Pressurizing a liquid cooling loop

[DerwenArtos12]

Pressurizing the liquid would definately creat a greater strain on the system but, i would also lower the freezing temperature of the liquid and force the molecules closer together which should increase the cooling capacity of the water. It would obviously be for really extreme systems and one would pretty much have to have 7/16" ID 5/8"OD tubing with worb drive gears on every barb but, wouldn't this do essentially the same thing as using accelerators except through the whole loop. I'm calling out the uber liquid nerds amongst us to help my thought process here.

This came up from looking at some TEC and chilled liquid threads over at XS but, I'm not activated to get to post there yet. There are a few guys over there really squeezing ever last drop out of their systems but, haven't read anything about this. It occured to me as I was ordering a new radiator cap for my olds, i remembered that those cooling systems are designed to run under 16psi nominal at sea level. I've personally used the rag and duct tape method before and those 16psi do a lot.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Pressurizing the liquid would definately creat a greater strain on the system but, i would also lower the freezing temperature of the liquid and force the molecules closer together which should increase the cooling capacity of the water. It would obviously be for really extreme systems and one would pretty much have to have 7/16" ID 5/8"OD tubing with worb drive gears on every barb but, wouldn't this do essentially the same thing as using accelerators except through the whole loop. I'm calling out the uber liquid nerds amongst us to help my thought process here.

This came up from looking at some TEC and chilled liquid threads over at XS but, I'm not activated to get to post there yet. There are a few guys over there really squeezing ever last drop out of their systems but, haven't read anything about this. It occured to me as I was ordering a new radiator cap for my olds, i remembered that those cooling systems are designed to run under 16psi nominal at sea level. I've personally used the rag and duct tape method before and those 16psi do a lot.

dont know how it would play out.

i do know that usually when pressure is in the system it means galavanic corrosion. So you would lose one end

Also the tubing is porus, meaning it bleeds water over time. By having pressure, you would lose the internal pressure over time.

Now if you mean headpressure, my iwaki rd-30 has 30ft head. Which translates to a lot of pressure so im using your theory already.

PS. im one of those dorks on XS in TEC section drafting plans for a POST RAD chiller. My name is NaeKuh on XS. Yeah i know im a nerd when it comes to computer stuff.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12
Pressurizing the liquid would definately creat a greater strain on the system but, i would also lower the freezing temperature of the liquid and force the molecules closer together which should increase the cooling capacity of the water. It would obviously be for really extreme systems and one would pretty much have to have 7/16" ID 5/8"OD tubing with worb drive gears on every barb but, wouldn't this do essentially the same thing as using accelerators except through the whole loop. I'm calling out the uber liquid nerds amongst us to help my thought process here.

This came up from looking at some TEC and chilled liquid threads over at XS but, I'm not activated to get to post there yet. There are a few guys over there really squeezing ever last drop out of their systems but, haven't read anything about this. It occured to me as I was ordering a new radiator cap for my olds, i remembered that those cooling systems are designed to run under 16psi nominal at sea level. I've personally used the rag and duct tape method before and those 16psi do a lot.

dont know how it would play out.

i do know that usually when pressure is in the system it means galavanic corrosion. So you would lose one end

Also the tubing is porus, meaning it bleeds water over time. By having pressure, you would lose the internal pressure over time.

Now if you mean headpressure, my iwaki rd-30 has 30ft head. Which translates to a lot of pressure so im using your theory already.

PS. im one of those dorks on XS in TEC section drafting plans for a POST RAD chiller. My name is NaeKuh on XS. Yeah i know im a nerd when it comes to computer stuff.

I saw your cad drawing for the tripple tec post rad chiller there, i think martin posted them up. Actually I think you linked to it in another thread. I had a question about that. It looks like you're going to be using two of them with the TEC's sandwiched between and a seperate secondary loop to cool the hot side?

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

I saw your cad drawing for the tripple tec post rad chiller there, i think martin posted them up. Actually I think you linked to it in another thread. I had a question about that. It looks like you're going to be using two of them with the TEC's sandwiched between and a seperate secondary loop to cool the hot side?

correct.

the hotside will be cooled by a PA160 + EK-XRes + DDC-3.2


Were going to test to see how well it will work with 3 x 91W tecs.

the key to tec's is you want more of them with less voltage.


This not a sorry attempt like COOLIT to replace the radiator. This method is TERRIBLY inefficient. I am using a radiator to cool the liquid down as low as possible b4 it hits the TEC blocks.

The TEC blocks should reduce the overall heat load on my system by pulling the heat off the cold side and dumping them in the hot side.

This will do 1 of 2 thigns martin and i are curious on.

1. It will either reduce the temps of the water in my coolant.
2. It will maybe pull my coolant system tempory in the doorstep of sub ambient cooling.

Only testing will see what this will do. :T

 

[ChefJoe]

Liquids don't compress very much at all. There won't be any noticeable benefit as far as heat capacity. Also, for the most part pressurized liquids have a higher freezing point. You're welcome to look this up for yourself but I'm a chemistry grad student so I do know this.

The benefit to a pressurized radiator is that it'll raise the boiling point and give you a little more headroom.

 

[Jhhnn]

ChefJoe has it right- liquids are incompressible, one of the basic properties of physics, and automotive radiators are pressurized to raise the boiling point.

 

[Rubycon]

That will do nothing more than increase the risk for leaks.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

I saw your cad drawing for the tripple tec post rad chiller there, i think martin posted them up. Actually I think you linked to it in another thread. I had a question about that. It looks like you're going to be using two of them with the TEC's sandwiched between and a seperate secondary loop to cool the hot side?

correct.

the hotside will be cooled by a PA160 + EK-XRes + DDC-3.2


Were going to test to see how well it will work with 3 x 91W tecs.

the key to tec's is you want more of them with less voltage.


This not a sorry attempt like COOLIT to replace the radiator. This method is TERRIBLY inefficient. I am using a radiator to cool the liquid down as low as possible b4 it hits the TEC blocks.

The TEC blocks should reduce the overall heat load on my system by pulling the heat off the cold side and dumping them in the hot side.

This will do 1 of 2 thigns martin and i are curious on.

1. It will either reduce the temps of the water in my coolant.
2. It will maybe pull my coolant system tempory in the doorstep of sub ambient cooling.

Only testing will see what this will do. :T

How do you intend to test your set-up? Are you going to actually just test it in a system or are you going to hook your main cpu block up to anther TEC or hotplate to test it's total thermal load before building it into your system?

 

[Modelworks]

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
ChefJoe has it right- liquids are incompressible, one of the basic properties of physics, and automotive radiators are pressurized to raise the boiling point.

True, its the whole principle behind hydraulics.

Has anyone ever tried cooling the water by spraying it in an enclosed container where the spray would convert the water into a mist ?
I know they use that method to cool the water in nuclear power plants in the cooling towers. Wonder how it would work for pc's ?

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: Modelworks

Originally posted by: Jhhnn
ChefJoe has it right- liquids are incompressible, one of the basic properties of physics, and automotive radiators are pressurized to raise the boiling point.

True, its the whole principle behind hydraulics.

Has anyone ever tried cooling the water by spraying it in an enclosed container where the spray would convert the water into a mist ?
I know they use that method to cool the water in nuclear power plants in the cooling towers. Wonder how it would work for pc's ?

I don't know that it would have enough of a cooling effect cause it would tend to re-condense at room temperature and in order to flow the same ammount as some high-volume pumps like the mcp655, which is a good and common pump, at 317gph it would have to be substantially larger than most radiators capable of the same near ambient temperatures. I'm not saying it wouldn't work but, it may be impractical to do especially with the temperatures well below boiling.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

How do you intend to test your set-up? Are you going to actually just test it in a system or are you going to hook your main cpu block up to anther TEC or hotplate to test it's total thermal load before building it into your system?

dont underestimate the power of martin.

 

[imported_wired247]

as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: wired247
as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

i dont think he was talking about compressing the liquid.

He was talking about increasing the pressure of the system. You can easily add pressure by pumping air into a closed system.

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: wired247
as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

i dont think he was talking about compressing the liquid.

He was talking about increasing the pressure of the system. You can easily add pressure by pumping air into a closed system.

exactly what I was talking about. On a CPU only loop where the pressure matters, couldn't you suppliment some of the head pressure of the pump and increase the effectiveness of accelerators this way?

 

[imported_wired247]

pressurizing the air or the liquid in the system is rediculous, and has zero added benefit.

your car has a radiator cap to pressurize the system which increases boiling point of the coolant, and for no other reason that I'm aware of.


as stated, just increase flowrate or decrease the liquid temperature (I have seen several liquid cooling setups with the resevoir inside a small refrigerator) if you desire more efficiency

 

[ChefJoe]

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: wired247
as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

i dont think he was talking about compressing the liquid.

He was talking about increasing the pressure of the system. You can easily add pressure by pumping air into a closed system.

exactly what I was talking about. On a CPU only loop where the pressure matters, couldn't you suppliment some of the head pressure of the pump and increase the effectiveness of accelerators this way?

If the system is all connected in a loop then pressure will quickly equalize. The only way to supplement (by adding volumes of air or water) is to add to the loop at one point and remove from the loop at another (flow through). While it would be possible to add a little compressed air to pressurize the system it's not going to do anything for the cooling liquid and will just help leaks show up.

Pumps actually do put a forward "pressure" on the coolant... what you guys call head pressure. More pressure = faster flow = more circulation of the hot to the radiator.

 

[aigomorla]

Originally posted by: ChefJoe

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: wired247
as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

i dont think he was talking about compressing the liquid.

He was talking about increasing the pressure of the system. You can easily add pressure by pumping air into a closed system.

exactly what I was talking about. On a CPU only loop where the pressure matters, couldn't you suppliment some of the head pressure of the pump and increase the effectiveness of accelerators this way?

If the system is all connected in a loop then pressure will quickly equalize. The only way to supplement (by adding volumes of air or water) is to add to the loop at one point and remove from the loop at another (flow through). While it would be possible to add a little compressed air to pressurize the system it's not going to do anything for the cooling liquid and will just help leaks show up.

Pumps actually do put a forward "pressure" on the coolant... what you guys call head pressure. More pressure = faster flow = more circulation of the hot to the radiator.

heh which brings us back to my first post

 

[DerwenArtos12]

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: ChefJoe

Originally posted by: DerwenArtos12

Originally posted by: aigomorla

Originally posted by: wired247
as mentioned, liquids are generally incompressible to 99+% estimate.

if you are running near freezing temperatures, use some automotive antifreeze in your liquid mix. I believe some antifreeze lights up nicely under blacklight as well for a nice visual effect.

Either increase flowrate or decrease inlet temperature to optimize water cooling

i dont think he was talking about compressing the liquid.

He was talking about increasing the pressure of the system. You can easily add pressure by pumping air into a closed system.

exactly what I was talking about. On a CPU only loop where the pressure matters, couldn't you suppliment some of the head pressure of the pump and increase the effectiveness of accelerators this way?

If the system is all connected in a loop then pressure will quickly equalize. The only way to supplement (by adding volumes of air or water) is to add to the loop at one point and remove from the loop at another (flow through). While it would be possible to add a little compressed air to pressurize the system it's not going to do anything for the cooling liquid and will just help leaks show up.

Pumps actually do put a forward "pressure" on the coolant... what you guys call head pressure. More pressure = faster flow = more circulation of the hot to the radiator.

heh which brings us back to my first post

*shrug* I guess that means I'm either buying C2D or tearing into my AC to build a chiller.