*Pics of my new rifle*

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: cmp1223
Well, I would first have faith that our system of checks and balances, distribution of power, and the check of the press and of course the voting public, would keep this from happening as it has since 1776. And if it ever did become the Stalin-esque regime you speak of, i probably wouldn't fight, because if those future americans couldn't have solved it already without guns, i doubt they will solve it with guns. By the time that happens, the sipir of america has already been lost.

Anything can happen. Tomorrow, the government could declare martial law and tanks could be going through our neighborhoods. It can happen, and it can happen suddenly. That is why the second amendment is there. It clearly says in the second amendment "to insure the security of a free state". Don't be so naiive to think that it could never happen just because we've been lucky enough so for for it not to. And again, I am sure it will never happen- but it can.


We have a little thing in this country called freedom. We don't live in a society of needs. We live in a society of wants. You want two cars, yet a car is more likely to be used to end someone's life. And if I want to own an AR15, I will. And if I abuse that right, it will be taken away. Thats how the system works. Felon's cannot own guns.

Put an AR15 in someone's hands and they do not become a blood thirsty mass murderer, and no matter how much you or Diane Feinstein or Bill Clinton says it, it doesn't make it true. Again, look at the other hundreds of thousands of AR15 owning people that use theirs for the same reason as I use mine- to blast sh*t at the range because it's a blast- if you ever tried it I bet you'd love it, and for home protection.

 

[DJFuji]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Originally posted by: jciiv

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Originally posted by: Specop 007
Because theres so many drive by bayonettings......

LOL. Good point. I find that rationale irritating as to why they outlaw throwing stars but guns are fine...

Originally posted by: Specop 007
Very light recoil, good terminal ballistics, cheap rounds. Its an excellent gun. And more then capable of going 1000 yards. Very good round, just not big enough (In my mind) for deer.

I'm not aware of any M16 or standard variation thereof that can fire a 5.56mm round with >1000yd accuracy on point targets. Even area target accuracy is max 800 yds with the m16 and its more accurate than the M4s. Are you talking about some specialized sniper rifle firing the 5.56?

M16s can hit point targets at 600yrds and area targets at 800 yrds. You're correct.

But the M16 is not more accurate than the M4- it just has more range. Out to about 300yrds, An M4 will shoot about the same as an 16. The M16 just has a longer bbl which gives more velocity, which gives more range. A shortner bbl is actually a little more accurate than a longer one since it is more stout and has less bbl whip and harmoic vibration.

It's actually technically "550 meters" but i'll let ya slide on that one... Yeah, what i meant by "more accurate" was that it can hit more accurately at longer ranges. But you know what i meant. I'm still wondering what that "1000+ yds" meant with that other guy.

Hey DJ - don't Marines have to qualify @ 500 yards yearly? Army is 100 correct? I was about to point out the 300 yards accuracy thing but seems like you did that quite well

BTW - is Palm Springs a Marine or a Navy base?

Yes, that's correct-- Marines have to qualify at 200/300/500 meters every year. The 500 is pushing the limits on the theoretical 550m maximum effective range but hitting the target is actually easier than you think assuming your target is DEAD still, you're in the prone with a good minute for setup and target acquisition, and you're a good marksman. Breathing is most important on the 500yd line.

I'm not sure what the Army qualifies at...i thought it was 200m or something. I know for a fact that it's not 500 though. One of the differences between the Army and USMC is like the difference between a startup software development company and Microsoft. At Microsoft (aka the Army), theyre large enough where you have a specialized role so that the DBAs can specialize and not have to worry about coding or designing web sites. At the startup company (aka USMC), you're so freakin small that you have to wear many hats. And because the company probably specializes in a certain niche market of software, everyone is probably a developer FIRST and a dba/design guy/network tech SECOND. In the USMC every Marine is a rifleman. We give the Army hell all the time but in reality we simply serve different purposes. The Army is like the machine gunner- slow, immobile, but lots of firepower. The USMC is like the scout-- quick, easily deployable, but not designed for major sustained combat operations.

If you're talking about 29 Palms, that's a Marine base. I'm not sure if there's another separate base in Palm Springs though.

Sorry for the length...

 

[DJFuji]

Originally posted by: cmp1223
Well, I would first have faith that our system of checks and balances, distribution of power, and the check of the press and of course the voting public, would keep this from happening as it has since 1776. And if it ever did become the Stalin-esque regime you speak of, i probably wouldn't fight, because if those future americans couldn't have solved it already without guns, i doubt they will solve it with guns. By the time that happens, the sipir of america has already been lost.

Wow. I'm pretty confident of the govt too but cmon man. Take off the blinders already. Do you also think we should have no interest in foreign affairs and just worry about our own nation and not about other countries? Just pretend that because we're the most powerful nation at this point, we don't have to worry about anyone else?

Sorry for the pseudo-P&N diversion...i'm not trying to make this a political thing, just trying to say that being complacent only makes you an easy target.

"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance" ?Thomas Jefferson

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Originally posted by: jciiv

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Originally posted by: Specop 007
Because theres so many drive by bayonettings......

LOL. Good point. I find that rationale irritating as to why they outlaw throwing stars but guns are fine...

Originally posted by: Specop 007
Very light recoil, good terminal ballistics, cheap rounds. Its an excellent gun. And more then capable of going 1000 yards. Very good round, just not big enough (In my mind) for deer.

I'm not aware of any M16 or standard variation thereof that can fire a 5.56mm round with >1000yd accuracy on point targets. Even area target accuracy is max 800 yds with the m16 and its more accurate than the M4s. Are you talking about some specialized sniper rifle firing the 5.56?

M16s can hit point targets at 600yrds and area targets at 800 yrds. You're correct.

But the M16 is not more accurate than the M4- it just has more range. Out to about 300yrds, An M4 will shoot about the same as an 16. The M16 just has a longer bbl which gives more velocity, which gives more range. A shortner bbl is actually a little more accurate than a longer one since it is more stout and has less bbl whip and harmoic vibration.

It's actually technically "550 meters" but i'll let ya slide on that one... Yeah, what i meant by "more accurate" was that it can hit more accurately at longer ranges. But you know what i meant. I'm still wondering what that "1000+ yds" meant with that other guy.

Hey DJ - don't Marines have to qualify @ 500 yards yearly? Army is 100 correct? I was about to point out the 300 yards accuracy thing but seems like you did that quite well

BTW - is Palm Springs a Marine or a Navy base?

Yes, that's correct-- Marines have to qualify at 200/300/500 meters every year. The 500 is pushing the limits on the theoretical 550m maximum effective range but hitting the target is actually easier than you think assuming your target is DEAD still, you're in the prone with a good minute for setup and target acquisition, and you're a good marksman. Breathing is most important on the 500yd line.

I'm not sure what the Army qualifies at...i thought it was 200m or something. I know for a fact that it's not 500 though. One of the differences between the Army and USMC is like the difference between a startup software development company and Microsoft. At Microsoft (aka the Army), theyre large enough where you have a specialized role so that the DBAs can specialize and not have to worry about coding or designing web sites. At the startup company (aka USMC), you're so freakin small that you have to wear many hats. And because the company probably specializes in a certain niche market of software, everyone is probably a developer FIRST and a dba/design guy/network tech SECOND. In the USMC every Marine is a rifleman. We give the Army hell all the time but in reality we simply serve different purposes. The Army is like the machine gunner- slow, immobile, but lots of firepower. The USMC is like the scout-- quick, easily deployable, but not designed for major sustained combat operations.

If you're talking about 29 Palms, that's a Marine base. I'm not sure if there's another separate base in Palm Springs though.

Sorry for the length...

I believe the Army does at 50, and 300 meters. Which is also know as the "improved battle sight" for the AR15 family. POA/POI is the same at 50 and 300 meters with this set up.

 

[shortylickens]

Originally posted by: MisterFloppy

Originally posted by: shortylickens
Nice links. But I prefer to shop at RedWolfAirSoft.
I got the G3SAS (Tokyo Marui) with Level 4 upgrade. Was also foolish enough to pay for the desert camo paintjob.

The damn thing shipped with the generic plastic piston. It stripped after about 100 rounds. Cost me $65 plus parts to have it fixed here in the US.

But (overall) an excellent gun.

(P.S. If you have no clue what the heck I am talking about, then it wasnt meant for you.)

Uhhh sir, I believe you are lost, this thread is about real firearms.

Uhhh, Ohhh, Ummmm, Geee, Ahhh, no its not ma'am.
So far it has been about real guns and fake guns and stalin and 2nd amendment and people feeling safe and people being safe and our rights and your rights and his rights and marshall law and Diane Feinstein and having stuff in your house and various other odds and ends.

Am tremendously sorry if your happy little thread has taken a turn into other things sweetie.

BYATCH!

 

[DJFuji]

Originally posted by: shortylickens

Originally posted by: MisterFloppy

Originally posted by: shortylickens
Nice links. But I prefer to shop at RedWolfAirSoft.
I got the G3SAS (Tokyo Marui) with Level 4 upgrade. Was also foolish enough to pay for the desert camo paintjob.

The damn thing shipped with the generic plastic piston. It stripped after about 100 rounds. Cost me $65 plus parts to have it fixed here in the US.

But (overall) an excellent gun.

(P.S. If you have no clue what the heck I am talking about, then it wasnt meant for you.)

Uhhh sir, I believe you are lost, this thread is about real firearms.

Uhhh, Ohhh, Ummmm, Geee, Ahhh, no its not ma'am.
So far it has been about real guns and fake guns and stalin and 2nd amendment and people feeling safe and people being safe and our rights and your rights and his rights and marshall law and Diane Feinstein and having stuff in your house and various other odds and ends.

Am tremendously sorry if your happy little thread has taken a turn into other things sweetie. In the mean time, I do believe your mother misses you terribly and needs you back in the nursery.

BYATCH!

lol are all of your 489 posts trolling or did i get lucky and just find this one?

 

[shortylickens]

Nope, this is my first and last troll. Check my past messages if you feel like it.
It was a long time coming, and I feel so much better.
Amusing, because when I had about 8 posts, some guy did the same thing to me.
Now that I have it out of my system, I'll go autoeroticise someplace.

I'd also like to apologize, (just for the mother remark). I should know better, having been here for a while.

In an effort to help the current thread: if I were not stationed in CA, I would go for the Bushmaster .308 models.
If the accuracy on the range is any indication, I would rather have a 7.62 over a 5.56 for putting someone down.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Sheepathon
he's just gonna use it for "sport"

Whats wrong with that again?

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: shortylickens
Nope, this is my first and last troll. Check my past messages if you feel like it.
It was a long time coming, and I feel so much better.
Amusing, because when I had about 8 posts, some guy did the same thing to me.
Now that I have it out of my system, I'll go autoeroticise someplace.

I'd also like to apologize, (just for the mother remark). I should know better, having been here for a while.

In an effort to help the current thread: if I were not stationed in CA, I would go for the Bushmaster .308 models.
If the accuracy on the range is any indication, I would rather have a 7.62 over a 5.56 for putting someone down.

Have you seen the 5.56mm ballistic results? Damned impresive.

http://www.ammo-oracle.com

inside 300 meters or so, 5.56mm is superior to standard 7.62 ball.

 

[jciiv]

here is another pic for you antis.

http://www.boomspeed.com/heimei/bayo.jpg

Look out! hide your children! The inanimate object is going to kill them!


For you people who understand logic and have half a brain, thats a Phrobis III M9 bayonet. Also it looks funny because a bayonet doesn't fit properly on a 16" barrel. But you get the idea

 

[thirdlegstump]

Great. Another KILLER on the loose.

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: deathkoba
Great. Another KILLER on the loose.

:roll:

Unless that was sarcasm.

 

[booger711]

i feel like playing cs now

 

[RagingBITCH]

Originally posted by: DJFuji

Yes, that's correct-- Marines have to qualify at 200/300/500 meters every year. The 500 is pushing the limits on the theoretical 550m maximum effective range but hitting the target is actually easier than you think assuming your target is DEAD still, you're in the prone with a good minute for setup and target acquisition, and you're a good marksman. Breathing is most important on the 500yd line.

I'm not sure what the Army qualifies at...i thought it was 200m or something. I know for a fact that it's not 500 though. One of the differences between the Army and USMC is like the difference between a startup software development company and Microsoft. At Microsoft (aka the Army), theyre large enough where you have a specialized role so that the DBAs can specialize and not have to worry about coding or designing web sites. At the startup company (aka USMC), you're so freakin small that you have to wear many hats. And because the company probably specializes in a certain niche market of software, everyone is probably a developer FIRST and a dba/design guy/network tech SECOND. In the USMC every Marine is a rifleman. We give the Army hell all the time but in reality we simply serve different purposes. The Army is like the machine gunner- slow, immobile, but lots of firepower. The USMC is like the scout-- quick, easily deployable, but not designed for major sustained combat operations.

If you're talking about 29 Palms, that's a Marine base. I'm not sure if there's another separate base in Palm Springs though.

Sorry for the length...

Ahh ok, thanks for the clarification. And yea, I meant 29 Palms. My brother in law went to boot at Pendleton (he's a Navy medic, did the 2 month condensed boot, he just can't wear the honor guard uniform). He and my sister are saying Palms is, um, about the last choice of bases anyone wants to be stationed at. Didn't know if you had personal experience to comment on that or not

 

[jciiv]

Some more pics.

http://www.boomspeed.com/heimei/AR4.jpg

a little blurry, but it says "RESTRICTED MILITARY GOVT/LAW ENFORCEMENT EXPORT USE ONLY"

So glad the AWB died.


http://www.boomspeed.com/heimei/AR5.jpg

 

[Staples]

Be careful not to shoot yourself.

I love it when that happens.

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: Staples
Be careful not to shoot yourself.

I love it when that happens.

Only idiots shoot themselves.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: Yellow Dog
That is not a rifle, that is an assualt weapon. How soon till we hear about you on the news when you kill a dozen people in your school, or place of work?.

What you just said ranks among the dumbest things I've ever heard on here. What part of buying a gun (that you don't approve of) MAKES you want to kill "a dozen people in your school, or place of work?" Do you need a gun like that to kill a dozen or so people? You can do that with a pistol.

You have an irrational fear of that gun. It looks like what you see on TV being called an "assault rifle", but put a different stock on it and it becomes something else.

 

[Mookow]

Originally posted by: jciiv
Have you seen the 5.56mm ballistic results? Damned impresive.

http://www.ammo-oracle.com

inside 300 meters or so, 5.56mm is superior to standard 7.62 ball.

You need to re-read that. The terminal ballistics on 5.56mm ball against flesh is only superior when it fragments. From the ammo oracle chart, that means for 20" barrels, M193 fragments reliably out to about 200m, and M855 out to 150m. For a 16" barrel, those numbers drop to 150m and 90m.

And if you want to see real fragmentation, read the bit about the West German manufactured 7.62mm with the thin jacket. Chunky.

Besides, if you made a bullet in 7.62mm NATO along the lines of the M193 or M855 in terms of construction, that hypothetical 7.62mm round would spank the M855 or M193.

 

[91TTZ]

Originally posted by: cmp1223
Well, I would first have faith that our system of checks and balances, distribution of power, and the check of the press and of course the voting public, would keep this from happening as it has since 1776. And if it ever did become the Stalin-esque regime you speak of, i probably wouldn't fight, because if those future americans couldn't have solved it already without guns, i doubt they will solve it with guns. By the time that happens, the sipir of america has already been lost.

Translation: you aren't a real man who stands up for your rights. If your government takes away your rights, it's for the best and you feel safer now.

This statement was more senseless than the rest of your post:

And if it ever did become the Stalin-esque regime you speak of, i probably wouldn't fight, because if those future americans couldn't have solved it already without guns, i doubt they will solve it with guns

That's nonsense. If that were true, there'd never be any wars at all, because "if people couldn't have solved it already without guns, i doubt they will solve it with guns".

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: Mookow

Originally posted by: jciiv
Have you seen the 5.56mm ballistic results? Damned impresive.

http://www.ammo-oracle.com

inside 300 meters or so, 5.56mm is superior to standard 7.62 ball.

You need to re-read that. The terminal ballistics on 5.56mm ball against flesh is only superior when it fragments. From the ammo oracle chart, that means for 20" barrels, M193 fragments reliably out to about 200m, and M855 out to 150m. For a 16" barrel, those numbers drop to 150m and 90m.

And if you want to see real fragmentation, read the bit about the West German manufactured 7.62mm with the thin jacket. Chunky.

Besides, if you made a bullet in 7.62mm NATO along the lines of the M193 or M855 in terms of construction, that hypothetical 7.62mm round would spank the M855 or M193.

5.56mm (m193) does fragment when the velocity is over 2700 fps. So as long as you're within that range, you should be good. But the new 75gr. TAP will fragment even out of a 11.5" bbl.

So the way I see it, with the lighter weight you can carry more ammo, and have better follow up shots.

So within normal combat ranges, a gun in 5.56mm is pretty unbeatable, on the whole.



I agree that a fragmenting bullet in a larger caliber would spank M855 or M193.

 

[MikeMike]

can i sum this thread up?

REDNECKS

the end

MIKE

 

[MagicConch]

Originally posted by: 3NF
What do you shoot with that, people?

That much fire power is necessary for real home security in today's America (maybe not, but maybe so). Besides it's the principal of the thing. Once these type of guns begin to be banned, it sets a precedent that will allow enroachment on this freedom to become easier and easier. More and more acceptable until bans that would be obviously wrong today become possible.

One thing those who despise guns forget is that these strong individuals are that they ones who protect America from harm when fit hits the shan. We all enjoy the security of the military - how would that be possible without guns. Yet still these guys have to fight a personal war for the 'privledge' to protect the very people who want to rip the 2nd ammendment from the constitution.

That's how the guy who used to own my of my house sold his point of view. :laugh: I am sitting in the converted 'gun room' now (ie office now). there were racks of guns and dead heads of animals hung on the wall. lol.

 

[jciiv]

Originally posted by: nourdmrolNMT1
can i sum this thread up?

REDNECKS

the end

MIKE

If I would sum this thread up:

Men with logic debunking asinine liberal propaganda.

 

[Mookow]

Originally posted by: jciiv

Originally posted by: Mookow
You need to re-read that. The terminal ballistics on 5.56mm ball against flesh is only superior when it fragments. From the ammo oracle chart, that means for 20" barrels, M193 fragments reliably out to about 200m, and M855 out to 150m. For a 16" barrel, those numbers drop to 150m and 90m.

And if you want to see real fragmentation, read the bit about the West German manufactured 7.62mm with the thin jacket. Chunky.

Besides, if you made a bullet in 7.62mm NATO along the lines of the M193 or M855 in terms of construction, that hypothetical 7.62mm round would spank the M855 or M193.

5.56mm (m193) does fragment when the velocity is over 2700 fps. So as long as you're within that range, you should be good. But the new 75gr. TAP will fragment even out of a 11.5" bbl.

So the way I see it, with the lighter weight you can carry more ammo, and have better follow up shots.

So within normal combat ranges, a gun in 5.56mm is pretty unbeatable, on the whole.

I agree that a fragmenting bullet in a larger caliber would spank M855 or M193.

Are we comparing ball, or any ammo? Hornady TAP rounds certainly arent ball, and I doubt that they will ever be used by the military in large numbers.

Besides, having spoken to someone who put 5 solid torso hits into a running Iraqi, an Iraqi who continued to fight effectively for another five minutes or so, my faith in the M855 very very small. Especially out of shorter barrels, it doesnt have the legs or the balls to be considered an adequate combat round. Now, granted the recoil and weight of the 5.56mm is lower than just about any alternative out there, but when you can put five solid torso shots on a man and he doesnt go down... you've given up too much power unless it was a total fluke. And it wasnt much of a fluke.