President Bush supports parent's right to kill their children?

[TheBDB]

I was reading the CNN article here about President Bush signing the partial-birth abortion ban. During the event he said

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Seems to me this means he supports a parent's right to kill their children or let them live. After all, the creator(s) of life are the parents.

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: TheBDB
I was reading the CNN article here about President Bush signing the partial-birth abortion ban. During the event he said

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Seems to me this means he supports a parent's right to kill their children or let them live. After all, the creator(s) of life are the parents.

Pssstt Think he means The Creator

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Nice try at some spin- but you forgot to consider that God is the creator that Bush was talking about

CkG

 

[CaptnKirk]

In his opinion.
Some believe in Allah

Same guy, different denomination.

 

[TheBDB]

When I took biology in high school and we learned about reproduction, they never mentioned anything about a "Creator." Damn public schools....

 

[Fencer128]

I'll go with the facts.

Cheers,

Andy

 

[Witling]

TheBDB. They might not have mentioned the creator, but wasn't the procreator in there somewhere.

I'll be starting a new thread. To generalize, it's always irritated me that "conservative Republicans" think the death penalty is OK but abortion is not. "Liberal Democrats" think that abortion is OK but capital punishment is not.

Think about it.

 

[tallest1]

Originally posted by: Whitling
TheBDB. They might not have mentioned the creator, but wasn't the procreator in there somewhere.

I'll be starting a new thread. To generalize, it's always irritated me that "conservative Republicans" think the death penalty is OK but abortion is not. "Liberal Democrats" think that abortion is OK but capital punishment is not.

Think about it.

Exactly! So if we're both being the hyporites, why get God involved?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: TheBDB
I was reading the CNN article here about President Bush signing the partial-birth abortion ban. During the event he said

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Seems to me this means he supports a parent's right to kill their children or let them live. After all, the creator(s) of life are the parents.

Sounds like he means gov't doesn't have the right to KILL PEOPLE (AKA 'Capital Punishment') because in his view, only God has that right. I wonder how Bush ratifies that belief with his track record of executions in TX?

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: TheBDB
I was reading the CNN article here about President Bush signing the partial-birth abortion ban. During the event he said

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Seems to me this means he supports a parent's right to kill their children or let them live. After all, the creator(s) of life are the parents.

Sounds like he means gov't doesn't have the right to KILL PEOPLE (AKA 'Capital Punishment') because in his view, only God has that right. I wonder how Bush ratifies that belief with his track record of executions in TX?

 

[CaptnKirk]

God told Bush to . . .
Kill 'em all !

 

[mastertech01]

Maybe he just chose not to interfere with the decision made by a lawful court and appointed jury. By not overturning the decision to execute a murderer he made no decision to kill or not to kill. The Governor cannot execute or order the execution of anyone. He can only intercede and prevent what the justice system had decided was appropriate.

Would he not have to provide justification to do so?

The unborn have not been convicted of any crime nor legally ordered to be executed by the justice system.

However some abortions are necessary to save the life of the mother. There is no complaint from most people on that.

 

[Sternfan]

Originally posted by: mastertech01
Maybe he just chose not to interfere with the decision made by a lawful court and appointed jury. By not overturning the decision to execute a murderer he made no decision to kill or not to kill. The Governor cannot execute or order the execution of anyone. He can only intercede and prevent what the justice system had decided was appropriate.

Would he not have to provide justification to do so?

The unborn have not been convicted of any crime nor legally ordered to be executed by the justice system.

However some abortions are necessary to save the life of the mother. There is no complaint from most people on that.

Dude come on common sense has no place here. Your post is dead on I could not have said it better. Of course you will most likely be flamed by the freaks. Good day sir, I said good day

 

[DealMonkey]

Originally posted by: mastertech01
Maybe he just chose not to interfere with the decision made by a lawful court and appointed jury. By not overturning the decision to execute a murderer he made no decision to kill or not to kill. The Governor cannot execute or order the execution of anyone. He can only intercede and prevent what the justice system had decided was appropriate.

As governor, the buck stops with him so to speak. By NOT intervening and stopping an execution when he clearly has the power do so, means that he has acquiesced in the killing of the prisoner in question. Which clearly contradicts his stated position.

The unborn have not been convicted of any crime nor legally ordered to be executed by the justice system.

The unborn have no rights, as they are not full citizens of the United States, therefore they are not subject to our justice system.

However some abortions are necessary to save the life of the mother. There is no complaint from most people on that.

None here.

 

[DealMonkey]

dp

 

[mastertech01]

I guess then you can say when a killer gets life imprisonment then the govorner has acquiesced in giving that person life as well. It was still the decision of the jury/judge to dispense with the guilty person in the manner applied. How many governors overturn death penalties with high regularity? Is a governor of a state where death penalty is seldom used or never used more innocent than a governor who is faced with that decision on a highly regular basis?


Animals are not citizens of the USA nor are they even human beings, yet they recieve full protection of the law. How much more important are the unborn children of the world than wild animals?

 

[Gonad the Barbarian]

It was still the decision of the jury/judge to dispense with the guilty person in the manner applied.

According to Bush's statement the judge/jury has not the right to make that decision either.

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Try all you want, but there is absolutely no way to reconcile that statement with his stance on capital punishment.

 

[mastertech01]

Originally posted by: Gonad the Barbarian

It was still the decision of the jury/judge to dispense with the guilty person in the manner applied.

According to Bush's statement the judge/jury has not the right to make that decision either.

"This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government, because it does not come from government -- it comes from the creator of life,"

Try all you want, but there is absolutely no way to reconcile that statement with his stance on capital punishment.

I don't wish to reconcile anyones statement. Im simply trying to convey the difference between preventing life from starting and preventing life from ending. You can choose to see them both the same if you wish.

 

[railer]

..but "liberal Democrats" (whoever they are) aren't really opposed to the death penaltly for moral reasons, as much as they feel that there are too many problems with it.

i.e. it's very expensive to kill someone
mistakes are sometimes made, wherein inoocent people are put to death.

Conservatives tend to oppose abortion more because of "god" (whoever that is), as they tend to be the Bible thumpers who don't think for themselves very well.

 

[maluckey]

..but "liberal Democrats" (whoever they are) aren't really opposed to the death penaltly for moral reasons, as much as they feel that there are too many problems with it.

I think tha the identity of the Liberal Democrat has been revealed..............

it's very expensive to kill someone

mistakes are sometimes made, wherein inoocent people are put to death.

Apparently the cost of supporting someone forever, though they are too dangerous, and have committed such a horrific act so that they can never be released, costs less than a lethal injection and a witness? Apparently, the jury has nothing to do with this conviction, and the people on the jury are idiots.

Conservatives tend to oppose abortion more because of "god" (whoever that is), as they tend to be the Bible thumpers who don't think for themselves very well.

As far as I can tell from this post, anyone that has religious convictions is a moron and a conservative, since the words are used interchangeably. Some of the greatest thinkers and leaders in history were deeply religious. Einstein, Jefferson, Washington, Ghandi, and the list goes on.

It is a shame, that so many of the small Liberals out there, gravitate to the once great Democratic Party. It is one of the reasons I left that party, and now vote for whoever can do the job, regardless of my feelings for them.

 

[Vadatajs]

Originally posted by: Whitling
TheBDB. They might not have mentioned the creator, but wasn't the procreator in there somewhere.

I'll be starting a new thread. To generalize, it's always irritated me that "conservative Republicans" think the death penalty is OK but abortion is not. "Liberal Democrats" think that abortion is OK but capital punishment is not.

Think about it.

The fetus is completely dependent on the mother for survival, ie, if it is removed from the womb, it is unable to survive without life support. That is the difference. Think of the circus in florida right now. You've got the brother of the governor who sent pretty much the most people to death in his state ever, trying to save a brain-dead woman, who cannot survive off life support. The convicted criminal sent to die does not depend on "life support", like the womb, or a feeding tube.

That said, both sides draw too much on religious/moral issues. The government should pretty much stay out of it; freedom of religion means freedom from religion.

 

[railer]

<rolls eyes>......maluckey....people <like you> who think in terms of "liberal democrats" are the same people I shake my head at. If it helps you to put people in safe little boxes with labels then fine, you do that. And I will laugh. I'm neither liberal or conservative, and I plan to stay that way.

Do a google search on the cost of the death penalty vs life in prison. What country do you live in, where the cost of the death penalty is the cost of a witness and an injection? That'd be like $20. Unfortunately, the figures that I've seen are closer to $2 million for a death penalty case. Now should it be that much? Of course not, but it is no cheaper to kill someone than it is to put them in prison for the rest of their lives...unfortunately. Anyway, I really don't have a problem at all with people getting fried. I was mearly pointing out that these "liberal democrats" <WHOEVER THEY ARE> (get it, get it???? what does a liberal democrat look like? do they have tentacles and green skin?)

don't invoke the name of GOD when it comes to the death penalty. But the jesus freaks DO invoke the name of god when they are trying to impose their will on people over the issue of abortion. THat's the only point I was making...you seem to have missed it. And yes I think a great many people who are very religious are also simpletons. Not all, mind you, but many. I find Bin Laden to be a simpleton. George Bush too. Just a couple of examples....

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: mastertech01
I guess then you can say when a killer gets life imprisonment then the govorner has acquiesced in giving that person life as well. It was still the decision of the jury/judge to dispense with the guilty person in the manner applied. How many governors overturn death penalties with high regularity? Is a governor of a state where death penalty is seldom used or never used more innocent than a governor who is faced with that decision on a highly regular basis?


Animals are not citizens of the USA nor are they even human beings, yet they recieve full protection of the law. How much more important are the unborn children of the world than wild animals?

Good post. Although I am pro abortion to a certain degree (Everyone is entitled to one mistake, but it should not be used as birth control). There is no excuse for partial birth abortions or late stage abortions only to save the mothers life.

I like at the whole capital punishment issue like this...
A fetus has not commited nary a sin or crime. The only bad thing that he/she has done is come to be in a woman who does not want them or does not have the brain cells or intellgence to know how to put on a condom.

A convicted death row inmate has stolen someone else life and in doing so voluntarily choose to have the state take theirs in trade.

How is it hypocritical to punish the wicked and spare the innocent?

 

[Red Dawn]

There is no excuse for partial birth abortions or late stage abortions only to save the mothers life.

Why not? I find this rather ironic considering that you will never be at risk due to a health issue regarding a pregnancy

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: Red Dawn

There is no excuse for partial birth abortions or late stage abortions only to save the mothers life.

Why not? I find this rather ironic considering that you will never be at risk due to a health issue regarding a pregnancy

Not even for severe cases of hydrocephalus in which the baby skull fills with fluid sometimes making the head too large for the birth canal, ectopic pregnancies, or when the mother has some "weird" shaped anatomy that could put her life at risk?