President Trump Reportedly Wanted the U.S. to Leave NATO in 2018

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Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
73,286
6,351
126
Is there profiteering in nuclear war?
I remember hearing someone arguing against nuclear disarmorment because of the number of jobs that would be lost and the damage it would do to the economy. The cartoon above is no joke.
 

PJFrylar

Senior member
Apr 17, 2016
974
617
136
At some point we need to come to terms that it isn't through incompetency. He aligns with Russian interests and no one else's for it to be simple incompetence.

I think part of it is that he genuinely doesn't realize the consequences of his actions. When has he ever faced real consequences in his life? Businesses failing despite being handed significant amounts of money by his dad? Dad bails him out. Decides to stiff contractors for work done for him? They can't do anything because it isn't worth the lawsuit to them. Businesses fail when daddy is no longer around to save him? He golden parachutes to safety while investors take the losses. Commits fraud? Lawyers and a bit of money take care of that. Cheats on his wives? Lawyers and a bit of money take care of that too. Racially discriminates in housing practices? Well son of a bitch, lawyers and a bit of money can take care of that too. I could go on and on. He's a manchild who should have faced the consequences of his actions long ago.
 
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PlanetJosh

Golden Member
May 6, 2013
1,814
143
106
There has to be some progressive sentiment against American military expansion or presence in some countries. Like being against the Vietnam war including me. I know that was a long time ago. I guess these days I have to be careful which U.S. troops presence in Europe or anywhere I oppose in order to not be criticized by those who are left of center which includes me btw.
 
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yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
There is if you build the nukes.


Getting the US out of NATO or the UN is an old far-right nationalist meme. I used to drive by this one house on a busy street that had a 10 foot high sign in the front yard that said "Get the US out of the UN!" Yeah, his house got re-zoned and torn down last year for a commercial development. Maybe he shouldal've paid attention to what really mattered to him instead of paranoid conspiracies.
Makes me think of the ilk that kept the United States out of the League of Nations and then out of WW2 until the very last second. So much loss could've been avoided...
 
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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,993
13,519
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At an absolute minimum, Trump is a Russian ASSET doing his best that he can get away with to destabilize the USA and NATO.

And at an absolute minimum, the Republican Party and Trump voters are willing co-conspirators; willing to go along with everything Trump does because they think it'll hurt the "other" folks.

As Arthur Conan Doyle wrote by means of his alter-ego Sherlock Holmes over a century ago.. "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."

What I dont get is this : Trump is like 500 years old. He is in many aspects already dead from old age. What can he possibly hope to gain from fluffing Putin? The more I think about it ... its must be a hard on ... Trump must be gay for Vlad? Or just crave his approval like nothing else.
 
Mar 11, 2004
23,280
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Trump's position on NATO should have been well known, he talked about it a lot before he was elected.

How is it news today?

https://www.factcheck.org/2016/05/whats-trumps-position-on-nato/

Is this a serious question? Did you read your link? Because at the time he said that stuff, people tried to go "oh he wouldn't actually try to pull us out of NATO" and dispute that's what he was actually saying (hell he himself tried to walk it back and act like he'd force other countries out of it, but then he went back to saying that we should stop being part of it if they don't give him what he wants). Just like they said he wouldn't do a bunch of the other shit he's done that people tried to say was just the media being unfair to him when they showed how he operates and just based on shit he himself said. But we kept getting "but let's see how he'd be as President!" like he was going to change when it was something they couldn't defend.

Plus, he wasn't the fucking President at the time, so it carries a little bit different weight.

Hell according to your logic, why should we be concerned with his favoritism towards Russia, its not like he hasn't been clear about that the entire time. So we shouldn't report on it at all I guess? I really don't know what point you think you're making. Yes, his opinions with regards to NATO were known before he was elected, and it was for shit like that literally millions more Americans voted against him than for him. This is just reinforcing that he really is so stupid as to try to pull the shenanigans that he was just pulling out of his ass while campaigning.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,136
30,085
146
There is if you build the nukes.


Getting the US out of NATO or the UN is an old far-right nationalist meme. I used to drive by this one house on a busy street that had a 10 foot high sign in the front yard that said "Get the US out of the UN!" Yeah, his house got re-zoned and torn down last year for a commercial development. Maybe he shouldal've paid attention to what really mattered to him instead of paranoid conspiracies.

Are you saying that the UN didn't take away his house? Prove it! ahahahaha, suck it, lib!
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,136
30,085
146
Yeah, maybe we can just vote for Putin next time.

60 million Americans already did, though. And don't pretend that Trump's blatant subservience to Putin wasn't known prior to the election. It was thoroughly documented. The only chance that this country has going forward is that the idiots that were conned into voting for this chump, recognize and accept their mistake, and move on. Denying the obviously wrong thing that they did is just going to perpetuate the nonsense. Of course, there are those that know full well what they were doing and did it anyway, because reasons. These people are traitors.
 
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cytg111

Lifer
Mar 17, 2008
23,993
13,519
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Working class, non educated middleaged white men... who has a life expectency of...was it 55 in Putins Russia? Yea I can see why this US segment has a hardon for the Vlad model...
 

dainthomas

Lifer
Dec 7, 2004
14,635
3,509
136
Makes me think of the ilk that kept the United States out of the League of Nations and then out of WW2 until the very last second. So much loss could've been avoided...

Yep. If American troops had gone to France in April 1940 before Germany invaded it could have been shortened by years. Actually WWI would have been much shorter too if we hadn't waited.

Unfortunately DOTUS has never cracked a history book, so is completely unaware that American troops in Europe saves lives (and money) in the long run. Not to mention the real possibility of widespread war in Europe going nuclear.
 

HomerJS

Lifer
Feb 6, 2002
36,734
28,908
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Yep. If American troops had gone to France in April 1940 before Germany invaded it could have been shortened by years. Actually WWI would have been much shorter too if we hadn't waited.

Unfortunately DOTUS has never cracked a history book, so is completely unaware that American troops in Europe saves lives (and money) in the long run. Not to mention the real possibility of widespread war in Europe going nuclear.
He also doesn't know NATO came to our aid after 9/11 per Article 5. 1st time in NATO's history
 

interchange

Diamond Member
Oct 10, 1999
8,022
2,872
136
Mattis has virtually said as much about this, making specific point of how he tried to impress upon Trump the critical importance of NATO.

Here's an interesting tidbit:https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news...ggests-montenegro-could-cause-world-war-three

That is straight-up Russian fabricated propaganda that made it to his brain enough to work it's way into active politics. Montenegro joined NATO in 2017. Remember the guy Trump pushed out of the way to get to the front of the NATO summit? That was Montenegro's PM.

If a Russian plant has Trump's ear, it seems gossip about NATO not meeting their commitments forcing the US into a bad deal and trying to admit as member nation the next spark of WW3 would be quite effective. Now, that's conspirational thinking I admit. But if this isn't how Trump got these insane ideas, that still leaves us explaining insanity somehow.
 

zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,136
30,085
146
Mattis has virtually said as much about this, making specific point of how he tried to impress upon Trump the critical importance of NATO.

Here's an interesting tidbit:https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news...ggests-montenegro-could-cause-world-war-three

That is straight-up Russian fabricated propaganda that made it to his brain enough to work it's way into active politics. Montenegro joined NATO in 2017. Remember the guy Trump pushed out of the way to get to the front of the NATO summit? That was Montenegro's PM.

If a Russian plant has Trump's ear, it seems gossip about NATO not meeting their commitments forcing the US into a bad deal and trying to admit as member nation the next spark of WW3 would be quite effective. Now, that's conspirational thinking I admit. But if this isn't how Trump got these insane ideas, that still leaves us explaining insanity somehow.

And we all know the retard doesn't (apparently can't) read. So someone with nefarious intent is feeding him this grossly anti-democratic, anti-world messaging.
 

Thump553

Lifer
Jun 2, 2000
12,757
2,533
126
Outside of dissolving the USA I can't think of anything that Putin would want more than for the US to pull out of NATO.

BTW a majority of the GOP Senators voted yesterday against reimposing the sanction Trump lifted. That is a sanction that two years ago nearly every senator voted for. It's pretty clear they are circling the wagons to protect Trump's ego.

Things are going to get a lot darker for the USA in the near term future. It's amazing how the USA is declining-ALL of our own volition.
 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,577
432
126
Yep. If American troops had gone to France in April 1940 before Germany invaded it could have been shortened by years. Actually WWI would have been much shorter too if we hadn't waited.

Unfortunately DOTUS has never cracked a history book, so is completely unaware that American troops in Europe saves lives (and money) in the long run. Not to mention the real possibility of widespread war in Europe going nuclear.
Even better, if the U.S. has been part of the League Of Nations and lent their muscle - even if as just potential muscle - Hitler might never have started the rounds of invasions, as knowing the U.S. coming in against Germany would be enough to guarantee defeat.

I think a lot of folks don't get how much war and misery the United Nations have prevented. It's far from perfect but it's so, so much better than nothing.
 
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zinfamous

No Lifer
Jul 12, 2006
111,136
30,085
146
Even better, if the U.S. has been part of the League Of Nations and lent their muscle - even if as just potential muscle - Hitler might never have started the rounds of invasions, as knowing the U.S. coming in against Germany would be enough to guarantee defeat.

I think a lot of folks don't get how much war and misery the United Nations have prevented. It's far from imperfect but it's so, so much better than nothing.

People can't appreciate what they can't see. Further, they can't appreciate what they don't know: The perception of the UN in Europe and other parts of the world, where war devastated precedding generations, every 10 or so years, on and on and on and on and on for generations upon generations, actually understand how monumentally successful and necessary the UN is.

Americans are simply ignorant and, for the most part, just too fucking willfully stupid to get it. And even if "they don't care if them people kill theyselves way over there!" well, all of that war has always effected us, as well. Avoiding war is beneficial for everyone. War is only beneficial for the handful of oligarchs that thrive off of misery to stoke their fortunes. You can pretty much define such ratfucker anti-humans as anyone that wants to end the UN. anyone.