Pool Question

[imported_LoKe]

Can someone give me an exact definition for both of them? I'd like to settle an argument with my brother. ^^;

 

[ironcrotch]

english is hitting the cue ball off center to make it spin off the ball so you can control where it ends up on the table

masse is to make the cue ball curve, preferably around a ball that is in the way

 

[imported_LoKe]

When doing a masse shot, the cue must be position vertically with you striking downwards (towards the table, cloth) whereas English would be a nearly horizontal shot?

 

[Sundog]

APA Pool Definitions

ENGLISH: A method of stroking that causes the cue ball to react to the right or left after contact with an object ball or cushion.

MASSE' SHOT: A shot where the shooter is attempting to curve the cue ball around a ball in order to strike an intended ball. A masse' is accomplished by raising the butt end of the cue and using either the right or left English. Even raising the butt end of the cue a little and using right English will cause the cue ball to curve a little. The more the cue is raised, the more the cue ball will curve. Extreme masse' shots, improperly executed, can cause damage to pocket billiard equipment. Although League rules do not allow masse' shots, there may be local Bylaws or individual "House Rules" in many locations limiting or prohibiting masse' shots.

 

[imported_LoKe]

So if the player is shooting at a near vertical level, whilst still causing the call to curve around another ball, is it still a techincal masse shot or could it be considered English?

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: LoKe
So if the player is shooting at a near vertical level, whilst still causing the call to curve around another ball, is it still a techincal masse shot or could it be considered English?

Technically masse could be considered to be extreme english. The more common definition is that english is applied to a cueball to curve it or control where it goes AFTER striking the object ball while a masse shot is intended to curve it BEFORE it strikes an object ball

Quick joke: What do cueballs and illegal aliens have in common? The harder you hit them the more english they pick up.

 

[imported_LoKe]

So having the ball curve around another ball could be considered English but also Masse? So...neither of us are wrong?

 

[ironcrotch]

Originally posted by: LoKe
So having the ball curve around another ball could be considered English but also Masse? So...neither of us are wrong?

ball curving around another is masse, english is hitting the cue off center, it still goes straight, it just bounces off the other ball at a different angle because of that spin.

 

[imported_LoKe]

Ah. So I'm wrong. Interesting.

Thanks guys.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Originally posted by: LoKe
So having the ball curve around another ball could be considered English but also Masse? So...neither of us are wrong?

If a cueball is intentionally curved to avoid an obstacle between it and it's target that's a masse. Whoever is arguing that it's a masse is right, whoever is arguing that it's english is wrong. The only way it's english is by going by a completely unrealistic definition of "english". If the cueball curves before hitting the object ball it's a masse.

 

[mobobuff]

Crappy Diagram of my understanding of the different trick shots.