Police kill man with $2 of marijuana. Then lie to try and cover it up.

[crashtech]

...the victim had it coming.

"It," meaning a de facto execution sans due process? So to maintain consistency in your odd mental landscape, do you advocate more serious penalties for violent offenders, and what then might be worse than death? Prolonged torture of some kind?

 

[Fern]

What does that have to do with the swat team's orders? They were called in and given a no-knock warrant.
-snip-

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:

Castor said that the tactical officers knocked on the front door and announced themselves, but that nobody inside answered. Finding the door unlocked, they let themselves into the house.

Fern

 

[BoberFett]

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:



Fern

And as we all know, the cops have never concocted a story to fill in the gaps to cover for their fuckups.

I guess we should all wait until the facts are in.

 

[Jhhnn]

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:



Fern

I wouldn't hazard a guess as to what actually occurred, the possibilities being endless. I wasn't there. It doesn't matter in context because there's only one story that can be told- the cops'.

What matters is the underlying demonization of cannabis & otherwise law abiding cannabis users, the propaganda that allows decent citizens to tolerate it. There is no honest rationale for it being illegal, never was.

I'm very interested in what the data shows about a full year of retail sales here in CO- All those pesky facts- domestic disputes, violent crime, emergency room visits, mental health, intoxicated driving, attributable workplace accidents, you name it.

Whatever it is, it'll be the truth. America needs to hear it.

 

[Subyman]

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:



Fern

If the article is correct, they announced themselves, already handcuffed one person, and were clearing the house when the man "pointed" his gun at the officers. Again, the Swat team was executing the orders as given to them. Unfortunately, this man, presumably, thought they were robbers and not SWAT.

To me, with the information given, the investigator jumped the gun on thin informant intel.

 

[Jerem]

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:



Fern

I think if they waited at all before entering, it was about as long as the cop in Walmart waited in between yelling "get on the ground" and gunning that guy down.

 

[Jerem]

Here is the other case I mentioned earlier

http://www.policestateusa.com/2013/...d-after-claiming-his-house-smelled-like-meth/

 

[Subyman]

I think if they waited at all, it was about as long as the cop in Walmart waited in between yelling "get on the ground" and gunning that guy down.

SWAT doesn't wait. There is a huge procedural difference between swat and normal officers. That's why calling them in should only be done in extreme cases.

 

[Jerem]

SWAT doesn't wait. There is a huge procedural difference between swat and normal officers. That's why calling them in should only be done in extreme cases.

From the article

"Castor said that the tactical officers knocked on the front door and announced themselves, but that nobody inside answered. Finding the door unlocked, they let themselves into the house. "

Is there not a waiting period to let someone come to the door or otherwise answer?

 

[Subyman]

From the article

"Castor said that the tactical officers knocked on the front door and announced themselves, but that nobody inside answered. Finding the door unlocked, they let themselves into the house. "

Is there not a waiting period to let someone come to the door or otherwise answer?

Did you read the rest of the sentence you bolded?

 

[Jerem]

I copied from Fern, he bolded. But anyway, the quote says no one answered after knocking. You would have to give someone a chance to answer...ie; waiting. Now you said SWAT doesn't wait and in my first post I said essentially the same thing. If they waited it was barely if it all. I think we agree but I can't tell for sure. What exactly is your point?

 

[Subyman]

I copied from Fern, he bolded. But anyway, the quote says no one answered after knocking. You would have to give someone a chance to answer...ie; waiting. Now you said SWAT doesn't wait and in my first post I said essentially the same thing. If they waited it was barely if it all. I think we agree but I can't tell for sure. What exactly is your point?

I meant they don't wait when a gun is pointed at them. Not at the door. I assume they announce themselves. Knock. Wait for the trained amount of time (don't know what it is) and then enter. A no-knock warrant is when they just bust in the door unannounced.

 

[Jerem]

I meant they don't wait when a gun is pointed at them. Not at the door. I assume they announce themselves. Knock. Wait for the trained amount of time (don't know what it is) and then enter. A no-knock warrant is when they just bust in the door unannounced.

I can see how my post would have led someone to think I was talking about the shots fired. I'll edit for clarity.

 

[Vic]

But if one of them gets killed, they want us to convict, give death penalty, hold a parade for the officer, and generally give a sh!t.

They did that here.. when one of their dogs was killed.

 

[master_shake_]

They did that here.. when one of their dogs was killed.

unless the dog was killed by the officer, then who gives a fuck amirite?

http://thefreethoughtproject.com/k-9-dead-officer-leaves-dog-hot-car-6-hours-windows/

 

[crashtech]

If the article is correct, they announced themselves, already handcuffed one person, and were clearing the house when the man "pointed" his gun at the officers. Again, the Swat team was executing the orders as given to them. Unfortunately, this man, presumably, thought they were robbers and not SWAT.

To me, with the information given, the investigator jumped the gun on thin informant intel.

Unless the victim/perp was confirmed suicidal, I call BS on that highly implausible narrative.

 

[Theb]

Amen. It's proving to be superior public policy that should be implemented everywhere in this country. It's a declaration of Peace, on ourselves, one that we can all easily live with.

 

[bradley]

Crazy story... seems as though law enforcement continues trying to top the below holy grail SWAT encounter. Winning the drug war by any means necessary.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kathryn_Johnston_shooting

Kathryn Johnston (June 26, 1914 – November 21, 2006) was an elderly Atlanta, Georgia, woman who was shot by undercover police officers in her home on Neal Street in northwest Atlanta on November 21, 2006, where she had lived for 17 years. Three officers had entered her home in what was later described as a 'botched' drug raid. Officers cut off burglar bars and broke down her door using a no-knock warrant. Police said Johnston fired at them and they fired in response; she fired one shot out the door over the officers' heads and they fired 39 shots, five or six of which hit her. None of the officers were injured by her gunfire, but Johnston was killed by the officers. Police injuries were later attributed to "friendly fire" from each other's weapons.

One of the officers planted marijuana in Johnston's house after the shooting. Later investigations found that the paperwork stating that drugs present at Johnston's house, which had been the basis for the raid, had been falsified. The officers later admitted to having lied when they submitted cocaine as evidence claiming that they had bought it at Johnston's house. Three officers were tried for manslaughter and other charges surrounding falsification and were sentenced to ten, six, and five years.

RIP grandma

 

[Darwin333]

Everybody keeps saying this was a no-knock raid.

The article says otherwise:



Fern

I believe a no knock warrant was issued, if this is not the case I'd love to know.

Just because the SWAT team was nice enough to check and see if the door was unlocked before knocking it down doesn't change the circumstances though.

 

[Darwin333]

Did you read the rest of the sentence you bolded?

What if no one answered in 1 second? Fact is no one answered before the door got opened or kicked down. I think the person asked what is the time frame to gather that "no one answered", not that "no one answered" period because I could walk up to your house, knock, claim no one answered and kick the door down if I get to make up the rules.

So, what are the rules?

 

[Pipeline 1010]

So, what are the rules?

I believe that's classified, citizen. Just follow the rules and/or die, that's all you need to know.

 

[Jhhnn]

It's hard to believe that anybody would grab their gun if multiple officers are screaming Police! Hands Up! Show Yourself! from the moment they entered.

It's probably easier if you believe that the police should be sent into situations where they can end up killing or being killed over marijuana. If you're dumb enough to believe in that, you're dumb enough to believe anything that goes with it.

 

[Darwin333]

It's hard to believe that anybody would grab their gun if multiple officers are screaming Police! Hands Up! Show Yourself! from the moment they entered.

Shrug, civilians have the exact same defense as cops do in situations like no-knock raids. They have a split second to react to an imminent threat. The difference is the cops are well prepared, very alert and have numbers and surprise on their side. The civilians are usually, purposefully, awoken from a dead sleep and forced to make that decision in a split second without possibly being able to truly assess the situation.

I'm a law abiding citizen. Why in the hell would I assume that if my door gets kicked in while I'm in a dead sleep that it is the police? If the police had reason to talk to me, being a peaceful law abiding citizen, I assume they would knock on the door. Hell even if I sold $40 worth of friggen weed I'd probably still assume the same thing, that goes quadruple if threats have been leveled against me. Threats that were reported to the police. The slightest bit of "police work" and even a below average IQ could assume this kid would be jumpy just by reading the police report HE gave. If he's willing to call the cops in the first place it's a good bet he isn't a hardened criminal willing to go down shooting at the cops.

Personally I would have called or knocked and said I had information about the person threatening him. He would have either came outside or invited me in, and then arrest without incident. Took me all of 20 seconds to figure that out but the guys that are "trained" put the entire neighborhood at risk, which is more than proven by the two 12 gauge slugs that went through the exterior wall and could have easily killed some kid riding their bike or a neighbor, and needlessly killed some kid peddling $20 worth of weed.

 

[Jhhnn]

Why in the hell would I assume that if my door gets kicked in while I'm in a dead sleep that it is the police?

Maybe if what woke you were multiple voices screaming "Police!" in your living room, huh? Maybe if there was a guy on a bullhorn outside saying the same thing? You know, announcing themselves to the whole neighborhood?

That's a no-brainer, huh?

Alternative scenarios abound, like this-

*soft tap-tap on the door*

*soft voice: Police. Open up.*

Finding the door unlocked, half a dozen cops charge into your living room, the only sounds being their boots on the floor... If they see a gun in your hand, you're dead.

The winners write the history, always.

 

[Darwin333]

Maybe if what woke you were multiple voices screaming "Police!" in your living room, huh? Maybe if there was a guy on a bullhorn outside saying the same thing? You know, announcing themselves to the whole neighborhood?


That's a no-brainer, huh?

In that case, absolutely. You have to quite literally be suicidal to get into a shootout with cops and you have no method of escape. You're still pretty damn suicidal to take a shot at a cop period.

Alternative scenarios abound, like this-

*soft tap-tap on the door*

*soft voice: Police. Open up.*

Finding the door unlocked, half a dozen cops charge into your living room, the only sounds being their boots on the floor... If they see a gun in your hand, you're dead.

The winners write the history, always.

Exactly. Even if they do yell police once they are in the residence, their voice being what woke you up, its still the exact same split second decision that the police use as justification for shooting people. At the absolute least civilians should be afforded the exact same justification for shooting police if they reasonably feared for their life because upon being awoken to armed men storming their house.

If we are going to continue having fucked up situations like this it should at the very least be fair. I say that rather tongue in cheek because I know full well that every LEO that is killed as a direct result of these kinds of tactics will only make them believe that those very tactics are even more necessary. I posted an article about a families home being destroyed by the police ramming their tank into it multiple times after the SWAT team was used to enforce a bench warrant against a guy who missed a DWI court date.