Perhaps a bad Q9550?

[LxMxFxD4]

Last week I built a P5Q with an intel q9550 system and yesterday I added a XIGMATEK HDT-S1283 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler so I could start overclocking.

But... just to start I ran prime95 Large FFT with the following settings:

CPU @ 2.83ghz (stock) with 1.2V vcore (speedfan reads this as 1.18v) C1 revision edition
Geil PC8000 5-5-5-15 memory @ 500mhz @ 2.1V (as per spec) with 2:3 ratio giving the frontside bus a speed of 333mhz (stock)

When I got up this morning Prime 95 said "Hardware failure detected, consult stress.txt. Torture test ran 1 hours, 6 minutes - 1 errors, 0 warnings"

This was on core 4. The other 3 cores were still going. CPU temp was 63 degrees. Ambient temp was about 72-75.

So my question is - Is this a bad cpu?

Also - 63 degrees seems pretty high for stock speed. Is the HDT-S1283 a terrible cooler?

Thanks guys

 

[Big Lar]

Not sure on the cooler, I would try Everest for the temps and CPU-Z for the voltage for cpu in windows. Maybe Google Realtemp for the cpu temp alone, nice program.

May wanna try 1.25v for the cpu once you figure out what real temps you are getting. Would also be a Great idea to post your voltages from bios as well as ram settings and what bios version you are using.

Larry

 

[dguy6789]

Make sure your heatsink is mounted properly. Your heatsink uses those push pins. Install it with the motherboard outside of the case so that you can look under the board and be sure all four pins are completely sticking out of the bottom properly. Most people try to install push pin heatsinks when the motherboard is already in the case, this is a big no no. When putting the motherboard back into the case, do not touch it or use it to hold the board up, the pins are very sensitive. Also be sure that when you put memory in, you don't bend the board a little bit, because that is enough to make one of the pins come loose. One pin being not in all the way is enough to make a cpu fail prime 95.

Edit: You could look into buying this if you don't want to have to deal with push pins. I am not 100% sure it will work with your cooler though.

http://www.sidewindercomputers.com/lgbowiscsp.html

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
Geil PC8000 5-5-5-15 memory @ 500mhz @ 2.1V (as per spec) with 2:3 ratio giving the frontside bus a speed of 333mhz (stock)

Are you sure your memory is OK? Have you memtested it? Those are rather aggressive Vdimm, I had some Mushkin redline DDR2-1000 sticks that spec'ed at 2.1V and if I didn't actively cool them with 2x80mm fans then they'd overheat during stability tests (took multiple memtest passes to get them hot enough) and start erroring out.

 

[ashishmishra]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
Geil PC8000 5-5-5-15 memory @ 500mhz @ 2.1V (as per spec) with 2:3 ratio giving the frontside bus a speed of 333mhz (stock)

Are you sure your memory is OK? Have you memtested it? Those are rather aggressive Vdimm, I had some Mushkin redline DDR2-1000 sticks that spec'ed at 2.1V and if I didn't actively cool them with 2x80mm fans then they'd overheat during stability tests (took multiple memtest passes to get them hot enough) and start erroring out.

Yes, and large FFT mostly stresses RAM so it could be a error in the memory subsystem.

 

[error8]

Most likely the ram is guilty.

 

[Tempered81]

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4


When I got up this morning Prime 95 said "Hardware failure detected, consult stress.txt. Torture test ran 1 hours, 6 minutes - 1 errors, 0 warnings"

This was on core 4. The other 3 cores were still going. CPU temp was 63 degrees. Ambient temp was about 72-75.

So my question is - Is this a bad cpu?

Also - 63 degrees seems pretty high for stock speed. Is the HDT-S1283 a terrible cooler?

Thanks guys

1. not a bad cpu, just might like Vcore a little more than the others. what was cpu-z reading during prime?

2. no, s1283 is in the top 5 air coolers


edit:

Oh, and this too:

Originally posted by: Idontcare


Are you sure your memory is OK?

 

[n7]

Memtest86+

And the P5Qs overvolt by about 0.08v for the RAM, so your 2.1v is actually around 2.18v.

Use 2.02v or lower; should be more than enough for your PSC-based RAM (which doesn't need lots of voltage).

Make sure tRFC [Row Refresh Cycle Time] is set loose; try at least 55+

 

[Gillbot]

Are your voltages manually set or are they on "Auto"? Also, check your ram and other components. Everyone is quick to blame the chip when memory can also cause much grief.

 

[LxMxFxD4]

Originally posted by: Gillbot
Are your voltages manually set or are they on "Auto"? Also, check your ram and other components. Everyone is quick to blame the chip when memory can also cause much grief.

There is so much to quote from everyone, and thanks for all your replies. Sadly, I've been at work for the past 10 hours. Heh.

Tonight I'll memtest 86 it and see if thats the issue. I've overclocked cpus since 1998 (celeron 366 @ 450, anyone remember?) and never ever had a bad cpu. I didn't think of the ram being a possible issue. Its at 2.1V because thats what GSkill told me to put it at.

I'll do the mem test at 2.02v overnight tonight.

As for the cooler - I did mount it on mobo while in case. I think I got in there but I'll do as someone suggested and take it all out again (sigh) and mount it on a static bag.

One other thing - I merely used the "silicone paste" that came with the cooler. In years past I used "artic silver 5" and I think I may have some of that somewhere in the bottom of a drawer somehwere from my last system build which used a Big Typhoon cooler. Would 3+ year old artic silver be better than the silcone paste that came wiht the S1283? Does thermal grease "expire?"

Thanks again guys!

 

[dguy6789]

Paste shouldn't be a problem. While some do perform better than others, none of them should perform poorly enough to cause a system to not pass prime at stock. I would just use the stuff that came with your heatsink. Old thermal paste separates and you have to mix it up and stuff to get it back to normal.

 

[LxMxFxD4]

Alright, so I figured out "the problem"

I took everything out of my case and inspected my heatsink. Indeed I did have it set in properly. I then wiped off the thermal silicone compound and realized this:

XIGMATEK cooler came with a piece of plastic "tape" stuck to the contact area of the HSF, I guess to ensure cleanliness prior to install.

Well - There was "gunk" that was left on the bottom after I had removed the tape - the adhesive, im guessing. I googled some reviews and found the silent PC review of the cooler and indeed, their pictures HAD NO RESIDUE. And no mention of any tape, either.

So, I just took it to my sink and used a new very lightweight scrub pad to get it off.. and it came back shiny. Applied new paste (that came with it) and...

New cpu temp at stock speed under full load after 10 mins @ 2.83ghz: 48C

So a drop of 15C I think is probably more like it.

How or why XIGMATEK did this is beyond stupid. But.. at least I figured out the problem

I'll reply to this post when I OC it to see if I get better results.

 

[error8]

Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: error8
Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

Not sure what isopropilyc alcohol is but traditionally people use Isopropyl alcohol (IPA). You can get it at any grocery/pharmacy store in the healthcare section. Usually they sell it in multiple grades (wt-% concentration of IPA to water) and will usually market it as rubbing alcohol. You want the stuff that is 90% IPA or higher (95 or 99% if you can find it without paying an arm and a leg for it).

 

[error8]

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: error8
Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

Not sure what isopropilyc alcohol is but traditionally people use Isopropyl alcohol (IPA).

That's the one I'm talking about, but I have another way ( wrong way ) of spelling it.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: error8

Originally posted by: Idontcare

Originally posted by: error8
Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

Not sure what isopropilyc alcohol is but traditionally people use Isopropyl alcohol (IPA).

That's the one I'm talking about, but I have another way ( wrong way ) of spelling it.

Isopropilyc alcohol exists, I just had never heard of it being used by enthusiasts for cleaning their TIM. By saying "not sure what it is" I meant as a chemist I am not sure what the chemical structure of isopropilyc looks like in comparison to IPA. Could be a funky new/better alcohol for all I know, provided it doesn't cost 10x more

 

[KingstonU]

Wow I've got practically the exact same system: XP Pro 32Bit SP3, Intel q9550 @ 2.83ghz, Asus P5Q Pro, 4GB 5-5-5-15 G.SKILL PC8000

I got the OCZ Vendetta 2 cooler and I am still having trouble with those stupid push pins. My idle temps are ~38'C . But one of those stupid pins fell out just the other day and brought my CPU to 99'C!!!! I also had some initial problems with the ram being undervolted so I manually set it to 2.0V and that stabilized the system. Sadly I haven't had time to try and push her yet, I want to fix the push-pins or try to get a bolt-thru kit.

I may even consider lapping the bottom of the vendetta since to the idea it doesn't look quite flat between the aluminum block and the copper heat pipes (same design as your xigmatek). Though i've never done it so am a bit wary.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Originally posted by: KingstonU
Wow I've got practically the exact same system: XP Pro 32Bit SP3, Intel q9550 @ 2.83ghz, Asus P5Q Pro, 4GB 5-5-5-15 G.SKILL PC8000

I got the OCZ Vendetta 2 cooler and I am still having trouble with those stupid push pins. My idle temps are ~38'C . But one of those stupid pins fell out just the other day and brought my CPU to 99'C!!!! I also had some initial problems with the ram being undervolted so I manually set it to 2.0V and that stabilized the system. Sadly I haven't had time to try and push her yet, I want to fix the push-pins or try to get a bolt-thru kit.

I may even consider lapping the bottom of the vendetta since to the idea it doesn't look quite flat between the aluminum block and the copper heat pipes (same design as your xigmatek). Though i've never done it so am a bit wary.

It's easy to get cavalier about small change in this hobby, and I'm no exception. I bought the Vendetta 2 before switching over to a Noctua NH-U12P. Since the Vendetta 2 is neck-and-neck with the TRUE -- maybe a tad better but not by more than 2C under load, it was a good choice.

YOu're probably OK to lap the Vendetta 2 -- just remember that you don't want to grind down the heatpipes enough to damage them. Also, I believe you can jettison the push-pins -- I HATED those things! -- and replace with an assembly used on coolers like the TR Ultima 90. It looks as though it could be made to work fine.

 

[LxMxFxD4]

Originally posted by: error8
Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

Heh. Alcohol in no way helped rid me of that gunk.

I did use "cotton swab" 70% Isopropyl prior to my first install. Again, no luck with adhesive residue.

I've installed PLENTY of aftermarket cpu coolers but none in the past 3 years or so. Perhaps this tape thing is standard within the past 3 years, i'm not sure.. but.. alcohol didn't do jack for cleaning off this gunk

 

[LxMxFxD4]

I came back to this thread to give an update though...

I did memtest86 and my memory at 400mhz passed with flying colors. 10 Passes of all default tests (10+ hours while at work).

I changed it to 480mhz though and immediately got corruption in warcraft in windows. So I think at least I'd have to mess with voltages to get my memory stable beyond 400mhz.. OR.. my PC8000 wont run past PC6400. Either way, im only *really* looking for a PC6400 O/C so i'm not unhappy so far.

An update on my O/C though:

@ 3.4ghz (400mhz x8.5) my q9550 (@ all stock voltages w/cpu at 1.2500v) locked up after about 3 hours of prime95 last night while I was asleep. Not sure the details, but monitor didn't turn on and checking the prime95 logs, last iteration that was logged (prior to lock up) had no errors. Not sure what to make of it.

System temps were ~65C at core0 which is acceptable with 1.25v in my opinion before I went to sleep, an hour into prim95.. so.. i'm kind of less than enthralled about raising my voltage past 1.25v as that'll increase my cpu temps, but I may have no other choice.

If someone has another suggestion for what may have caused the lock up though, i'm down for listening.. otherwise I guess it'll be a weekend of voltage iterations and long prime95 testing.

Thanks again all.. at least my memory isn't bad!

 

[n7]

Originally posted by: n7
Make sure tRFC [Row Refresh Cycle Time] is set loose; try at least 55+

Post me a screenie of MemSet @ 480: http://www.xtremesystems.org/f...showthread.php?t=92190

You must have tRFC loose to achieve higher speeds with 2x2 GB RAM, & while it could be something else, that's one of the first things to look at when increasing speeds w/ 2x2 GB kits.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
@ 3.4ghz (400mhz x8.5) my q9550 (@ all stock voltages w/cpu at 1.2500v) locked up after about 3 hours of prime95 last night while I was asleep. Not sure the details, but monitor didn't turn on and checking the prime95 logs, last iteration that was logged (prior to lock up) had no errors. Not sure what to make of it.

Usually computer lock/BSOD in prime95 is not a CPU/core stability thing but a memory/NB/MCH kind of a deal. When a CPU is unstable you usually just get an individual thread in prime95 die on you, not total system lock. In my experience anyways, unless of course you have massively unstable cpu at the clocks, which doesn't seem to be your case given the time it takes for this to crop up.

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
Heh. Alcohol in no way helped rid me of that gunk.

I did use "cotton swab" 70% Isopropyl prior to my first install. Again, no luck with adhesive residue.

I've installed PLENTY of aftermarket cpu coolers but none in the past 3 years or so. Perhaps this tape thing is standard within the past 3 years, i'm not sure.. but.. alcohol didn't do jack for cleaning off this gunk

You need to get out the dishsoap and SCRUB that crap off of there. It most definitly is not helping and you have to put some elbow grease into getting it off of there. Nothing you can do to the HSF surface will be worse than leaving that baked-on adhesive on the surface. Use HOT water to soften the adhesive, then lots of dishsoap. Use dishtowel or green scratchy pad stuff, not steel wool unless you also want to lap it at some point.

 

[LxMxFxD4]

Originally posted by: Idontcare
You need to get out the dishsoap and SCRUB that crap off of there. It most definitly is not helping and you have to put some elbow grease into getting it off of there. Nothing you can do to the HSF surface will be worse than leaving that baked-on adhesive on the surface. Use HOT water to soften the adhesive, then lots of dishsoap. Use dishtowel or green scratchy pad stuff, not steel wool unless you also want to lap it at some point.

Oh, a few posts up I posted that I did exactly as you suggested: Took it to the sink, and green scrubby padded that gunk right off. Caused my temps to drop 15C or more

Originally posted by: Idontcare
Usually computer lock/BSOD in prime95 is not a CPU/core stability thing but a memory/NB/MCH kind of a deal. When a CPU is unstable you usually just get an individual thread in prime95 die on you, not total system lock. In my experience anyways, unless of course you have massively unstable cpu at the clocks, which doesn't seem to be your case given the time it takes for this to crop up.

Yeah, I'm fairly sure my cpu is okay.. and mem test told me my memory is okay. So.. that leaves north bridge voltage. All the other voltages I left at "auto" on my P5Q, so it'll be a weekend of playing with those I guess.

 

[Idontcare]

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
Oh, a few posts up I posted that I did exactly as you suggested: Took it to the sink, and green scrubby padded that gunk right off. Caused my temps to drop 15C or more

doh! my bad for not seeing that before I posted. Glad to hear the result though, thats great!

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4
Yeah, I'm fairly sure my cpu is okay.. and mem test told me my memory is okay. So.. that leaves north bridge voltage. All the other voltages I left at "auto" on my P5Q, so it'll be a weekend of playing with those I guess.

Yeah you'll probably have more advices given regarding this part if you post in the mobo forum. There's quite a few options for tweaking in this regime of the hardware, FSB termination, CPU PLL, MCH, NB, etc. It may be something as simple as needing a little better cooling on your NB without changing anything in the BIOS.

 

[Martimus]

Originally posted by: LxMxFxD4

Originally posted by: error8
Usually when you install a heatsink, you clean both the cpu surface and the heatsink surface with isopropilyc alcohol, no matter how clean they look, so any residual "gunk" is taken away. You've learned this the hard way, but next time you'll know what to do.

Heh. Alcohol in no way helped rid me of that gunk.

I did use "cotton swab" 70% Isopropyl prior to my first install. Again, no luck with adhesive residue.

I've installed PLENTY of aftermarket cpu coolers but none in the past 3 years or so. Perhaps this tape thing is standard within the past 3 years, i'm not sure.. but.. alcohol didn't do jack for cleaning off this gunk

Yeah, that adhesive is pretty bad. Cotton balls would do nothing for that. I took it off with 5 minutes of scrubbing with 99% Isopropyl Alchohol and some paper towel, but something with better grit would have worked better. I do like the cooler, and the bracket so you don't need to use Push Pins is very sturdy. I will probably use another one when I build a computer for myself in the Spring (I used this cooler - S1283 - for my roommates computer.)