Yeah, he doesn't need to 'end' democracy, when he can very easily (continue to) bend it to the point where it becomes an irrelevant pantomime. The system itself lends itself to that, as it was never intended to be a democracy in the first place - it was always supposed to be a wealth-and-race-based oligarchy. The only thing that's averted that till now has been various forms of struggles that occured external to that system.
Yeah, he doesn't need to 'end' democracy, when he can very easily (continue to) bend it to the point where it becomes an irrelevant pantomime. The system itself lends itself to that, as it was never intended to be a democracy in the first place - it was always supposed to be a wealth-and-race-based oligarchy. The only thing that's averted that till now has been various forms of struggles that occured external to that system.
This, 100%.
Russia still has elections. Hungary still has elections. Neither are democracies. When people say we aren't going to have elections in the future they don't mean we aren't going to have them at all, they mean we won't have free and fair ones.
Not recognizing the needs of the rural voters and middle class workers (maybe across the board tax cut that would help everyone instead of just those with kids or first time home buyers)? Overemphasis on identity politics/gender issues? Horrible messaging? Failure to control immigration? One can deny all day, or say it is the media's fault, or the electorate is stupid and evil, or whatever makes you feel better. I mean, hell, it used to be the Democratic "Farmer" "Labor" party. They have obviously lost the rural vote, and couldn't even get labor endorsement this election. I have said for a long time, and received a lot of hate for it on this forum, but I have said numerous times and for months, probably years, that the Dems have lost contact with the middle class. Well, I rest my case.
Indus
Lifer
- May 11, 2002
- 12,914
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But that's not true? Democrats made huge investments in rural/middle class workers.
But Republicans are the party that runs on almost nothing but identity politics, not the Democrats.
Just look at the 2024 commercials! Harris' were all about shared prosperity, Trump's were all about identity politics. (trans people/Mexicans/whoever are bad)
But Republicans were the ones who voted against controlling immigration, not Democrats? Seems odd to blame Democrats for Republicans refusing to secure the border, no?
Also, why does 'the heartland' care about immigration so much? For most of it they have a very low percentage of foreign born.
Meh, I'm uninterested in the feels or whatever. Let's just stick to the facts!
Ironically I think the real answer here is that despite the Republicans doing all the things you said cost the Democrats, in the end it's that a lot of voters actually LOVE identity politics. They just like identity politics that cater to them.
Democrats: 'let's expand child tax credits to help working families with kids'
Trump: 'I'm going to cause massive inflation to cut taxes for billionaires and corporations'
wHY woNt DeMocrAtS ReCogNize tHe NeEds oF tHe MidDle cLasS?
Trump: 'I'm going to cause massive inflation to cut taxes for billionaires and corporations'
wHY woNt DeMocrAtS ReCogNize tHe NeEds oF tHe MidDle cLasS?
And did you know that about half of the households in the US dont have children? How about some sort of tax break for them? As for the first time homebuyer credit, well, its great if you qualify. That said, people that own their homes, and those that cant qualify are hurting too from inflation and high prices; how about helping them.
dainthomas
Lifer
- Dec 7, 2004
- 14,687
- 3,573
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If we can't help everyone equally and all at the same time, then we should help no one. Great, thanks.
BTW Harris also had a plan to make it easier to build more housing nationwide. So attacking the problem from multiple directions.
JD50
Lifer
- Sep 4, 2005
- 11,807
- 2,515
- 136
So Kamala had plenty of plans to help the middle class, you just didn't like them. It's weird that you're dying on this hill when you are objectively wrong.
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
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MrSquished
Lifer
- Jan 14, 2013
- 23,673
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- 136
cytg111
Lifer
- Mar 17, 2008
- 24,365
- 13,848
- 136
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
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Meh, he did a great interview with Bernie. Much fairer than MSNBC trotting Chris Matthews out to say Bernie would have him executed if he became president when they were freaking out about him leading early in the 2020 primaries.
MrSquished
Lifer
- Jan 14, 2013
- 23,673
- 21,886
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Right now I am leaning Newsom, after my own candidacy. He has balls and he can talk the straightest talk of any of the current nationally platformed Dem potentials. He knows how to fight, like with his proposed EV credit excluding Tesla if the federal tax credit gets rescinded. That is the kind of fight we need.
I think Dems should run more unapologetically on their progressive chops. And I think he can do that. Everyone has baggage, he'll be fine.
But four years is an eternity.
I think Dems should run more unapologetically on their progressive chops. And I think he can do that. Everyone has baggage, he'll be fine.
But four years is an eternity.
cytg111
Lifer
- Mar 17, 2008
- 24,365
- 13,848
- 136
This is Rogan in a nutshell
17.337 Aufrufe · 907 Reaktionen | DR MIKE VS DR IDZ ON SEED OILS!! 😱❌💀 #weightloss #fatloss #nutrition #fitness #doctor #health | Dr Idz
DR MIKE VS DR IDZ ON SEED OILS!! 😱❌💀 #weightloss #fatloss #nutrition #fitness #doctor #health.
www.facebook.com
"Experts say" ...
Of course, broken clock twice a day and all that...
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
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You and I both know they'll run to the right just like Harris did and then wonder why they lost to the worst candidate ever a third time.
Serious question. Harris lost to the candidate who was viewed by voters as more conservative. You think the likely victory is to move left?
MrSquished
Lifer
- Jan 14, 2013
- 23,673
- 21,886
- 136
Yes I think it's time for the Democrats to embrace their actual progressive values. This doesn't mean they have to go radical left.
Honestly your political analysis is kind of useless since you thought Biden was the best guy and we shouldn't have had a primary.
Which is the exact opposite of what should have happened. Please don't become a Democratic consultant ever.
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
- 6,533
- 136
You didn’t answer. Was the correct solution for her to move left? If so, why?
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
- 6,533
- 136
The correct solution was to not run her and to have had a primary instead of covering up for Biden and pretending like he was a viable candidate.
So would democrats have been better with a platform to the right or to the left?
SteveGrabowski
Diamond Member
- Oct 20, 2014
- 7,839
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- 136
To the left. It's stupid to try to be republican lite when voters can just get the real thing with Trump.
I am being real honest here, Waltz was not a bad choice and nor the reason why Kamala lost. I personally do not think any Democrat candidate from NY and CA is going to have a viable chance of becoming president in the near future. Democrats want a new face, and NY/CA has usually been the defacto standard for Democrats in recent decades.
That is why I always think that in 2028, either a "Andy Beshear - Tim Waltz" or "Roy Cooper - Tim Waltz" will only be able to bring victory to the Democrats. Ask any New Yorker, and they will tell you they are not enthusiastic about how either Hochul or Adams are running their administrations respectively. I am not saying their intended goals of a better New York is bad, it's just how they are doing things, corruption, and the infighting is just starting to annoy people.
So in short, until the Democrats put someone people will find less annoying in CA or NY, I think it would be best for the nominee to be someone outside of these two states.
That is why I always think that in 2028, either a "Andy Beshear - Tim Waltz" or "Roy Cooper - Tim Waltz" will only be able to bring victory to the Democrats. Ask any New Yorker, and they will tell you they are not enthusiastic about how either Hochul or Adams are running their administrations respectively. I am not saying their intended goals of a better New York is bad, it's just how they are doing things, corruption, and the infighting is just starting to annoy people.
So in short, until the Democrats put someone people will find less annoying in CA or NY, I think it would be best for the nominee to be someone outside of these two states.
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