Pesky crash during XP install

[tcsenter]

Family member wanted me to get a DELL GX620 Optiplex upgraded and running. It came with XP Pro but had some sort of PUW/adware/malware on it (advertising pop-ups every 24 hours). I added 1GB RAM to the existing 1GB, also upgraded the CPU from single-core Pentium 4 (90nm) to dual-core Pentium D (65nm). According to a few online posts about this Dell system, it can support this Pentium D (and the latest BIOS properly recognizes it).

After installing the upgrades, I tested them (ran memtest and such) on the XP installation it came with. Also did a complete CHKDSK with media verify (no bad blocks/sectors). Satisfied the hardware was OK, I wiped the drive and installed Windows Vista x64 (from DVD) just to see how it ran. I used the computer for about four days, no crashes or problems at all. Then I ran Ubuntu 12.04 from LiveUSB key to see how that ran. It ran fine but I didn't really like it, and ultimately decided to put XP back on it.

XP crashes during installation, with errors that are very consistent with either bad RAM or installation media (e.g. CD with some unreadable/bad sectors). I replaced the RAM with two known-good modules (as I said, I have extra RAM here). Same crash. Then I figured it was the CD media, so I tried MULTIPLE different installation disks (I have several). XP Home w/SP2 and XP Pro w/SP2. Both genuine pressed reinstallation CDs from DELL that I've used before. Same crash. I then thought maybe it was the CD/DVD drive, so I created a USB key and tried to install from that. Same crash (CRC error).

Only thing I can think of now is the new CPU?? But why would Ubuntu, Vista, and now W7 all install and run with no crashes or error, only XP won't install without crashing!

 

[Virgorising]

My now backup Optiplex is a GX620, still a very fine machine, mine still perfect, now running W7 32 bit.

I am assuming yr new CPU is the Presler? I got mine with that, chose that specifically, P D @3.40....still a good chip for dual core, and it was ne of the factory options; upgraded my 620 to 3GBS of DDR2.

So, if yr new chip is the Presler, yr CPU is not the issue.

Have you tested yr RAM?

If you were able to install the other OSs successfully via yr optical drive.....the original optical drive in the GX 620 is IED....we know that's not yr problem.

Might you have a copy of W7 available? Esp given MS will end support for XP in April. OK hold on....I see you did install W7, at least you say in passing. If I may ask, why would you want to load XP at this point? Especially if 7 installed normally?

 

[VirtualLarry]

Something just occurred to me - perhaps the BIOS doesn't have the newest microcode update for that CPU after all.

Vista, Win7, and Linux, AFAIK, all load a low-level CPU microcode driver to load the newest microcode on boot. Those OSes were produced after that CPU was, so they should all have mature microcode for that CPU. Whereas, the XP install disc may not.

I'll pop in again if I think of anything else.

Edit: Oh, tried swapping in a known-good PSU? Just for kicks...

 

[Virgorising]

Something just occurred to me - perhaps the BIOS doesn't have the newest microcode update for that CPU after all.

Vista, Win7, and Linux, AFAIK, all load a low-level CPU microcode driver to load the newest microcode on boot. Those OSes were produced after that CPU was, so they should all have mature microcode for that CPU. Whereas, the XP install disc may not.

I'll pop in again if I think of anything else.

OMG, this could be seriously brilliant!!!!:biggrin:

Cept my 620 with the Presler chip came with XP Pro (as it did from the factory)......and I did clean install with no problem.

 

[Mushkins]

It's that new CPU causing this, and it 100% makes sense that everything *but* those Dell XP disks works just fine.

You're using those Dell pressed XP recovery disks. Those pull the XP product key from the BIOS. The product key is bound to that BIOS, and the specific major hardware setup the PC shipped with, AKA the old processor. The new processor being in there is invalidating the install procedure, that Dell disk is throwing an error when it tries to use the hard-coded XP key but sees different hardware and thinks you're trying to trick it into installing on a different PC.

The only way to use that Dell media with the new processor is to ship it back to Dell and have their techs reset the hardware profile associated with that XP key. Pretty sure it's long out of warranty, so that goes out the window.

If you're dead-set on XP with that new processor, you'll need to use an OEM XP install disk thats NOT one of those Dell recovery disks. It will still take the Dell OEM XP key on the sticker and install, but it may not pass windows activation. You can call Microsoft at that point and they'll walk you through getting it activated. If you ever have to reinstall and reactivate past April however, you're hosed.

Personally, i'd dump at least Vista on it and call it a day.

 

[Virgorising]

It's that new CPU causing this, and it 100% makes sense that everything *but* those Dell XP disks works just fine.

You're using those Dell pressed XP recovery disks. Those pull the XP product key from the BIOS. The product key is bound to that BIOS, and the specific major hardware setup the PC shipped with, AKA the old processor. The new processor being in there is invalidating the install procedure, that Dell disk is throwing an error when it tries to use the hard-coded XP key but sees different hardware and thinks you're trying to trick it into installing on a different PC.

The only way to use that Dell media with the new processor is to ship it back to Dell and have their techs reset the hardware profile associated with that XP key. Pretty sure it's long out of warranty, so that goes out the window.

If you're dead-set on XP with that new processor, you'll need to use an OEM XP install disk thats NOT one of those Dell recovery disks. It will still take the Dell OEM XP key on the sticker and install, but it may not pass windows activation. You can call Microsoft at that point and they'll walk you through getting it activated. If you ever have to reinstall and reactivate past April however, you're hosed.

Personally, i'd dump at least Vista on it and call it a day.

I thought he said he tried several XP disks all of which had worked in several systems? But I just went back and looked and now, not sure....he may be saying he has several, but the ones he tried were OEM.

And re running Vista on that system, it runs flawlessly with W7. Ran better with 7 than it did with XP Pro. Why would anyone choose to run VISTA??? Esp given the facts.

 

[Mushkins]

I thought he said he tried several XP disks all of which had worked in several systems?

I'm sure they worked in several *other* systems, that were Dells that did not have major hardware changes. There's nothing wrong with those disks, just the configuration the OP is trying to use them in.

XP Home w/SP2 and XP Pro w/SP2. Both genuine pressed reinstallation CDs from DELL that I've used before. Same crash.

 

[Virgorising]

I'm sure they worked in several *other* systems, that were Dells that did not have major hardware changes.

Yes, I caught that and posted when I did.:biggrin:

But I think he is saying he may have either a retail or volume license copy of XP...not sure. But it should be moot, given I think he says he was able install W7 normally.

As was I a while back when I upgraded my 620 from XP.

 

[chemwiz]

Can you put the old CPU back in for the XP install, then just swap the new one back in?

 

[Virgorising]

Can you put the old CPU back in for the XP install, then just swap the new one back in?

Why would he do that? Go thru that trouble, given it will not be safe to run XP in not long from now, and given his CPU upgrade was all thumbs up given the reality of the Presler chip in that system; it was built for that chip; that was the best one someone could order from the factory.

What is the point of installing XP at all? Not to mention the changes inherent in a CPU upgrade, not usually not for Intel to Intel upgrade, forget Presler came with a lot of the 620s.

Unless he is just curious re his inability to load XP....I would like to know why he doesn't just go with W7?

 

[tcsenter]

Because they already have a license to use XP (via the SLP OEM BIOS or the product key from COA) and I'd need to charge them for any copy of W7. I installed Vista because initially thought maybe the BIOS supported OEM activation for Vista as well but it appears this model/series never shipped with Vista (not even by special order), so it only supports SLP 1.0 for XP OEM activation.

I'll try a non-Dell (straight from Microsoft) copy of XP w/SP3. I have a few around here somewhere, just need to find them under the clutter of spare computer stuff.

Thanks for the responses!

 

[Virgorising]

I'll try a non-Dell (straight from Microsoft) copy of XP w/SP3. I have a few around here somewhere, just need to find them under the clutter of spare computer stuff.

Yes, thanks for clarification. I did think from yr initial post you had infinite XP disks. Well, lots.

But again, I can't imagine why.....given you were able to install 7, why would you want to load XP? What would be the upside of that...again, given the risk of running it after mid April, and, given the 620 with the Presler chip runs better with W7 than it did with what was factory loaded: XP Pro.

 

[chemwiz]

Virgorising, about half the desktops out there still run XP, I'm guessing he has his reasons. Maybe he doesn't want to pop $100 for a different version of Windows. What's the big deal about swapping a CPU, after all the work he's done already another five minutes isn't a big deal. I work for a lot of different offices that still run XP, mostly because of software compatibility issues.

 

[tcsenter]

I've already explained it. XP is free for them (the machine already has a license to use it), they would need to pay for a copy of Win7.

 

[Virgorising]

Because they already have a license to use XP (via the SLP OEM BIOS or the product key from COA) and I'd need to charge them for any copy of W7. I installed Vista because initially thought maybe the BIOS supported OEM activation for Vista as well but it appears this model/series never shipped with Vista (not even by special order), so it only supports SLP 1.0 for XP OEM activation.

I'll try a non-Dell (straight from Microsoft) copy of XP w/SP3. I have a few around here somewhere, just need to find them under the clutter of spare computer stuff.

Thanks for the responses!

Virgorising, about half the desktops out there still run XP, I'm guessing he has his reasons. Maybe he doesn't want to pop $100 for a different version of Windows. What's the big deal about swapping a CPU, after all the work he's done already another five minutes isn't a big deal. I work for a lot of different offices that still run XP, mostly because of software compatibility issues.

I know. I actually posted that here a while back when someone dissed someone for running XP....and expect many people and businesses will continue past April all over the world.

 

[Virgorising]

I've already explained it. XP is free for them (the machine already has a license to use it), they would need to pay for a copy of Win7.

Thanks for reiterating; sorry I missed it. But I remain unclear re the reality of the copy of W7 you were able to install. Are you saying you were not able to validate/authenticate it in the system?

if yr other copies of XP are retail, you should not have any problems.

Might your relative have original media for the GX620 somewhere? If he or she was the original owner and the machine is registered in his or her name---I think never too late to do that, by the way--- Dell will send original replacement media.

 

[VirtualLarry]

You're using those Dell pressed XP recovery disks. Those pull the XP product key from the BIOS. The product key is bound to that BIOS, and the specific major hardware setup the PC shipped with, AKA the old processor. The new processor being in there is invalidating the install procedure, that Dell disk is throwing an error when it tries to use the hard-coded XP key but sees different hardware and thinks you're trying to trick it into installing on a different PC.

Not true. I've used various SP2 and SP3 "Dell OEM Restore" discs on multiple PCs to do installs. They will install on other PCs, they don't blue-screen just because the OEM SLP key doesn't match. They won't activate though, on other hardware, so they only run for 30 days. But they definitely don't error during the install.

 

[Virgorising]

Not true. I've used various SP2 and SP3 "Dell OEM Restore" discs on multiple PCs to do installs. They will install on other PCs, they don't blue-screen just because the OEM SLP key doesn't match. They won't activate though, on other hardware, so they only run for 30 days. But they definitely don't error during the install.

Good offering. I never tried that, so I din know. But simple logic says, OEM should install but not pass activation.

 

[Virgorising]

Just found this:

https://www.dell.com/support/diagno...me?c=us&l=en&s=bsd&DoNotRedirect=y&redirect=1

Again, if the system is registered in the name of yr relative, Dell will send the media. I would also do real time chat using service tag. Then, you find out immediately what the deal is.

But what are the odds of two OEM disks failing to load?

Lets see what happens when he finds one of his not OEM copies of XP and tries it.

 

[Virgorising]

Afterthought:

When U get whichever OS loaded with current bios, up to date drivers, patches, etc...

....assuming this machine is an ATX MT, and not one of the smaller configurations, to preclude this kinda misery in the future, I suggest you install a backup HDD in the empty slot in the HDD bay...
....get a nice, free cloning app and Easy BCD, clone current drive to backup drive, and show yr relative how to do that on a regular basis.

Along, of course, with a little tutorial about protection apps.

So kind of you to be doing this!!!!!!:thumbsup:

 

[Matt1970]

It's that new CPU causing this, and it 100% makes sense that everything *but* those Dell XP disks works just fine.

You're using those Dell pressed XP recovery disks. Those pull the XP product key from the BIOS. The product key is bound to that BIOS, and the specific major hardware setup the PC shipped with, AKA the old processor. The new processor being in there is invalidating the install procedure, that Dell disk is throwing an error when it tries to use the hard-coded XP key but sees different hardware and thinks you're trying to trick it into installing on a different PC.

Personally, i'd dump at least Vista on it and call it a day.

Not true. I've used various SP2 and SP3 "Dell OEM Restore" discs on multiple PCs to do installs. They will install on other PCs, they don't blue-screen just because the OEM SLP key doesn't match. They won't activate though, on other hardware, so they only run for 30 days. But they definitely don't error during the install.

Virtual Larry is right. In fact Windows 8 is the first OS to put an actual product key in the BIOS.

 

[Virgorising]

Virtual Larry is right. In fact Windows 8 is the first OS to put an actual product key in the BIOS.

Indeed, was immediately clear from Virtual Larry's first, inspired post.

But, owning ALL the info alos means getting original media drom Dell would be a waste of time, given the hardware that opti shopped with. Again, my 620 shipped with the Presler chip, the one he upgraded the system to.

Now, the reason the OP offered for wanting to install XP, was that his relative paid for that. But, even while when he finds one of his non OEM copies of XP and it will install....there is no reason it should not, what the original owner paid for issue, will REMAIN MOOT.

Given that, and, given the OP shares he installed a copy of W7 normally.....then that would be the obvious choice, assuming it can be activated, of course. I am not clear on the reality of his copy of 7, since he says they (the relatives) would have to pay for 7.

But would anyone choose to install VISTA, esp in the system in question.....forget ANY SYSTEM... WHEN a worldclass alternative is available and works normally? Again, if it can be activated.

I am still not clear on what not OEM media he has among his disks which can be not simply installed, but activated.

 

[tcsenter]

OK so it appears a genuine Microsoft hologram OEM System Builder CD for XP Pro w/SP2 installs without error. I'm going to do some more experimenting with DELL SLP discs.

 

[Virgorising]

OK so it appears a genuine Microsoft hologram OEM System Builder CD for XP Pro w/SP2 installs without error. I'm going to do some more experimenting with DELL SLP discs.

As expected. Not one reason that not OEM copy should not have worked. BUT again, the system isn't recognizing that installation as paid for. Not does it need to with any retail copy of ANY OS, it's all MOOT.

So.....can you please just say if you have a not OEM copy of Windows 7 which could be activated in the system like the retail copy of XP which naturally installed.... without their having to pay? Any not OEM copy

After all this time, I remain unclear on this.

MS licensing for each version of each OS is different. I think, sad, but true.

 

[tcsenter]

OK this is weird. There is NO SLIC string for SLP 1.0 in this Dell BIOS that I can find with ACPI dump or SLIC checker tools, which means it does not support OEM pre-activation. But the Product Key that was previously installed/used was NOT the product key from the COA (I obtained it using Magical JellyBean Key Finder prior to wiping it). The product key that was 'installed' does not resolve to any known OEM preactivation keys.

A Dell system that does NOT support OEM preactivation for the supported installed OS?? Weird.