Please help me figure out how to fix this dual boot.

WoundedWallet

Platinum Member
Oct 9, 1999
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This is not my system, but it is my fsck up :eek:

The actual situation is:
HD0 has WinME
HD1 has XP

I can only boot to XP if I use a booting floppy. The ME choice on the floppy doesn't work.

ME boots straight from the HD but I get no booting choices.

Boot.ini is the same in the floppy and the HD. All the floppy files were copied to the HD.

I can explain how I got into this crazy situation if it helps solving the problem, but I'm keeping it simple right now in case someone has already seen this and know what is wrong.

The problem can probably be solved by re-installing XP, but I really want to understand what is wrong right now. So please give it a shot.

What do I need to do to make this dual boot work right (meaning, having working choices from the HD)?

Thanks,
WW
 

Bozo Galora

Diamond Member
Oct 28, 1999
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you are probably missing bootsect.dos (512bytes)

note that you need 4 files in "C" root with XP/ME dual (after "unhiding")
ntldr
ntdetect
bootsect.dos
boot.ini

boot.ini should look like this (assuming C - ME and D - XP)
doent matter how many partitions you have, (2) only relates to primaries

Win 98/XPSP2 dual boot........
[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /noexecute=AlwaysOff /fastdetect
C:\ = "Microsoft Windows"

no execute stuff is only for late XP SP2, embedded in install CD.

Edit: Just noticed your O/S are on two separate HDD
The "2" in above means on which primary defailt bootable system resides, and Win 98/ME has no multiboot config, so it must be the XP primary
============

(Quote from web - single XP O/S)
[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft
Windows XP Home Edition" /fastdetect

timeout specifies how long the system should wait for user input while the boot menu is being displayed.

default identifies which selection from the Windows recognizable operating systems (identified in the [operating systems] section) will be booted if the user makes no selection in the boot menu. The [operating systems] section identifies all Windows recognizable operating systems that can be booted by the boot menu.

multi denotes that this system has an IDE or ESDI drive, and is almost always 0. If you are using a SCSI drive with no BIOS support, this is scsi(0) instead of multi(0). (Note: Windows NT systems using SCSI drives have multi). The disk designator is 0 if multi is listed as the adapter. If scsi is the adapter in use, you would indicate the scsi bus number. rdisk identifies what controller is the disk is on, such as rdisk(1) for the secondary disk, rdisk(0) for the primary. If you are using scsi, this option is always 0.

partition indicates what partition the file to boot resides on. If you are on the second primary partition, you would write partition(2). This should never be 0 because there is no partition 0. The last portion identifies the directory in which Windows resides (in this case \WINDOWS (this could be anything depending on the version of Windows and how the system was installed). Everything after the equal sign and in quotes shows what is displayed in the boot menu to the user regarding booting.

Most boot.ini problems you encounter will be file corruption (or misconfiguration if you are hand editing the file). You can use the preceding information to recover by simply replacing or adding the default lines.
 

WoundedWallet

Platinum Member
Oct 9, 1999
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Thank you so much Bozo Galora. I think I'll be able to learn from you, but please be patient because it seems that I don't know what I thought I knew.

I was missing bootsect.dos at some point as I thought it was a XP file only. But now that you reminded me that ME/98 do not have a multiboot configuration I'll have to look again to see what version of bootsect.dos I have in there.

I thought that rdisk was related to the the physical HD itself and not the controller. So that is something else I have to look for.

I also have the partition as (1) for both of them. You mentioned that (2) relates to primaries and that confuses me. Can you try explaining that again?

Also on that same sentence, did you imply that XP has to be the default because of ME/98 shortcomings?

Thanks again.
WW
 

Bozo Galora

Diamond Member
Oct 28, 1999
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Thank you for being "humble". Not something seen often on AT - lol.

Well, due to protocol (and hidden entries), Win 98 usually shows no partition or other info in its line - it cant "talk back" to XP. "C=Microsoft Windows" just tells XP theres aother old crappy legacy O/S there on C. Thats why bootsector.dos is there.
XP was first MS O/S to have embedded multiboot install config, 3rd party TSR software no longer needed.
Bootsector.dos ONLY exists with Win98/ME-XP dual boot
The DEFAULT boot after timeout can be made either as 98 or XP, but choice menu still appears.
Note that the FIRST above given boot.ini is from my W98/XPSP2 working system posting here
The SECOND is for a single XP - I didnt make that clear and have edited.
I like Win98 for web browsing, because it has none of the remote/telnet services that hackers love.
Win 98 or ME MUST! be on C with multiboot, or it will try to migrate
And of course, never ever put both on same partition
Note again there is no partition "0"
if you had XP/XP 64 multi "C" "D", XP part would be 1, or the first bootable XP primary

Bootsector.dos also has FAT32 NTFS info, and I use Fat32/Fat32 for this PC, or I would upload the 512Byte file for you. I assume you have Fat32/NTFS

When they say rdisk shows which controller is on, they mean HDD IDE controller as in MOTHERBOARD Primary secondary. A master slave primary would be (0,1), the master slave secondary would be (2,3). In other words, IDE physical HDD 3 would be rdisk(2). And you can only have nothing higher than 3.

Heres a much better, updated as of 5 months ago, tutorial on boot.ini from Starman:
http://www.geocities.com/thestarman3/asm/mbr/bootini.htm
sorry about that. :p

Check out this section: (just stuff you really dont need to know)
(Quote)
NOTE: The fourth line under "[operating systems]" is what you're likely to see if you installed one of these new NT-type OSs on a system that already had Windows? 9x/Me. You'll see a line similar to this: C:\ = "Microsoft Windows ME" (where C:\ = "description" is all that's required), and they don't appear to use ARC paths! Why is that? Well, it's just an illusion built into NTLDR! If you were to add such a line to a BOOT.INI file that hadn't been processed during an OS install (or if you accidentally removed the file that C:\ = " " actually refers to... we'll get to that very soon), then attempting to boot that selection would cause your system to lockup after displaying this message:
I/O Error accessing boot sector file
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\BOOTSECT.DOS

Why? Because the filename BOOTSECT.DOS and its ARC path are built into the programs ntldr and arcldr.exe and unless this file exists in the same folder they are in, you must supply a path to some other file and/or location. Now you know why the second line in boot.ini above contains the path: C:\CMDCONS\BOOTSECT.DAT That's the file which initially boots the Recovery Console!
(Unquote)
....................................................
Anyway, moving on........
ME is a failed O/S with nothing but trouble, I would use Win98 SE

we need you to just post your boot.ini here

If you already have ntldr ntdetect boot.ini and a (relevant) bootsector.dos in your root C, you could try typing in FIXBOOT at the recovery console with booted to XP CD install startup.

http://lila.godel.com/html/windosbf.htm
http://www.winimage.com/bootpart.htm

or this (kinda for experts)
http://www.diydatarecovery.nl/downloads/Demo/DiskPatch.zip

I think a boot.ini edit, plus a loadup of a new bootsect.dos will fix things.
The fact you can boot into ME but not XP with no error messages is a good sign.
You have a simple problem, but you did ask the why and how of it.

 

WoundedWallet

Platinum Member
Oct 9, 1999
2,325
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Thank you Bozo Galora. Fixboot did it.

By explaining how it had to go to XP first, you took the fear away from messing up somebody else's computer, when it asked me "are you sure you want to fix the boot sector?" And I thought, "yes it is ok to let XP (and not ME) fix the boot sector".

Now, what is the relationship between bootsec.dos and the boot sector? Is bootsec.dos created based on the actual boot sector? Is it the other way around? No relationship?

And what is the difference between fixboot and fixmbr?

Thanks, and yes I want to learn the why and how about booting, cause I'm tired of struggling every time I try to make a bootable CD.

I think that being humble while learning makes the whole process job a lot easier. I haven't been back here much, and I'm sorry that AT has changed so much that humbleness is a rarity. But I'm glad there are still helpful people like you hanging around. :thumbsup:
 

Bozo Galora

Diamond Member
Oct 28, 1999
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Most people here (Gen HW) already have a fixed idea of what they think is wrong, so are not open to other input. Ultimately they argue with the helpers, or if you give 5 things to try, they only respond to 1 or 2. Then they abandon the thread, stumble around and somehow get things going or just reformat. What they are really looking for is a one sentence sure fire answer.

But I am more like you, I just like to know why, not only how.

However, over time, computer knowledge has gotten to be easier to assimilate and the number of people needing deep help has lessened dramatically. Remember when you practically needed to be an engineer to set up a 56.6K dial up with a com port?

As of late, when you look at the daytime GH first page on AT, you may see 10 new threads. I can remember when there used to be 6 pages of them. A good argument could be made to close the GH, Software and Video forums. They really serve no purpose now. 99% of the stuff can be answered with google, anyway.

But anyway, back on subject.........
heres a nice page that describes MBR and bootsectors starting about half way down
http://users.bigpond.net.au/hermanzone/p6.htm#What_is_the_MBR_or_Boot_Sector

a few more blurbs on bootsectors.....
When you install NT on a machine with an existing OS, NT Setup creates a file called bootsect.dos and copies the existing OS's boot sector, which resides in sector 0 of the C drive, into that file. Then, when you run the previous OS, NT copies bootsect.dos to the boot sector. Because NT Setup creates bootsect.dos, the file can be the boot sector for any previous OS and one can take advanced measures to recreate.

When you install Windows 98, and since it relies on MS-DOS, it places its boot files in the root of drive "C" regardless of where the actual files are for the operating system, which is your case I presume is drive "D" since you do not mention this. When you installed XP Home, it found these boot files and created Bootsect.dos for you and then created and enabled your dual boot configuration. When you formatted your "C" drive and reinstalled XP Home, you removed the MS-DOS boot files for Windows 98, hence the error you receive. You now need to recreate these boot files as well as the bootsect.dos files for Windows XP Home.
---------------------------------------------------
Always check boot.ini for correct info before starting
If XP is missing, BOOTCFG /REBUILD will add it in recov console, but I prefer to edit it in notepad before doing anything.

FIRST Step........
basically you do a sys transfer to C: from a win 98 boot floppy to bring back Win98/ME
A:>sys C:
then create bootsect.dos which will USE that loaded Win 98 MBR info

STEP 2 -- MAKE THE BOOT SECTOR FILE (its always best to delete old and make a new one) MUST BE IN SAME ROOT Volume as NTLDR boot.ini and ntdtect

http://www.bcpl.net/~dbryan/ntfs-dual-boot.html
You must now make a BOOTSECT.DOS file from the boot sector of the DOS/Win98 partition and store it on C:\ (i.e., in the root directory of the NTFS partition).

Note that you cannot simply copy a BOOTSECT.DOS file from another installation, because the boot sector contains an internal table (used to locate the root directory) that describes the physical layout of the drive and partition on which it was created, e.g., the number of heads, the number of sectors per track, the location of the partition in sectors from the start of the drive, the size of the File Allocation Table, etc. This physical information will not, in general, be correct unless you're copying it from a system with an identical partitioning layout on an identical hard drive (not just the same capacity, but the same number of cylinders, heads, and sectors per track).

To capture the DOS partition's boot sector, log on to your NT system as Administrator. Copy the following text into a new file called READ.SCR:

L 100 * 0 1 (* is normally 2 or "C")
N C:\BOOTSECT.DOS
R BX
0
R CX
200
W
Q

...where the "*" in the first command is replaced by the number corresponding to the drive letter of the DOS partition. Use 2 = C, 3 = D, 4 = E, and so on (the letters are those assigned to the partitions when running under NT). As an example, if the DOS partition is drive letter E:, the command would be "L 100 4 0 1". Note that the partition number is entered in hexadecimal, so that drive letter J: is 9, K: is 0A, L: is 0B, etc. (0) =A (1)=B

Once you have made this text file, start an NT command prompt, change directories to the location of this text file, and run the DEBUG program as follows:

A:> debug <read.scr

This will create the file C:\BOOTSECT.DOS from the boot sector on the Win 98 partition. If the DEBUG command reports any errors, check your text file carefully to see if you made an error in entering the commands.

Looks complicated, but really easy and quick
http://www.mesich.com/download/DEBUG.EXE
http://www.dougknox.com/xp/tips/xp_repair_9x.htm

Then as a third and final step you do a FIXBOOT on XP install from recovery cosole on XP install routine to bring back XP
http://www.microsoft.com/resources/docu...s/en-us/bootcons_fixboot.mspx?mfr=true
 

WoundedWallet

Platinum Member
Oct 9, 1999
2,325
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Remember when you practically needed to be an engineer to set up a 56.6K dial up with a com port?
Yep, all the weird strings and having to load the tcpip stack to connect 3.11 to the net. How glad was i when the Earthlink guy came up with a program that cut that work in half!!

It is important to know the nuts and bolts of the tools you use. But it sure is a pain in the arse to have to build the tool by hand when you can get a brand new one cheap. Meaning, I'm glad to learn but I don't want to be doing it all the time.

Thanks for the info on the bootsec.dos, it made sense.

Just for the sake of it, I'll try to explain how I got into this mess.

A friend had two computers one with XP and the other with ME. I suggested to him to take the drive of the XP and put on the ME box and have a dual boot. As the ME box was newer. This way C: would have ME and D: have XP.

So I walked him over the phone on copying the XP root files to C: and editing boot.ini. While I was out walking the dog. Too much confidence in myself, now I see. I had the wrong idea of rdisk was to begin with.

Anyway, just before the HD transplant he also had tried and failed to use Partition Magic on his ME drive which may have added another unknown to the equation. But I'm not going there.

So, what happened was that at first he couldn't boot to anything. Then he tried re-installing XP, and during the reboot he landed nowhere.

I ended up coming over with a copy of Windows PE to see what was wrong. That is when I decided to restore C: to the way it was before my fatal phone call. To my dismay that didn't help.

A day passes and I come back with a XP boot floppy with multiple choices in boot.ini and a ME boot floppy. I tried the XP floppy first and managed to get int o XP. But to my surprise what I got was the end of the installation that had been started and never finished.

After the installation finished I realized that ME was unavailable and I still had to use the XP floppy to get XP to load.

Then I used the ME floppy and did a sys a:which solved the ME problem but left XP completely ignored.

That's when I decided to cry uncle.

So from what I can see. My original idea of merging two HD and copying files was flawed. Something must have happened when I was telling him over the phone what files to copy that made ME to balk. Either I overwrote an important ME file or maybe the Partition Magic changed something that made ME unbootable. It doesn't matter now. The approach was wrong and I won't be repeating it.

Continuing... the XP re- installation was over a buggy ME and by then and the stage was set for multiple problems.

Thankfully fixboot over a healthy ME was all that was needed. But I didn't know about its existence until you mentioned. Just as I didn't know about bootsec.dos. So I have to thank you again and again.

And thanks for the other links as well, the Australian one seems very interesting.

Well... I'm sure glad you answer my call for help. Thank you.