Photo colors in ACDSee vs. PS

[daniel1113]

For the first time, I've decided to order some high quality prints of many of my digital photographs. To make sure that they come out with the correct colors, contrast, etc. I've been paying close attention to my photo workflow. I've recently noticed that my photos look considerably different in Photoshop compared to ACDSee.

In ACDSee, the colors are vibrant, the blacks are dark, and the photos look great. But in PS, the colors are washed out, as if the brightness and contrast have been tweaked.

All my photos are JPEGs using sRGB, and both apps are set to use sRGB profiles. Any ideas why photos look so different in each program? I sure as hell can't figure it out.

Any help is much appreciated.

 

[QuixoticOne]

Check to see if there is any output device color profile that is being used such that PS / ACDSee is assuming a different gamma or color profile or whatever for your screen. Also check your rendering intent as to whether it is perceptual, relative colorimetric, absolute, or what.

Calibrate your monitor as well and that should minimize the discrepancy of colors once everything else is properly set.

Also check your GPU / video card related color calibration curves or whatever and make sure that your image viewer S/W isn't applying a correction for your monitor AND then your video card color calibration S/W isn't applying a second correction to that. (whereas a program that displayed an uncorrected image would display correctly if global system video card tables / curves would fix it at that level)

http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/#gammacalib
http://www.bryce-alive.net/calibrate/
http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

 

[daniel1113]

Thanks, QuixoticOne. I did a quick check last night, and it didn't look like my GPU was applying any adjustments, nor did I find any other software adjustments being made. I'll check my monitor profile when I get a chance this evening.

This brings up another question. Is it not a good idea to use the profile for my monitor (in my case, a Dell 2408WFP)?

 

[Mark R]

Originally posted by: daniel1113
This brings up another question. Is it not a good idea to use the profile for my monitor (in my case, a Dell 2408WFP)?

It is essential to do so. The color profile (range of colors that the monitor can display) is different to the gamma/brightness curve (how bright a specific pixel value is displayed).

Gamma/brightness is easily measured using cheap calibration hardware, and there is good support in video cards to adjust the curves to correct for any hardware discrepancies.

Color profile is not something that is easily measured, and cannot be calibrated against. With a monitor with non-standard color response (like the 2008WFP), it's essential that you use the manufacturer supplied color profile data so that windows/apps can make the appropriate color conversions. Note that windows will only perform color conversions for apps that are specifically written with color profiles in mind - so you shouldn't have a situation where double conversion is applied.

An alternative to setting the color profile, is to see if you monitor has an sRGB emulation setting - this will have the monitor perform appropriate conversion between sRGB and its non-standard response. If you then set all software to sRGB, then you shouldn't run into problems with software incompatibilities.

 

[daniel1113]

Alright. I've played around a bit, and here's where I'm currently at. I was able to match the colors in Photoshop and ACDSee by adjusting the monitor profile in ACDSee from the default "sRGB.icm" to the correct profile for my monitor ("2408wfp.icm"). Therefore, in both programs, I am using the following:

Input profile/working space: sRGB (if no other embedded profile is specified)
Monitor profile: 2408wfp

I am also using the 2408wfp profile as the default monitor profile in Windows.

This is all well and good, but I'd like to build upon the information posted above by Mark R (which, by the way, is much appreciated). My monitor does include an sRGB setting; however, I have avoided it since it produces an extremely dull image compared to the default desktop profile. Without getting into an ideal setup with a correctly calibrated monitor using an external hardware utility, what would be the proper setup:

1. Setting my monitor to the sRGB mode and using the sRGB monitor profile both in Windows as well as all of my programs.
2. Setting my monitor to the default mode and using the 2408wfp monitor profile in Windows as well as all of my programs.

Sorry for all the questions. This whole thing just seems to be way more complicated than it needs to be

 

[daniel1113]

I think I may have made a mistake. As soon as I save an image in Photoshop and open it in a program such as Firefox, the colors are different. They are much less dull, just the same as the difference that I originally had between Photoshop and ACDSee.

 

[Mark R]

This is the issue of color profiles.

sRGB is a pretty good match for standard monitors. Image files set up for sRGB should appear approximately correct on normal monitors.
The 2008WFP has 'wide gamut' color capability - it can display a wider range, including more vibrant, colors than a conventional monitor. The problem is that it will falsly display images with over saturated colors.

If Windows is correctly set up with the color profile for the monitor, then certain apps (e.g. photoshop) will take advantage of this data and will compensate when they display photos - so a photo loaded in photoshop will appear as it should do. However, windows will only correct for apps specifically designed with color matching in mind - firefox, desktop, etc. are not corrected - so if you save a photo in photoshop, and load it up in firefox, the firefox version will appear falsly 'enhanced'.

If you set the monitor to sRGB, you lose the additional capabilities of the monitor - but everything will appear correct (assuming you use sRGB profile), as this is the standard setting that windows uses, and in which images are normally saved.

So you have 2 options:
1. Set monitor to default, and use appropriate profile: photoshop appears correct, plus can take advantage of wider color range when print matching. Everything else appears with distorted colors.
2. Set monitor to sRGB. Everything appears correct, but you get no advantage of the enhanced color range available from your monitor.

 

[daniel1113]

That makes perfect sense. Thanks for taking the time to respond, Mark R.

Of course, it would be nice if all apps used the embedded profiles to display the correct colors (approximately, anyway). A while back, I thought I read that Firefox 3 and some other browsers had the capability of using profiles. Perhaps that just needs to be enabled. Of course, who knows how these photos will appear in browsers on other computers. What a pain in the ass... lol.