pre-emptive questions

[rusted embrace]

Hey all, been lurking / reading for a few weeks now.
I'm considering building myself a new comp, as many other people have as well. Instead of a "which parts" thread, perhaps you all could shine some light on some topics for me...
1) Is building a comp. something anyone can do? I'm decent with the things (I guess), like fixing my sister's dell when she breaks it, keeping mine up to date, fixing whatever minor issues I've had, etc. I've read UsAndThem's parts thread as well as mechBgon's building guide several times each. As far as basic assembly goes, is this a "rookie friendly" project?
2) After construction, what all does it really take to get the thing working? I'm under the impression that there are disks provided with the mobo to get the BIOS set up properly? I haven't found anything online that I liked as far as setting stuff like that up.
3) In regard to windows, would my dell windows reinstallation disk work for a new project, or would I have to buy another copy? Also, if it does work, is that some kind of terms of usage?
4) I've read some things claiming that an "old" hard drive (by old I mean already in my computer now, circa 2001?) won't work in a new system. Is this true? I'd really like to use my existing hard drive and buy a second. (win xp sp 2 installed on it)
5) I've read many threads about the importance of a good case and power supply. If I go through with this, I will buy a better PSU than the case's. My question here is if it's absolutely necessary to spend ~80ish dollars on one. I see ones on sale at NewEgg from good companies for ~$40 with all good reviews quite a bit. I have no intentions of doing serious work or mods to the computer...could I get away with one of these "cheaper" PSUs?
6) Would I just be better off spending the extra money (yuck) and get a dell? The build I'm toying with on paper is almost 500 dollars cheaper than at dell.

I guess I'll leave it at that for now. Any help is much appreciated and for what it's worth I don't want to be one of those "in and out" type posters. Thanks much. --R.E.--

 

[knothead34]

ill comment on question 5. dont go by reviews you see on newegg. lots of people here can recommend good psu. going cheap on psu isent a good idea. but how much power you need is depending on what your wanting to build. i would say motherboard and psu are two of the most important pieces of hardware for a computer they both affect stability and performance things not to be taken lightly. lets see the build your toying with on paper. maybe we can make some suggestions.

 

[Umberger]

Welcome to AnandTech. I don't pretend to know everything, but here are my thoughts:
1) If you are relatively familiar with computer hardware, and you read the directions and follow them, and are careful then there is relatively little to mess up. 99% of plugs will only fit in one place, one way.
2) After construction, you should be able to hit the power button and have the computer start up and get into the BIOS. You can then set up which device/drive you want to boot from, and then install windows. One possible problem is that you have to make a driver diskette using another computer if you have a Serial ATA hard drive. (everything else should work right away) - the CD that comes with your motherboard will have the necessary utility to make such a disk, all you need is a floppy.
3) your dell reinstall cd will probably not work. mine wouldn't last I tried. you will have to get a copy of windows. are you a college student by any chance? most colleges have licenses and copies of windows that their students can use.
4) your "old" hard drive will work just fine. it is probably IDE, which is still a very prevalent standard, and will be supported by virtually any motherboard.
5) i'll let yoyo and the others take this one.
6) don't get a dell, dude.

hope this helps.

 

[bluedeviltron]

I'm building a computer, too. Keep this thread bumped, because I'd like to know all the answers to these questions as well.

 

[Umberger]

Oh, one other thing I thought of. If you decide to build a computer, and during your construction, you have any questions about installing parts properly, come to the forums and ask. I will almost guarantee you will have an answer within 15 minutes. There are always people here that are glad to answer questions. (I assume you'll be back with more specific questions before then, just thought i'd mention that.)

 

[CheesePoofs]

Welcome to the forums!!

1) As long as you understand the basic principles of how a computer, like what each component is and what its general use and purpose is, you should be able to build it. For me, the hardest part about building the computer has been hooking up the USB and firewire ports on the front of my case, because my case gives them to you as individual wires and not a brick.
2) On most motherboards, all you need to do is load optimized defaults in the bios, maybe adjust a few easy settings, and then you'll be able to run it fine. There are no disks for setting up the bios; you just load optimized defaults and then turn off all the features you don't need (such as RAID, onboard sound, etc).
3) Your dell windows won't work with a comp you build. Dell leaves a tag in their bios that says that the computer is a dell, and unless the dell windows setup program finds that tag, it wont' install windows.
4) You can use old hard drives as long as they use a standard used today and aren't dead.
5) You can get away with a cheap PSU and case, but it isn't recomended. My suggestion would be to spend around 80-100 for an Antec case that comes bundled with a TruePower2 power supply. Antec makes nice cases and nice power supplies.
6) I personally would always prefer to build a computer. You can normally save money, plus you can get an Athlon 64 system, which you can't get from dell or most other OEM's. Even if you dont' save money, you get to pick exactly what goes into your system, and you get to build it (which I find fun).

 

[rusted embrace]

Thats a good call on getting an OS from my school. I'm DLing the .iso right now for XP Pro.

And back to the power supply issue...could some one please take a second to explain why something like This Antec is so much better than This Thermaltake?? I understand there's an issue about true power rating vs. what's listed...but I just need some clarification to justify the extra 40 dollars. The thermaltakes got over 200 reviews and four stars...so what is the realistic / noticeable / pertinent difference here (besides the 10 watt difference of course)?

I like the idea of getting a package deal on case/psu, but even the antec reviews say they replaced the stock ones. Any recommendations there, say, in the 100 dollar range?

 

[CheesePoofs]

Basically, what really matters with a power supply is the number of amps on the 12v rail, not the watts. The Antec you linked to has 26a on the 12v rail, while the thermaltake only has 18. Also, Antec uses higher quality parts in their power supplies than Thermaltake does.

 

[Twsmit]

1.) It is something anyone can do, as long as they have knowledge of computers and read up on their homework. The only tools required are two hands and a phillips screwdriver.

2.) It takes installing an OS, drivers and thats it. (if you set everything up correctly) If there is a heardware level issue, like for instance something is faulty or you put something in backwards there may be alot of trouble shooting and begging on these forums for help. But if everything is setup, the computer boots, you insert the Windows install CD and go from there.

3.) Your dell will probably not work. The Disk is formatted to install only on a dell computer. (its probably also illegal to try to install it on anything but a dell) You can pick up an OEM copy of XP Home for under $100 at newegg.

4.) your harddrive is probably an older ATA100 IDE drive. That means it used the old school cabling with 80 pins. It will work fine, all current motherboards still ship with IDE ports. Just try and get a mobo that has two IDE ports, one for your HDD's and one for the DVD/CD.

5.) Powersupply is very important, you can for sure get good $40 PSU's. But what people recommend is to get an Antec or Enermax etc... Dont get some $40 550watt PSU by "Ubercooling PSU Company" etc... lol There are good brand name PSU's for cheap, but they are 300-400 watts without all the bells and whistles. (most are probably not ATX 2.0 though) just stay away from the flashy cheapo PSU's that claim to do everything.

6.) Dell's are fine computers for certain people, with some rebates/sales you can get them very price competitive, though I would never want to own one again, since i build my own desktops.

 

[rusted embrace]

Yeah, I see your point. Looking at the specs more closely, I'm beginning to understand where the costs are coming from. And I guess I should get the "cut corners" mentality out of my head. I always tell people "buy it nice or buy it twice" so perhaps I should actually listen for once ha.

Another random question is this...is there any real reason notto use 2x1 gig Ram? I know it's considered overkill, but one day it won't be, I'd imagine. Any guesses as to how soon that will be? I'll probably go 1 gig but it's an interesting idea for 2. I don't do a ton of gaming but I'd like to pick up some of the newer ones. Maybe upgrade to 2 gig when the price drops.

Thanks for the help all.

 

[Umberger]

Originally posted by: rusted embrace
Yeah, I see your point. Looking at the specs more closely, I'm beginning to understand where the costs are coming from. And I guess I should get the "cut corners" mentality out of my head. I always tell people "buy it nice or buy it twice" so perhaps I should actually listen for once ha.

Another random question is this...is there any real reason notto use 2x1 gig Ram? I know it's considered overkill, but one day it won't be, I'd imagine. Any guesses as to how soon that will be? I'll probably go 1 gig but it's an interesting idea for 2. I don't do a ton of gaming but I'd like to pick up some of the newer ones. Maybe upgrade to 2 gig when the price drops.

Thanks for the help all.

RAM is not one of those things that has its price change very much. I bought 2 gigs of Corsair Value Select from Newegg.com, and i'm pleased as pie. I had the same thought in my head that it might be a little overkill now, but eventually, it would come in handy. I have already found that I use more than a gig of ram quite routinely, when I actually think to look. I'd say go for it.

 

[CheesePoofs]

Originally posted by: rusted embrace
Yeah, I see your point. Looking at the specs more closely, I'm beginning to understand where the costs are coming from. And I guess I should get the "cut corners" mentality out of my head. I always tell people "buy it nice or buy it twice" so perhaps I should actually listen for once ha.

Another random question is this...is there any real reason notto use 2x1 gig Ram? I know it's considered overkill, but one day it won't be, I'd imagine. Any guesses as to how soon that will be? I'll probably go 1 gig but it's an interesting idea for 2. I don't do a ton of gaming but I'd like to pick up some of the newer ones. Maybe upgrade to 2 gig when the price drops.

Thanks for the help all.

The reason not to buy two gigs is that 1gb sticks of ram have higher latencies than 512mb sticks. If your playing games, 1gb is fine for now, I don't knwo of any games that require more. However, it is not recommended to run four sticks of ram unless you have a Venice core Athlon 64 (assuming your are getting an Athlon 64, which you should). Assuming you get a venice core A64, I'd recomend getting 2x512mb sticks for now, and getting another 2x512 sticks in maybe a year when they are needed and the price has dropped.

 

[shoRunner]

unless your getting an SLI rig you can easily spend less that $60 and get a good powersupply. xclio is a good buy $53 for their 450 or sparkle/fsp have alot of good cheaper PSU. that thermaltake would also be fine for a system without pci-e.

often times the dell disk will work...but it depends on how lucky you get. i've got a few that will work on any computer. it still is illegal though...:roll:

 

[The Boston Dangler]

Welcome!
Once you roll your own, you'll never go back. It's that much better, if done well. You have some comp experience, and this is a great place for advice. No shortage of experts here!

I'm assuming a modest budget and light gaming with general use. My expert advice, in general:

SATA is your friend. It's native on any new mobo. When you want to get a new drive, look for that connector. Maybe a year or 2, a new drive will be due.
You can get a decent Antec case (or similar) with a good PS for about $100. That $100 should last the life of the computer.
An Athlon64 Venice 3000 goes for 150 bucks. This is a sweet spot.
1 GB of RAM is plenty.
A 6600GT vid card will last you a while too.

 

[rusted embrace]

alright one more question instead of starting a new thread. Theres the 3000+ winchester for approx. $150, and theres the 3200+ for approx $200. I'm running a P4 1.8 right now, which I'm satisfied with, so either of these will be diesel to me. The question is, all things considered with future proofing and what not...will the 3200 really be worth the extra 50 bucks? I'm thinking no, and I'd rather spend that money stepping up the case / psu. I have no current plans of overclocking...although it is intriguing. In this same vein, would Venice be a better choice? I know it's the better core, but I'm not about spending cash on very slight increases and winning points with the uber crowd.

 

[Twsmit]

the 3200+ is attractive because of the 10x multiplier. It has more Oc headroom.

 

[CheesePoofs]

IMO, the 3200 isn't worth the extra cash. Especially if you're gaming on your computer, spend the saved money on a graphics card.

If you can find a venice core for within 10 dollars of the winchester, I'd get it. It not only is better at overclocking, but it also supports SSE3 (not very important) and it can run 4 sticks of ram at the same speed as 2 sticks (somewhat important, because it means you can get 2x512 sticks now and then get another 2x512 sticks in a year without any performance loss)