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126
#9
For RAM if stock voltage is 1.5V I would go for something like 1.6-1.65V.
With Sandy Bridge, Intel actually recommends running the memory at 1.5V.

@sherokee Make sure the memory is ok rather than just assuming it. Also try to run it at bare minimum. CPU + RAM + Board + Storage. Nothing else. Do not add anything else and troubleshoot with the four components. Heck, try with one memory at a time. Try one, and the other.

It would also help if you take some pictures of the system taken in different angles. Good, clear, close shots of the components are important.

  • I swapped and/or removed HDD and SSD’s, reboots still happened.
  • All temps are FINE
-What does "Fine" mean?
-When you changed drives it was freshly formatted and Windows reinstalled?
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#10
Try a CPU stress test like prime 95 and see what happens. If it reboots right away, that tells us its possibly a CPU issue.
Ok I will try that again and report the results. I did that test not too long ago (the reboots were there already) and I remember it passed. I will see that again.


With Sandy Bridge, Intel actually recommends running the memory at 1.5V.

@sherokee Make sure the memory is ok rather than just assuming it. Also try to run it at bare minimum. CPU + RAM + Board + Storage. Nothing else. Do not add anything else and troubleshoot with the four components. Heck, try with one memory at a time. Try one, and the other.

It would also help if you take some pictures of the system taken in different angles. Good, clear, close shots of the components are important.


-What does "Fine" mean?
-When you changed drives it was freshly formatted and Windows reinstalled?
60 degrees C is max temps I ever get while playing some more CPU intensive games (like WoW with 80 players on the screen). And I am talking about few hours of playing, it never really got past that magic "60" mark. Graphics sometimes go to 70, but it stabilizes as well, and cools within seconds of turning off games. Case air temperatures are even lower, air flow is good.

I did the tests exactly like you said, I even tried memtest without any storages (so its even less components, just RAM, CPU and MOBO) and i had few reboots.

I ordered new ram sticks today, to ultimately test the RAM.

Yes, format + all required up-to-date drivers every time. Pc was rebooting during memtest too, so i thought it's not windows/software related.
 
Aug 25, 2001
44,141
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#11
Does it do it in a Linux Live USB / DVD? Make one of those with another PC (www.linuxmint.com) , and boot the suspect PC using it, and run it for a while. Does it still restart? If NOT, then the problem is with your Windows installation, or OS drive.

Seems like you've tried just about everything else.
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#12
Does it do it in a Linux Live USB / DVD? Make one of those with another PC (www.linuxmint.com) , and boot the suspect PC using it, and run it for a while. Does it still restart? If NOT, then the problem is with your Windows installation, or OS drive.

Seems like you've tried just about everything else.
I already tested PC with memtest booting from USB (with and without SSD connected) and it was still happening. Could it be because of some kind of fault with CPU? Iam still waiting for new RAM sticks to test out thought.
 
Jan 12, 2019
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#13
Something is short-circuiting? Electricity spikes? Radiation (I'm not joking)?
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#15
Hi, have you tested your setup outside the case?
No. I will try to breadboard it tomorrow. Could it happen that randomly tho? I am using same case for some time now, didnt have reboots in it before.
 

ondma

Senior member
Mar 18, 2018
434
122
61
#16
When it restarts, does it then run without problems for a while, or does it do it over and over? I had a similar problem, and it was a fan on the psu that was intermittently freezing up, and it would overheat almost immediately when it did. I know you have eliminated this with a new psu, but could something like this be happening to maybe cpu, gpu, or case fans?
Have you tried a different gpu or running the system from the igp?
 
Mar 1, 2014
38
8
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#18
If you already cleared cmos, do this in bios: change cpu voltage to manual and put 1.35V and see does that helps.
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#19
When it restarts, does it then run without problems for a while, or does it do it over and over? I had a similar problem, and it was a fan on the psu that was intermittently freezing up, and it would overheat almost immediately when it did. I know you have eliminated this with a new psu, but could something like this be happening to maybe cpu, gpu, or case fans?
Have you tried a different gpu or running the system from the igp?
I replaced the CPU fans, and tried iGPU. Always same behaviour. At this point its only RAM and CPU to suspect.

This is a good suggestion, really, because unknown shorts can produce this effect.
Iam testing this right now, I will report results if it works for a little longer.

If you already cleared cmos, do this in bios: change cpu voltage to manual and put 1.35V and see does that helps.
Is this safe for my CPU? As a side note, my cooler is Scythe Yasya.
 

ehume

Golden Member
Nov 6, 2009
1,384
17
91
#20
Is this safe for my CPU? As a side note, my cooler is Scythe Yasya.
Voltages safe for CPUs as old as yours are posted by now. I had an i7 875k that ran for a couple of years at 4GHz (that was fast back then). I had to back off to 3.6GHz so the old CPU would stay alive. At that reduced OC it ran for years, was still going strong when it was replaced by a 4790k when I got my 8700k (I included that latter because it puts a timeframe on when it was changed out -- early 2018). Then the i7 875k tumbled further down the hand-me-down trail, but I'm not sure how often she goes on her desktop.

The point is that Vcore=1.35v may or may not be safe for your CPU, but you may have to relax your OC.
 
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sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#21
Voltages safe for CPUs as old as yours are posted by now. I had an i7 875k that ran for a couple of years at 4GHz (that was fast back then). I had to back off to 3.6GHz so the old CPU would stay alive. At that reduced OC it ran for years, was still going strong when it was replaced by a 4790k when I got my 8700k (I included that latter because it puts a timeframe on when it was changed out -- early 2018). Then the i875k tumbled further down the hand-me-down trail, but I'm not sure how often she goes on her desktop.

The point is that Vcore=1.35v may or may not be safe for your CPU, but you may have to relax your OC.
Ok, I will then lurk across the net a little about the topic, and then try that, if the breadboarding proves to be uneffective, so I dont troubleshoot more than one thing at a time (so I can pinpoint it better).
 

coercitiv

Diamond Member
Jan 24, 2014
3,323
825
136
#22
The point is that Vcore=1.35v may or may not be safe for your CPU, but you may have to relax your OC.
Wait, what OC? Isn't the CPU in the OP running stock clocks?
 

ehume

Golden Member
Nov 6, 2009
1,384
17
91
#23
Wait, what OC? Isn't the CPU in the OP running stock clocks?
I'd have to look it up. But really, even if it is a stock clock, that makes no difference; it's all arbitrary. It may be that for that particular chip, "stock" clocks burn through. After all, he is using an i7 2600. It should be able to last eight years, but maybe not at 3.4GHz.

If everything else checks out, the problem is probably the CPU. I wouldn't mess with high Vcore on such an old chip.
 

coercitiv

Diamond Member
Jan 24, 2014
3,323
825
136
#24
If everything else checks out, the problem is probably the CPU. I wouldn't mess with high Vcore on such an old chip.
Agree, that's why I asked the OP to try an +30-50mV offset on the CPU and see if that helps.

From my experience a 30mV jump in Vcore will get a CPU on the verge of crashing to be significantly more stable, even if it's temporary. But the OP reported no change in stability, so I'm at a loss as to why others ask for more high Vcore testing.
 

sherokee

Junior Member
Jul 10, 2019
13
0
6
#25
Vcore testing and under/over clocking made no difference, crashes happened both at 1.6Ghz and at 3.8 turbo, as well as lower/higher voltages. I am breadboarding for 2 days in a row without crash now. I will use this for a little bit longer, and report the result. I am actually very surprised this might have been a problem with the case :O. I'll let it go for few more days just to be sure, and let you guys know.

By the way thank you very much for many of your suggestions here, I am sure many of them could as well helped either me, or people with similar issue who might read this post.
 


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