MercenaryForHire
Lifer
- Jan 31, 2002
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Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a Pontiac just screams suckitude.
Now the Fiero, that was a hot deal.
- M4H
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a Pontiac just screams suckitude.
Originally posted by: ElFenix
Originally posted by: MercenaryForHire
Bob Lutz?
Looking at the nose of that thing, I'd have thought his name was Chris Bangle.
- M4H
maybe you're just a dumbass, but pontiac has been using the 'twin kidney' stiyle grille for a few decades now
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
Originally posted by: Jigga
$19.995 = dealers are gonna have a field day making a buck off this one with "artificial" shortages and markups galore. You can build a better American car, but the dealerships will always suck. I still remember the dealer who test drove the Pacifica with us telling us how the Pacifica was "more upmarket" than the Acura SUV, had more power, and Acura had problems with quality.
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
What American car that was sought after within the past year are they giving away these days?Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Jigga
$19.995 = dealers are gonna have a field day making a buck off this one with "artificial" shortages and markups galore. You can build a better American car, but the dealerships will always suck. I still remember the dealer who test drove the Pacifica with us telling us how the Pacifica was "more upmarket" than the Acura SUV, had more power, and Acura had problems with quality.
Wait six months...a year at most...they'll be giving them away just like every other "sought after" American car.
Originally posted by: b0mbrman
What American car that was sought after within the past year are they giving away these days?Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Jigga
$19.995 = dealers are gonna have a field day making a buck off this one with "artificial" shortages and markups galore. You can build a better American car, but the dealerships will always suck. I still remember the dealer who test drove the Pacifica with us telling us how the Pacifica was "more upmarket" than the Acura SUV, had more power, and Acura had problems with quality.
Wait six months...a year at most...they'll be giving them away just like every other "sought after" American car.
Dunno...you're the one who referenced "every other 'sought after' American car" so I'm wondering what those others are.Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: b0mbrman
What American car that was sought after within the past year are they giving away these days?Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Jigga
$19.995 = dealers are gonna have a field day making a buck off this one with "artificial" shortages and markups galore. You can build a better American car, but the dealerships will always suck. I still remember the dealer who test drove the Pacifica with us telling us how the Pacifica was "more upmarket" than the Acura SUV, had more power, and Acura had problems with quality.
Wait six months...a year at most...they'll be giving them away just like every other "sought after" American car.
Is this a trick question? Were there any?
Originally posted by: b0mbrman
Dunno...you're the one who referenced "every other 'sought after' American car" so I'm wondering what those others are.Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: b0mbrman
What American car that was sought after within the past year are they giving away these days?Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Jigga
$19.995 = dealers are gonna have a field day making a buck off this one with "artificial" shortages and markups galore. You can build a better American car, but the dealerships will always suck. I still remember the dealer who test drove the Pacifica with us telling us how the Pacifica was "more upmarket" than the Acura SUV, had more power, and Acura had problems with quality.
Wait six months...a year at most...they'll be giving them away just like every other "sought after" American car.
Is this a trick question? Were there any?
Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
And what are you basing your opinions on? The fact that you jizzed your pants b/c it's a decent price/performance combo? It's still a Pontiac, with poor reliability and resale values. What makes you think this will be any different?
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
Originally posted by: NFS4
As for the car itself:
R&T:
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
And what are you basing your opinions on? The fact that you jizzed your pants b/c it's a decent price/performance combo? It's still a Pontiac, with poor reliability and resale values. What makes you think this will be any different?
I didn't know Pontiacs had "poor" reliability. Their engines are pretty much bulletproof. The only thing you could really knock them on has been their crappy styling and sh!tty interiors. And GM is at least fixing those latter two.
As for the car itself:
R&T:
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
And what are you basing your opinions on? The fact that you jizzed your pants b/c it's a decent price/performance combo? It's still a Pontiac, with poor reliability and resale values. What makes you think this will be any different?
I didn't know Pontiacs had "poor" reliability. Their engines are pretty much bulletproof. The only thing you could really knock them on has been their crappy styling and sh!tty interiors. And GM is at least fixing those latter two.
As for the car itself:
R&T:
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
Originally posted by: RentYou're fvcking retarded if you think the ecotec is unreliable.
Originally posted by: Rent
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
And what are you basing your opinions on? The fact that you jizzed your pants b/c it's a decent price/performance combo? It's still a Pontiac, with poor reliability and resale values. What makes you think this will be any different?
I didn't know Pontiacs had "poor" reliability. Their engines are pretty much bulletproof. The only thing you could really knock them on has been their crappy styling and sh!tty interiors. And GM is at least fixing those latter two.
As for the car itself:
R&T:
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
You're fvcking retarded if you think the ecotec is unreliable.
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
Technically, the new '06 is a better value for the money than the current Accord and Camry. More safety features, more room, arguably better looking, just as powerful, and with more standard features for thousands less.
Hyundai isn't the crap they used to be.
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=38&threadid=1493243&enterthread=y
Um, two words...resale value.
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
Technically, the new '06 is a better value for the money than the current Accord and Camry. More safety features, more room, arguably better looking, just as powerful, and with more standard features for thousands less.
Hyundai isn't the crap they used to be.
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=38&threadid=1493243&enterthread=y
Um, two words...resale value.
Three words. Ten Year Warranty. Keep the bastard forever and don't worry about it.
That being said, once Hyundai makes competitive cars (which they are now) and struggle with their past demons, their resale value will go up. Do you think that Toyota and Honda have always been the darlings of the automotive industry? They used to be pieces of sh!t too back in the day.
The only difference is that Hyundai is progressing along the same track that Honda/Toyota did at an even more rapid pace.
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: Rent
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
It looks hot but a $20k Pontiac just screams suckitude.
:roll:
And what are you basing your opinions on? The fact that you jizzed your pants b/c it's a decent price/performance combo? It's still a Pontiac, with poor reliability and resale values. What makes you think this will be any different?
I didn't know Pontiacs had "poor" reliability. Their engines are pretty much bulletproof. The only thing you could really knock them on has been their crappy styling and sh!tty interiors. And GM is at least fixing those latter two.
As for the car itself:
R&T:
The driving position is nicely sorted, with a fully adjustable steering wheel, and the pedals are just so, making heel-and-toe shifting natural. Compared with a Mazda Miata, which is cramped for bigger people and which you tend to sit on rather than in, the Solstice envelops the driver and has lots of room. In that respect, it feels more like a baby Corvette than a bigger Miata. The top on this development car was so basic that we decided to fold it away, even on a bracing late-winter day. Wind flow around the cabin, even with the windows down, is brilliantly managed, with hardly any backdraft making it into the cabin.
The 170-horsepower engine has lots of midrange pull, decent top-end power, and a sporty rasp under hard throttle that's easily the best exhaust note we've heard from an Ecotec. Our only criticism is that the engine is rough at around the 6000-rpm mark, lacking the sweetness of the best Japanese fours. The five-speed gearbox is slick, with short throws and a narrow gate. The ratios are nicely spaced, although fifth gear is very much a cruising overdrive.
The chassis is a peach. It rides well over bumpy British secondary roads and feels composed and faithful. At Goodwood, it was really impressive, turning into corners with minimal understeer and roll, staying flat and neutral all the way through. The Solstice's attitude is nicely adjustable with power, because you can lift off the gas in the middle of the turn and get the tail to move, much as in a really good front-wheel-drive car. If anything, the car is over-tired, so dry-pavement power oversteer is unlikely, but the tail will swing out faithfully in the wet. The steering is accurate and direct but is too light and lacks the kind of communicative feel you need to make the sports-car experience special, even at low speeds. The non-ABS brakes work well, with excellent pedal feel.
So, the early indications are very promising. The Solstice looks great, goes nicely, and has a superb chassis. The base car should give Mazda a lot to think about, while the 250-horsepower-plus turbo version coming later should be a humdinger.
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
You're fvcking retarded if you think the ecotec is unreliable.
Hmm, I'm going to assume you weren't referring to me in that post?
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
The Camry and Accord don't exactly kick ass with resale value - Link. It looks like SUVs and some trucks are at the top of that list. Sure, as a percentage, the Camry and Accord will marginally depreciate less, but nominally, since the Sonata starts at a lower price, a comparison of actual dollars lost may favor the Korean car.Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Originally posted by: NFS4
If I believed everything Road & Track writers have to say then I'd say the Hyundai Sonata is a better value than a Toyota Camry or Honda Accord. :roll:
Technically, the new '06 is a better value for the money than the current Accord and Camry. More safety features, more room, arguably better looking, just as powerful, and with more standard features for thousands less.
Hyundai isn't the crap they used to be.
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview...atid=38&threadid=1493243&enterthread=y
Um, two words...resale value.
Not that I've ever owned a Hyundai or see myself owning one in the near future; just showing that it's not as cut-and-dry as people think.
Originally posted by: OS
It says the sky will be 5K more though?![]()
