*POLL* Did we get owned by this dealership?

[TitanDiddly]

Alright. So almost a year or so back, we bought this '95 Mitsubishi Montero LS for $6000. We had it checked out by our long-time mechanic, who usually deals with domestics, but is alright with imports as well. It's been alright, but a month or two back, we took it to our trusted mechanic again because it was burning some oil. He performed a fix, which kinda worked but not really, and informed us that our timing belt needed to be changed, and that we should take it to a dealership or a place that's specialized in imports. So we took it to a Mitsubishi dealership, who changed the timing belt, worked on the water pump, transmission, transfer case, and some other stuff, then slapped a bill for $3700 on us and pushed us out the door. Argh, fine, as long as we got the fix. Fast forward to last week- we take the car in for it's sticker, and it fails the emissions test- still burning oil. So we take it to our trusted mechanic again who tells us that the piston rings and valve guides and some other stuff will need to be replaced. It'd be cheaper to get a used engine and drop it in. He told us that this is something he's embarassed for not having seen it coming, and was kicking himself to telling us to get the expensive timing belt change, since the engine is now headed to a scrap pile in the sky. He also told us that the Mitsubishi dealership had to have known of the engine's issues, absolutely had to have known, and should have told us. The dealership didn't tell us, in fact they were brief in their dealings with us and didn't mention much except the bill.

My family isn't in much of a situation to be paying for a new engine. My dad owns his own small business, which is being pwned by larger corporations, and my dad does not have a lot of time to do money-making work, as he he running for State rep in our district, which involves a lot of work. We have had a lot of consolidated credit card debt in the past, which we are slowly making our way out of. My mom does not work, (frankly, I think she should) staying home helping my dad with the campaign and writing pieces for the opinion page of the local newspaper, in addition to most of the standard mother tasks(myself living at home/in HS, two independent).

We're rather unhappy about having been mistreated by the Mitsubishi dealership. It's my theory that they did know, and avoided telling us so that they could go ahead with the expensive repair. Like most Mitsubishi dealerships lately, this one is lacking financially. We know that they weren't legally obligated to tell us(were they?), and they they did nothing 'wrong' by the letter of the law. What should be do? We can't find a used engine close to us, nor an inexpensive one. I'd like for my dad to call up the Mitsubishi dealership and give them a piece and a half of his mind, but I know that they aren't obligated to do anything and they probably wouldn't even if they were. The guy who sold us the car was slightly deceptive, telling us that he was just selling his car, when in fact he bought cars up at auctions and resold them at a profit. He's not obligated to do anything either. Our trusted mechanic is kicking himself to not seeing this coming, but again, he's not obligated to do anything. So the burden of the dishonesty falls on us. We're frustrated at having nothing else to do than to find some way to pay for the engine, which may in fact require refinancing the house to get some equity out of it. No life savings here.

So, who is right here? Do you feel that the dealership is obligated to do anything? Do you feel that they were dishonest in the first place. Did we get pwned? Where should we go from here? Those 'Consumer Beware' sections on the news might be a candidate, but they probably have more dramatic cases that will get better attention on TV. Is there anything we can do?

Cliff's notes
We buy car
Car is OK for a while
Trusted mechanic tells us it need major work, take it to import specialty place
Major work done by dealership
2 months later, we find out engine is dying, and has been for a while
Trusted mechanic tells us that the dealership knew and should have told us
We're pissed and stuck needing an expensive engine

 

[virtueixi]

DAMN, you got ripped off. ESPECIALLY on that work!

 

[Turkish]

That sucks dude. Write to Mitsubishi Cars of America Headquarters and see what they say. Good luck.

edit: doh. i thought the car was brand new.

 

[Zenmervolt]

If the mechanic didn't see it coming, how did he expect the dealership to? That sounds way off.

Short of performing a compression test they could not have known about the rings and valve guides and they aren't going to perform a compression test in the course of any of the repairs you mentioned.

ZV

 

[nick1985]

call a lawyer ASAP

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
If the mechanic didn't see it coming, how did he expect the dealership to? That sounds way off.

Short of performing a compression test they could not have known about the rings and valve guides and they aren't going to perform a compression test in the course of any of the repairs you mentioned.

ZV

He doesn't deal with imports often. I'm no mechanic, but I don't think a compression test has been done at all, and we know that the work needs to be done.

 

[StageLeft]

$3700 on that stuff sounds to me like you were repeatedly violated with a large object by the dealership. Something people need to question is this: When they bring a car in that doesn't seem to have anything wrong with it, why do they so often have no problem paying for repairs because the mechanic suddenly found something wrong with it, that before hand was raising no issue? A small sum on CV boots or something is one thing but how exactly did that $3700 go towards fixing what you brought the car in for in the first place anyway? Not including parts $3700 is, at $90/hour (like what a stealership charges), a _full week_ from a professional mechanic. I can't imagine that a mechanic blew a week on your vehicle, not including parts...and a timing belt isn't expensive, so I hope the other parts were. You can get a new engine (rebuilt or from a scrapped car) installed in your vehicle for LESS than $3700. Unfortunately you've already spent the $3700

Calling a lawyer would be nice, but also expensive, and unless you can proove that the dealership charged you for repairs that weren't done you probably screwed.

You could try calling mitsu of america. It's worth a shot, but mitsubishi has one foot in the grave already, so i don't know how much luck you'll have with that.

The guy who sold us the car was slightly deceptive, telling us that he was just selling his car, when in fact he bought cars up at auctions and resold them at a profit.

Carfax report would have made that clear if you'd have run one before buying it. Anyway, as it stands now if you need a new engine your mechanic (or another one, since your guy may not be very good) will do it cheaper than getting it done at the stealership, where they'll charge you an arm and a leg.

You could also just try and sell the car as it is now, since the onus isn't on you to tell the seller that it's burning oil, if they don't bother checking themselves. That's underhanded, though.

 

[Yossarian]

wow you pissed away $3700 without blinking an eye. they would have to justify everything to me in writing before I authorized that kind of repair.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
$3700 on that stuff sounds to me like you were repeatedly violated with a large object by the dealership. Something people need to question is this: When they bring a car in that doesn't seem to have anything wrong with it, why do they so often have no problem paying for repairs because the mechanic suddenly found something wrong with it, that before hand was raising no issue? A small sum on CV boots or something is one thing but how exactly did that $3700 go towards fixing what you brought the car in for in the first place anyway? Not including parts $3700 is, at $90/hour (like what a stealership charges), a _full week_ from a professional mechanic. I can't imagine that a mechanic blew a week on your vehicle, not including parts...and a timing belt isn't expensive, so I hope the other parts were. You can get a new engine (rebuilt or from a scrapped car) installed in your vehicle for LESS than $3700. Unfortunately you've already spent the $3700

Calling a lawyer would be nice, but also expensive, and unless you can proove that the dealership charged you for repairs that weren't done you probably screwed.

You could try calling mitsu of america. It's worth a shot, but mitsubishi has one foot in the grave already, so i don't know how much luck you'll have with that.

The guy who sold us the car was slightly deceptive, telling us that he was just selling his car, when in fact he bought cars up at auctions and resold them at a profit.

Carfax report would have made that clear if you'd have run one before buying it. Anyway, as it stands now if you need a new engine your mechanic (or another one, since your guy may not be very good) will do it cheaper than getting it done at the stealership, where they'll charge you an arm and a leg.

You could also just try and sell the car as it is now, since the onus isn't on you to tell the seller that it's burning oil, if they don't bother checking themselves. That's underhanded, though.

The trusted mechanic found the problem- and suggested that we get somebody else to do the work. He didn't mention any names, so I don't think they're in cahoots. I wish that more research had been done- I am kinda involved with family finance (I just like to know what's going on) so I did question the the expensive repair, but I wasn't fully aware of what was going on, I only knew what my parents had told me.

Originally posted by: Yossarian
wow you pissed away $3700 without blinking an eye. they would have to justify everything to me in writing before I authorized that kind of repair.

Oh, we blinked.

 

[StageLeft]

The trusted mechanic found the problem- and suggested that we get somebody else to do the work. He didn't mention any names, so I don't think they're in cahoots. I wish that more research had been done- I am kinda involved with family finance (I just like to know what's going on) so I did question the the expensive repair, but I wasn't fully aware of what was going on, I only knew what my parents had told me.

But your problem was leaking oil, right? And you paid $3700 - more than a rebuilt engine installed in your vehicle including labor from an independent mechanic - and the problem still isn't fixed, but you allowed them to work on such unrelated things as the water pump and the transmission

 

[alkemyst]

It's a year later and a used car....the dealership is not responsible. I doubt they would have known of this stuff and even if the car had a clean bill of health, the next day a ring could chip or a bearing seize, etc.

I absolutely have no idea why'd you have $3,700 in repairs done to such a car, nor you mechanic not do a simple 1/2 hour max compression check first when looking at that much in labor and even if not just saying get a drop in reman engine.

The person that had you bent over the kitchen table was your mechanic.

good luck.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: Skoorb

The trusted mechanic found the problem- and suggested that we get somebody else to do the work. He didn't mention any names, so I don't think they're in cahoots. I wish that more research had been done- I am kinda involved with family finance (I just like to know what's going on) so I did question the the expensive repair, but I wasn't fully aware of what was going on, I only knew what my parents had told me.

But your problem was leaking oil, right? And you paid $3700 - more than a rebuilt engine installed in your vehicle including labor from an independent mechanic - and the problem still isn't fixed, but you allowed them to work on such unrelated things as the water pump and the transmission

We brought the burning oil problem to the trusted mechanic, who thought he fixed it(not for $3700), but said that the timing belt would probably need to be changed, but to get it done elsewhere. So we got the timing belt changed and some other stuff for $3700. Then the trusted mechanic tells us that the engine is taking a nosedive, and then I posted this.

 

[StageLeft]

I'm surprised that your mechanic couldn't change a timing belt. It's involved more than changing the oil, but unless that's an unusual engine it's nothing, AFAIK, that a professional mechanic should not be able to do. I wonder what the other stuff was that you had done for $3700 - I mean, what was wrong with the car that you brought it in to the dealership (besides the timing belt)?

You should try calling around and see if anybody can give you a remanufacturered engine installed in your vehicle and ask them how much it would cost.

 

[Wuffsunie]

Originally posted by: Zenmervolt
If the mechanic didn't see it coming, how did he expect the dealership to? That sounds way off.

Short of performing a compression test they could not have known about the rings and valve guides and they aren't going to perform a compression test in the course of any of the repairs you mentioned.

Well, the first mechanic I would assume made just a visual inspection of the engine and advised the OP based on what the OP told him about how the car was behaving. Do you know exactly what he did that time? Was it just a quick seal replacement?

The stealership should have seen something, though, as from the bill it looks like they pretty much ripped apart a good chunk of his engine. I had a belt and pump replaced on my Honda for $600 at a dealership recently, so they definetly hosed him on work, too. And frankly I'm surprised at the bill and the work! I always ask what repairs will cost up front and I've never had a place repair something more that I've asked for without telling me what it is and why it needs it.

The two lessons to take away from this: 1) carfax stuff before you buy and 2) avoid dealerships when getting repairs unless you're under warrenty.

Edit: Timing belts I've heard are interesting beasts. I know on my Honda, the way the engine is desinged you either need a special tool or a bunch of extra work to get it lined up correctly. And that is one thing you want lined up right, thus it's worth braving a dealship for usually.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: Skoorb
I'm surprised that your mechanic couldn't change a timing belt. It's involved more than changing the oil, but unless that's an unusual engine it's nothing, AFAIK, that a professional mechanic should not be able to do. I wonder what the other stuff was that you had done for $3700 - I mean, what was wrong with the car that you brought it in to the dealership (besides the timing belt)?

You should try calling around and see if anybody can give you a remanufacturered engine installed in your vehicle and ask them how much it would cost.

He could- but I think a combination of the shop being busy and him being less experienced (edit: with imports) led him to reccomend that we get it done elsewhere.

My dad mentioned that the whole front of the car had to be torn off to get at it. Does that sound right to you?

 

[isekii]

yea your mechanic sounds like he doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

he's the one that was suppose to check out the car and make sure everything was peachy before you purchased thecar.

 

[godmare]

Originally posted by: isekii
yea your mechanic sounds like he doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

he's the one that was suppose to check out the car and make sure everything was peachy before you purchased thecar.

The only 'trusted mechanic' I have for my cars is me. I think you need to rethink the amount of stock held in this guy.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: godmare

Originally posted by: isekii
yea your mechanic sounds like he doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

he's the one that was suppose to check out the car and make sure everything was peachy before you purchased thecar.

The only 'trusted mechanic' I have for my cars is me. I think you need to rethink the amount of stock held in this guy.

I see where you're coming from, but my parents are on pretty good term with him and have been using him for 10 years, about.

You may just be right.

 

[phreakah]

i wouldnt have bought the montero in the first place.. pwnd yourselves

 

[vegetation]

I don't think you should call him a "trusted" mechanic anymore and start looking for a new one. It seems odd he wouldn't change the belt, plus if he really was any good and cared, he could have referred you to someone he knows who does the type of work you needed. All the good mechanics that I know of are well connected in the community. But the real fault is just yourself. You should have seriously questioned a $3000+ repair job estimate on a $6000 used car. That's just insane in my opinion. And no, you don't have any case here. The dealership did what you asked of them, then completed the job successfully. Don't know why you're trying to point fingers here.

 

[godmare]

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox

Originally posted by: godmare

Originally posted by: isekii
yea your mechanic sounds like he doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

he's the one that was suppose to check out the car and make sure everything was peachy before you purchased thecar.

The only 'trusted mechanic' I have for my cars is me. I think you need to rethink the amount of stock held in this guy.

I see where you're coming from, but my parents are on pretty good term with him and have been using him for 10 years, about.

You may just be right.

Well, suppose that he's a decent guy (off chance, but stranger things have happened), he probably needs to stick with chevys...

Now, $3700 is a very hefty chunk of change- the engine coud've been rebuilt for much less...
How many miles are on the engine? Rebuilding may yet be a viable option.

 

[RbSX]

Your fault 100%. Do you think this just happens to you? Do you think all cars are just simply resold? Where do you think alot of these used cars come from? seizures and police auctions, or they are rebuilt after being written off by insurance agencies.

You got screwed by your own stupidity. Not everyone in this world is honest, and some of us realize that, unfortunately you didn't.

 

[TitanDiddly]

Originally posted by: godmare

Originally posted by: PhasmatisNox

Originally posted by: godmare

Originally posted by: isekii
yea your mechanic sounds like he doesn't know what the hell he's doing.

he's the one that was suppose to check out the car and make sure everything was peachy before you purchased thecar.

The only 'trusted mechanic' I have for my cars is me. I think you need to rethink the amount of stock held in this guy.

I see where you're coming from, but my parents are on pretty good term with him and have been using him for 10 years, about.

You may just be right.

Well, suppose that he's a decent guy (off chance, but stranger things have happened), he probably needs to stick with chevys...

Now, $3700 is a very hefty chunk of change- the engine coud've been rebuilt for much less...
How many miles are on the engine? Rebuilding may yet be a viable option.

120k when the repair occured. My dad recently discovered that this engine has a reputation for dying at 130k.

Originally posted by: RyanSengara
Your fault 100%. Do you think this just happens to you? Do you think all cars are just simply resold? Where do you think alot of these used cars come from? seizures and police auctions, or they are rebuilt after being written off by insurance agencies.

You got screwed by your own stupidity. Not everyone in this world is honest, and some of us realize that, unfortunately you didn't.

I was wary about spending the $3.7k, just like you said- but I trusted my parents to be informed on spending that much money. Apparently they trust people too much, or something.